Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy can a PG kid stay in public school & get needs met

Hi,

So I had DS tested with WISC IV. Turns out that he falls in the PG range. Is it possible to keep a PG kid in a public school and for his needs to be met there?

Totally depends on the kid and the school. I don't think my dd classifies as PG, but she does have dys scores, and public school works for her. It worked for PG kids I know at the excellent public school I attended. Did not work for my PG SIL--she went to boarding school for high school. (I think that still didn't really meet her needs).

Yes, a highly flexible public school can work, but you're pretty much going to need EVERY accommodation/differentiation tool in the arsenal, and probably right up to the edge of what seems possible.

As long as you have a school that is focused on "what does this student need" and not "we do X, and Y, and sometimes Z, but never A," then it is possible.

It's not going to be perfect, in all likelihood. The one advantage that public school has over private is that they are more accustomed (via special ed) to feeling that the student NEED drives the arrangement, not that you have to choose from their a la carte menu, and take it or leave it.

I agree with the other responders. I have twins with DYS qualifying scores in a public middle school - I would describe them as hg and hg+, respectively, but not pg. Our schools have had strengths and weaknesses thus far, but it is working out okay. The twins were extreme outliers at their elementary school, but the school had a lot of flexibility and a "special-needs-R-us" mindset, which, although not developed for gifted kids, worked to our advantage. Their middle school could probably be characterized as one of the strongest publics academically in our state, but still leaves a lot to be desired. A strength is that it is a big school, with some good extracurricular programs we've taken advantage of. We've also supplemented with online courses through NUMATS (ds is starting a computer programming course this week), and we are about to try out the local community college (dd is enrolled in a continuing ed. digital art course to start in April).

I totally agree that it depends on both the kid and the school. For our kids, who love the "schoolness" of school, the social aspects far outweigh the academic limitations. As parents, it helps that our kids will be able to take Honors Algebra 2 at the middle school as 8th graders, although not all subjects are that strong.

There is a gifted private school in our town, and although we could afford it, the public schools have not been SO bad that we've been compelled to do so. The privates are generally pretty small, which we see as a negative - in part due to having twins (more kids makes it easier for them to develop their own social circles, independent of one another). I also worry about an atmosphere of privilege at a private that would make us uncomfortable. Lastly, we know of families who are frustrated with private schools that nominally cater to advanced learners. I'd be annoyed to spend all that money AND have my kids needs not met.

Thanks for all the feedback. My son is definitely a very social creature. He's got the leadership thing going on too, so he really needs to be around other kids.

Although it may have been possible for some public schools to teach some PG children at their appropriate academic challenge level or zone of proximal development (ZPD) and in the company of intellectual peers... with the full implementation of Common Core standards in recent years... and the enforcement through data collection, including the evaluations of teachers and the ratings/rankings of schools according to their closing of achievement gaps... many families find that the closing of those gaps is often achieved by capping the growth of students at the top.

Unless a gifted child also has a disability, many families may find that the needs of their gifted children are better met in learning environments other than government schools.

Seeing my 4yo post a few posts up in this thread, I can't pass this up without responding. It may be that public schools do not work for many families, but my twins are now rising 12th graders with 12 years of public schools behind them, and although there are things about their hs I would like to change, they have received an excellent education and are well prepared for the next step. Their hs is large so there is a good size cohort of academic peers, there are some excellent extracurriculars (competing well at the national level), and they have had *some* amazing teachers. The dual enrollment program has allowed both to take university courses (CS, math and physics), at the district's expense, and those courses also count toward their high school graduation requirements. My advice is to not rule out public schools out of hand - although I am quite certain that some are truly bad, in some cases the complaints I've heard from other parents are out of proportion to the reality in the school.

I would not, personally, discount the authentic lived experiences shared by other parents, regarding how well their children's educational needs were met.

