Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums GT Research Reason for GT denial

My son scored 139 in NNAT, whereas the benchmark score in second grade GT is 132.He had also got many "O"'s in his report card and he is also a good artist and his art is also been published in newspaper. Apart from this there are many other qualities to be considered for GT.

But we have received a letter stating he is not selected for GT. There is no proper reason mentioned. Will anyone let me know how they grade gifted talent? How should I proceed?

There is no standard from one state to another or even from one district to another. You will probably have to contact the district office to find out why your son was not accepted.

I think you have to look at the program and see what kind of students they are trying to service. I did a quick search of NNAT and the Wikipedia article was not positive. I know many places use it. It's a non-verbal test so if you have a highly verbal kid, it might not be a true reflective of his abilities. Given that he was above the cutoff, I would at least ask why he was denied.

139 is actually a very high score for the NNAT. I believe it above the 99%. The NNAT ceilings out at 150 and anything above 140 is considered in the "ceiling zone". We use it in our district and I've talked to lots of people on the NNAT. I've heard about it testing kids low, but never high. The people I know who've done further tested have only had HIGHER results. Of course that's not a scientific survey, but just an observation I've had in the past year.

Anyway - I would definitely follow up with the school! Find out why exactly he was denied. In our school district, you wouldn't only have access to GT services, you may even have grounds to ask for services above and beyond the standard ones. We live in an urban district and have a pretty liberal GT definition.

What does the GT program do for you? In our district, in 1 - 3 grade, it means 1 1/2 hours a week of pullout from the classroom. They are "studying" Ancient China. It really seems more like an arts and crafts day where they make things relating to China (Wall, Bamboo hats) and they watch movies and read books about China. It's all well and good, but, in my opinion, it's not something for which it would be worth fighting. Think about why you want him identified as GT and if the program is not very good you might want to wait until he retests. Sometimes you have to pick your battles.

I also have a similar case. My daughter has scored 138 in NNAT and 128 in COGAT. Her work is also published in newspaper and she has got very good grade in her report card and from her teacher also. Even then they have refused GT.
They are suggesting me to take another test(psychological) in GMU,
which is optional to appeal for GT board. I do not understand why she should take this test, if she had surpassed the benchmark score already.

Even if they deny GT, why can't they give some proper explanation such as what factors they considered, what is she missing?
If they just say gifted skills why do they need a benchmark score to test the intelligence of kids rather than gifted skills alone?
Who is the responsible person to give me a proper figure as I strongly feel as a parent I should know more info about my kid?

Thanks for your response. But I do not understand what you mean by"Cheesy pullout"

And I do love cheese!

"Cheesy pullout", here's an example. 2 or 3 times a week(alternates), for 1 hour, GS8 goes to the pullout. They were supposed to build some model planes, but no funding. They never even asked if we parents would kick in $20 a piece. So, they've done some stuff with Roman Numerals & different Bases in math. That was a let down, but still OK. Now, here's the real cheesy part; they are measuring their room. GS8 is frustrated because he really doesn't want to use a 12" ruler to measure the room, then record the measurements. I think that's worse than 'drill & kill'. He'd rather sit in his regular classroom and read.

Oh yes, one more thing. He's in for the whole semester, or he's out. And if he opts out when it gets boring then he might not be allowed back in next year.

Vanilla is tasty, too! :P

...and for info about why so many of us are so much more in love with full-time GT programs and perhaps not so much the hour-or-two-a-week pull-out programs, you might want to take a look at this article. It's one of my two favorites for explaining why GT kids require services:

http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/harm.htm

(The other one I love is this one: http://www.stephanietolan.com/is_it_a_cheetah.htm )

I think by "pullout" means the students who are in school based GT(the ones not in regular GT) they can attend regular GT class for few hours in a week. But, I checked with my friends circle and they say it is not so effective like the regular GT class.

But, my only concern is that even though my kid is intelligent and talented enough deserve in GT, why is the denial without any proper explanation and facts.

I agree, you are owed an explanation. First of all, ask what the criteria are and then ask how your child failed to meet those criteria. Also, in many districts there is a way to appeal these decisions. Ask about the appeals process. You may be able to get them to change their minds.

