Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional 2E with Asperger's - grade skip again or not?

DS has Asperger's and is highly gifted, especially in math and science. He entered school early so he is in 4th grade at age 8/9. He goes to elementary school part time and middle school part time. He is learning Algebra and 6th grade science in middle school; when he goes back to elementary school, he does 5th grade LA by himself with an aid, and 4th grade specials (music, recess, lunch, computers, PE). The school district has been amazing at placing him into appropriate classrooms subject by subject, which has been great but because he is so all over the place (physically and learning levels), it is becoming increasingly difficult for schools to accommodate him. They're suggesting that DS should skip 5th grade and enter middle school at age 9/10. He will be doing 6th grade science, LA, and social studies, which everyone thinks is the right level for him. Then, he wouldn't have to bus back and forth, losing time to interact with other kids. That way, he will still be ahead of other 6th graders in math but he can stay together with high honors 7th graders (with whom he has been with now for 3 years in a row) for another couple years. they think DS will have a better chance of growing socially if he stays with his intellectual peers (even though they will be 2-3 years older). Also, if we don't do this now, by the time he enters middle school, he will have to be bussed to high school part time, and he will always be straddling two schools. So...I think this plan makes sense if he is not 2E. He has Asperger's and is probably 2 years BEHIND socially and emotionally. He doesn't really have friends wherever he goes. He does have a couple of friends his age who are neighborhood friends. I set up regulr playdates for them so I hope their friendships will continue no matter what schools and grades everyone ends up in next year.

We face this same decision every year but with middle school(and eventually puberty, yikes!!!) approaching, this year's decision making process is more stressful than usual. The middle school has promised a full time aid (who will not hover over him so he doesn't stand out too much but will be there to help in case he needs help with finding the right classrooms, organizing his learning environment and taking notes, three things he has trouble with). They also promised to be flexible and move him back to the original plan of attending 5th grade primarily and busing to middle school for math and science if it becomes evident that that is the more appropriate fit for him.

If anyone has experienced something similar and has advice for me, please share. Thanks!!!

Wow, I'm impressed with the amazing accommodations your school will do! Where do you live so we can get into that district?
Sorry though that I have no real advice, or experience with your situation. But at least they are totally willing to work with you, so you can always try it, and change tracks if it is not working. Good luck!

We considered a grade skip for DS10 (Asperger's), and didn't do it. We have accelerated him in math, and are considering a significant science acceleration, but he will enter middle school as a regular young-for-grade 6th grader next year.

We have found that the 7th graders with whom he takes math (2-3 years ahead in age) are kind to him, but do not consider him a friend in any sense. He does contribute meaningfully to that class, and I think that it's been very good for him to have intellectual peers. At the same time, their topics of before-school and between-classes conversation are not always understandable to or appropriate to him (we have had to have discussions about why you cannot call girls "hot," for example). I'm glad he's still spending a lot of his time with age-peers for that reason.

We also battle DS's relatively young social skills in thinking about his placement-- he is now doing a lot of thinking about how he relates to other people, but he doesn't always see that being smarter than many doesn't necessarily make you socially successful. I don't want his academic acceleration ("I'm smarter than other people and years ahead in every subject") to be a foundation of his identity.

At the same time, there is no doubt that he behaves better, is happier, and is more tuned in when the material is at the right level (which is still rare for him).

There is no one easy answer for this.

DeeDee

I can't really give you advise about school, since you are ahead of us, but I would recommend finding a therapist that does group therapy with children his age. The group therapy my son's been going to has made a really huge difference with how he interacts with other kids!! He no longer comes home from school with stories about how kids won't play with him or how they bully him. Now he comes home with stories of the pokemon game they played, or the hero factory legos they want to swap. SO MUCH BETTER.

We're in Indiana. I don't think it's necessarily the school district. We're just really blessed with principals who are genuinely caring, think outside the box, and are excited about gifted kids.