Of course, each situation is unique, and many factors come into play. I was just saying that in our own experience, the neighborhood public school provided a stimulating environment for a couple of kids who are extreme academic outliers. Maybe it is a fluke that it seems to have worked out (or maybe our kids' needs have not been met, and I am too clueless to recognize that!). I do think there are many in my own community who rejected the public schools before really giving them a chance. If we had made our own decisions about school selection based only on what we heard from other parents, we probably would not have sent our kids to the public schools either. But we went ahead with the ps and often our impressions were quite different (in a positive direction) from the rumors we had heard. Maybe we've just been lucky, but I am feeling extremely grateful right now for what the schools have done for our kids.

LOL, if your post only spoke of your own experience, I would not have quoted you as discounting other parents' complaints as being out of proportion to the reality of the school. There is not ONE reality; There is YOUR reality based on your family's experience... and there is THEIR reality, based on their families' experiences.

Exactly! And if we had used the experiences of others as our only guide, we may have missed out on what is probably the *best* option for our family in our community.

LOL, there is a vast difference between "using the experiences of others as our only guide" (which no one asked you to do) and discrediting others' authentic lived experiences if/when they do not match your own, by stating that they are "out of proportion to the reality in the school."

For future readers of this thread, here is a brief roundup of a few related discussions on public school experiences:
- Our local public high school (May 2015)
- Success Stories of HG+ in Pubic Schools? (March 2014)
- Public or private school? (Nov 2013)
- How do you feel about the public school system? (Oct 2013)

Here are some posts with expert resources on "school fit" including choosing a school, and advocacy.

Our experiences are similar to yours, amylou. It must be the Twin Syndrome! I totally agree that it is prudent not to take other parents' opinions as gospel and be open-minded and make an informed first-hand decision. Of course it is always helpful to consider a range of input from others, but ultimately each kid/family/school/extracurricular combo may yield a different outcome.

I have a pair of boy/girl twins who are incoming freshmen with nine years of public school experience. They are both in the DYS program although I don't use the PG label. I think it is important to point out that short of excellent private tutors for each subject, you likely won't get a consistent good fit; however, you may get a good enough fit that may well be the "best" available option.

Some factors that has helped in our situation include GT programming, magnet programming, single subject accelerations, stronger than statistically predicted cohorts, large schools, highly rated schools, early (dual) college admission program, great extracurricular opportunities, online supplements, educated parents, auto-didactic kids, and competitions/contests.

If you mean, the typical local school district, then in my experience, no. There are other types of specialized programs such as gifted schools or charter schools that are also considered public that may sometimes be a better fit.

I don't think schools are a great fit for anyone. I also think fit at high school in particular is more about personality and extra curricular interests. My brother did well - he is extroverted and loved drama and was OK at sports. I was introverted,severly asthmatic and depressed so not a good fit.

It will vary by child, family situation, grade, school, teachers, and political climate in education.

In our case, no.

This is what I think too. Our public schools offer one or two years of acceleration in core subjects. But, there are overachieving PG kids there - because of the environment in my general neighborhood (plentiful resources in the area, DE/CC, motivated parents, PG peer groups, industry mentoring for STEM subjects) as well as tutoring/afterschooling etc.

In our case, we do not use the PS. Things were not hard enough for my child to put forth a meaningful effort in order to learn and he was developing a poor work ethic as a result. How my child was spending his days from 8:00 AM-3:00 PM began to matter to him at a very young age.

This was our case too - it was DS at 3.5 asking us to take him out of daycare/preschool and either stay home or change environments where he was not so bored.

It is definitely going to be dependent on your family, your school district and what is important to you and your children - family values vs what is taught in school, what is offered for acceleration, and the administration of the local school.

Wishing your DS a happier school year.

If it's their reality then that's ok but sometimes it's not reality but opinions, passed along social networks, based on only the skimpiest of details of what's really going on.

One's opinion would be based on their perspective or life experience... whether or not they are choosing to share details with a particular audience, such as on the internet.

To the degree that some find other individual's input to be helpful, people will continue to request, post, seek out, and read such stuff... even if it is boiled down to a simple numerical rating (1 to 5 stars) or a binary (thumbs up / thumbs down) type of opinion.

Readers decide how much they will be influenced by such input, and can so do without bashing or discrediting the input.