Has anyone faced the same situation and applied for an appeal? I want to know how I should contact Central GT Team, Is there any particular person to meet? Should I have to take GMU test?
Will I get a proper answer from the central team? Please discuss your experience.

Dear parent, to my knowledge a score above 138 in the NNAT automatically qualifies a child into the GT curriculum. I very strongly feel that you should approach the concerned officials and get an explanation as to why your son was denied GT. Ask them what is the rubric with which they measure the Gifted Potential in a child ? Do press for a proper reasoning for the denial.

As our friend Dottie has said, with such good scores of 138 and 128, your child is a very strong cnadidate for the GT curriculum.

Dottie will have her own response but some pull-outs advance kids academically. Others just "give" kids work to do. Might be interesting work but it may be geared away from any core subject so they aren't advancing in areas in the traditional classroom.

It is part of the reason the state of ohio's ODE placed some mandates around gt services so that pull-out or other services didn't equate to a handful of worksheets. Again, Dottie will have her own answer.... but sometimes getting "in" the gt program doesn't pan out to be the saving grace some are hoping for.

Or maybe her school in located in the dairy belt and they study the various forms and textures of cheese :-P

If Parent1 is in Fairfax County (which it sounds like), the best bet is to approach the school's principal and ask to appeal the decision of the local screening committee. This is done through the local school's GT resource teacher:

http://www.fcps.edu/DIS/gt/faqsprocess.html
What are procedures for appealing an ineligibility decision?

Parent/guardians of students not selected for the GT center program may submit an appeal. Only parents or guardians may submit an appeal. Appeal information is contained in the ineligibility letter. Appeals must contain new information not contained in the original screening file. Parents/guardians of an FCPS student may obtain a copy of the screening file from the local school GT resource teacher. The new information along with the GT Center Appeal Form, available at www.fcps.edu/DIS/gt/forms.html, is submitted to the GT Programs coordinator according to the timeline.

How is the appeal decision made?

The new data is added to the original screening file for review by the appeals committee. The GT Programs office notifies the parents/guardians and the local school of the appeals committee decision by the end of July. The decision of the appeals committee is final.

Can ineligible students be screened again?

Yes, students found ineligible for the GT center may be considered for school-based gifted services at the local school. Parents/guardians of ineligible students may also refer their child for GT center screening the following year according to the published timeline.

Gifted Talented is not only based on the IQ of the child, it is also based on the grades. If the IQ is high but the grades are low, the people may think the child is not ready. A child can be perfectly average but as long as they have good grades and are not stupid, they are considered for Gifted Talented.

Services may also be based on your district's budget. I'm a GIS (Gifted Intervention Specialist) & there are about 1000 identified middle school students between 2 GISs. Needless to say, the 2 of us can't work with everyone, so our district uses criteria to narrow the pool to a more manageable number. The criteria are objective (not based on grades, recommendations, etc.) & quantitative(number of areas of ID based on nationally-normed assessments, etc.) to determine need (as best as we can). I know that not all kids test well, but this does help ensure gifted underachievers (who also can benefit from services) are on the same footing with teacher-pleasers. If anyone has the perfect formula for determining "need," please share!

There are still a LOT of cognitively identified kids in my district who don't receive formal gifted services. It stinks, but there just isn't the funding for it.

I can't stress talking to your student's classroom teachers enough! Most teachers really do want all their kids to learn--they just don't always have ideas for how to do it. Susan Winebrenner's book _Teaching Gifted Kids in the Regular Classroom_ is a resource that can help make it less overwhelming for classroom teachers. If the regular classroom teachers are on board, this can mean services for your student every day!

I am not in fairfax county, but read the info on their system because a friend is dealing with them.
Apparently the cutoff is a moving target, based on the scores of the group for the year. So one year your kid could be totally in and another year, totally not 'eligible'. Seems a bit harsh, but I guess they have a set number of slots. Still, with a score in the 99%ile I would imagine it would be hard to fall below the cutoff in any year. ????

I think I also read that retesting can be done every single year if a parent asks.

GISDeb, what you describe sounds similar. I imagine you are doing the best you can with what you've got, but it's still a sad state of affairs.