DeeDee,
Does your son have age peers who are truly his friends? Does he seem lonely if he doesn't have friends? My DS does not want to have friends and it doesn't bother him that he doesn't talk to anyone during lunch and recess. That's one of the reasons why I feel like it's probably not a big loss if he ends up being surrounded by kids who are much older than him who probably will not consider him a friend either. DS will probably not be able to fit in wherever he goes, so maybe grade acceleration for academic purposes only is not so bad of a idea? Of course this could all change as he catches up socially. you said, "I don't want his academic acceleration ("I'm smarter than other people and years ahead in every subject") to be a foundation of his identity." I hope you don't take this the wrong way; I'm just really curious and maybe challenge your thinking a little bit to get a discussion going. Don't get defensive, OK? So, I deal with the same thought as you, but now I'm leaning more toward thinking I don't want DS to feel inferior socially and physically all the time (which could happen if I keep trying to throw him together with kids who are his age but intellectually different) and I certainly don't want that to be the foundation of his identity. Even if he ends up having to deal with tempering his arrogance later on, I'd rather have him feel confident knowing that at least he is good at something. I want his potential friends to look at him and think, "yeah, that kid is younger than I am and he is certainly no athlete, but boy, he is smart and we can talk about really cool stuff because he can follow the logic of the conversation and he knows a ton about things I'm interested in." What do you think?

epoh,
can you tell me a little bit more about what this group therapy is like? Is the therapist a psychologist? Does she take a certain approach (ABA, Floortime, peer medicated intervention, etc.)? How many kids are in the group and are the kids all on the autism spectrum and are they all your kid's age? How often do the kids get together? What exactly do they do (structured activities, free play, themed play)? Do you see him being friends with just the kids in the group or does he make friends more easily with other kids now? Thanks.

Yes and no. I would say he is tolerated by most age peers and liked by some. He is gregarious and wants to have friends; there are kids who genuinely like him and include him in some activities (invite him over, etc.), though I suspect that his social life is not as rich in invitations as other kids'. He doesn't have a best friend, never has had; but he's included often enough that he doesn't feel like an outsider.


Have you worked on social skills with him? Does he do okay in any group activities (clubs, scouts, lego league, etc.)?

We have considered the skill of participating a group hugely important for our DS; we did some group social skills work as well as quite a bit of practice through ABA therapy on the constituent skills of being a friend (being a good loser, encouraging others...). DS's school IEP goals include social communication. I would be bothered if he wasn't interacting at lunch; I would see it not so much as "he doesn't want to" as possibly "he doesn't have the skills to do it successfully, so he doesn't do it." But I don't know if that is true for your DS at all.


The thing I do not know is whether classroom friendships will translate into real out-of-school friendships. Certainly this is the age where kids start to be friends not because their moms are friends or they live on the same street, but based on shared interests. I am hoping that science club, math team, etc. will yield a group of real friends for DS. But I don't know yet whether it will work.

I also don't know how it will go when DS is in 7th and 8th grade, probably medium-to-shortish for his age, and going to the high school for math and maybe science, with kids who are much more mature physically and socially. I don't think that world will be a social success for him, though it may be academically exactly what he needs. Our thinking has been that the older kids don't really see him as a peer outside the classroom, and that will be worse for a while as the academic peers go through puberty and our DS isn't there yet.

DeeDee

junior - the group therapy is overseen by a LPC who specializes in Cognitive Behavior Therapy.

The group sessions take place with just the kids and the therapist, so I haven't watched them, but from listening it seems like they chat for a few minutes to start, and then he gives the kids some sort of challenge they have to complete together. Sometimes it's like a puzzle or brain teaser, sometimes it's imaginative/creative (thinking up a new product, for example). The therapist lets the kids direct how they handle the scenario/challenge, and basically just keeps them on task, redirects if necessary, and steps in if anyone's not behaving properly. Then when the kids have their 1 on 1 session each month they talk about what happens during the sessions and what the kids can work on. My son, for example, attempts to be the 'funny' one, in lieu of conversing with people.

He also talks to the kids at the end and asks them about what worked/what didn't, how their actions effected the group and the challenge, that sort of thing.

Amy, that therapy program sounds amazing and well designed!

DeeDee