Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy Stanford Binet V?

Hi, I'm new to the forum so I apologize if I'm posting a redundant topic.

My son is 5 and highly advanced academically. His kindergarten teacher has taught for 30+ years, K-5, including gifted children, and has made kindergarten her permanent grade and has received her masters in early childhood. She has assessed my child with the most advanced materials available to her and he has surpassed all of it. For example, they stopped with his reading/comprehension assessment at a level that equates to the end of 3rd grade. She says she has no doubt he can go beyond it, but she and the literacy coach just stopped there. Similar testing has been conducted for math skills as well, with the same results. They have modified his curriculum somewhat but his teacher says the modified coursework is "a waste of his time."
In all of her 30+ years experience, she says she has never seen a child this age able to accomplish and comprehend what my son can.

So my son will soon undergo a series of tests for early acceleration, starting with the Stanford-Binet V. I met with the school committee yesterday and am concerned that the school psychologist does not have much experience with highly advanced children. Also, when I read about the SB test, I find that the results may not be completely reliable. I thought this assessment would answer many questions for us, but before we even begin, it's already creating more.

Other tests in the series include the Woodcock Johnson tests of achievement, Vineland Adaptive Behavior Scales, and some other adaptive behavior tests that appear to be a collaborative system between the school and parents.

I guess I'm just interested in hearing about others' experiences with this type of assessment and if your results were helpful in determining the type of schooling your children need.

A red flag for me is when I expressed my desire to learn whether or not my child is an alternative learner, or special needs child, and I hoped these tests would give us that information, the psychologist could not understand what I was asking. Basically I want to know if the public education system is fine for him, or whether we need to explore other schooling options. They are very pro- keeping children within their age groups but I refuse to stifle my child's natural abilities.

Anyway, sorry to be so long-winded. I knew we would have this to face when he entered school but I had hoped this assessment would lead us in the right direction. Now I'm wondering if we're even giving the right assessment.

Thank you for reading and any feedback will be greatly appreciated.

AMDStreit,

My son was tested using the SB-5 recently. As I have posted earlier, his score was lower than the SB-4 score that he received four years earlier. This is apparently typical for both the new WISC-IV and the SB-5.

Our tester informed us that the gifted group norm average for the SB-5 was 123.7 and according to another parent on a seminar with the Davidson Institute, the gifted group norm average for the WISC-IV was also 123.something. The requirement to participate in the gifted norm group for the SB-5 was a previous I.Q. test with a minimum (emphasize MINIMUM according to his psychologist tester) full scale of 130. I assume it was also a requirement for the WISC gifted norm group.

According to another parent participant of the seminar, these tests were adjusted to counter the Flynn Effect. At the very least, your child may score lower than he would if he had taken one of the earlier tests. Be sure that your tester is aware of this probability.

P.S. if a teacher says (admits) that your child is the most advanced they have seen in 30+ years, you will need to find an alternate school than the lock step one he currently attends.

Good luck and welcome.

I think that you've just been given a lot of information regarding what type of educational placement your child needs. ((He had better have access to more than 3rd grade material, for a start. Got any places like that local to you? Were you planning to move anyway?)) Let us know if you want advice on liking what you are hearing. It isn't easy.


These are the tests you want to have. They may help you apply to the young scholar's program. They won't tell you much in the hands of the inexperienced tester, but if money is an issue, you may want to start with what the school offers. It's worth at least as much as you paid for it. Should you expect to get good info outside of the top 6 places in the US for the "wildly" gifted? No, that isn't going to happen. But for most of us, we couldn't quite tell that we needed to spend the money and time to travel to one of the top 6 places right away. If you have the money and the eyes-openness to recognise that you want answers and you want them now, then don't bother with the school and get back to us with some hints so we can advise you were those top places are.

Some of our young ones loved the testing experience. For other children it was draining or uncomfortable. This figures into the equation. For my son, DS10, taking the WICS IV at school was the highlight of the academic year last year. Yeah, we made some changes.




It sounds like you can "stomach" going straight to one of the Meccas. If not, let the school do the best they can. If you want advice about where to go, give us hints of where is doable geographically, and about you child. ((Are there hints of "other exceptionalities?"))

BTW - What have you read? Which experts "speak" to you? Have you read Deb Ruf's Losing our Minds, Gived children left behind? A Nation Decieved? The Spirited Child?

Warm Welcomes -
Trinity

Hi and welcome!
My 5 year old was tested using the SB-5, Woodcock-Johnson Tests of Achievement, out of level testing (they used the Comprehensive Test Program from ERB) and then scales for behavior and ADHD. We found the comprehensive testing very helpful, each assessment contributing to our overall understanding of our son's cognitive and behavioral strengths/weaknesses.

The psychologist who tested him using the SB-5 specialized in assessing gifted children. She said she could use either the SB-5 or the WPPSI on him, but I asked for the SB-5 because after he topped out on about 6 subtests of the Woodcock-Johnson Tests of Achievement, I was concerned he might do the same on the WPPSI (since it is designed for up to 6 years old). He did score lower than I had thought he would on the SB-5, but the psychologist felt that the verbal subtests "became too difficult too quickly" and that his verbal abilities were not as well developed since he had never attended formal school, just daycare. But the scores definitely reflected giftedness and she did a great job interpreting for us, stating that looking at the full scale IQ was not an accurate representation of his abilities.

The out of level testing helped, too. He took a test designed for second semester high achieving first graders, two years above his educational level at the time. I think that his performance on this test is what made the school agree to let him skip kindergarten. And the ADHD scales ruled out ADD/ADHD so that has helped to fend off complaints/concerns regarding his phsycial activity level and sometimes impulsive seeming behaviors!

Hope all that info helps you. I think it sound like they are doing a comprehensive assessment. Hope it answers some questions for you.
Again, welcome!

Thank you all for your thoughts! I'm embarrassed to admit I have not yet read any of the books Trinity mentioned...I have done a lot of web reading. Unfortunately, money is an issue so we're starting with the school district's resources. I feel sure we'll need to follow this up with an assessment by a professional experienced in working with gifted children, but for now this is our starting point.

I would LOVE a list of the Top 6, Trinity! I have identified a psychologist in Kentucky who specializes in child giftedness and we spoke briefly. I liked him and thought maybe we'd take our son to him (we're in South Carolina), but it would make much more sense to know for sure we're contacting the right professionals.

I have been wanting to read Genius Denied...I think I'll stop by the bookstore this morning and pick that up, along with one or some of the others recommended here.

Thank you all again. They are starting with the SB-V right after the holidays. The school psychologist told us point blank that her experience is with children who are behind academically so I just hope that her inexperience doesn't distort the test results...I realize these things are often only as reliable as the administrator/interpreter. It would be a shame to make decisions based on scores that are not an accurate reflection of his abilities. I guess we'll see in 3 weeks or so!

On another note, my son gets along GREATLY with his classmates. At home he seems to relate to the older children in the neighborhood better but at school he does great with his age peers. His teacher told me she thinks it's because he is highly adaptable but she recognizes that even on a social level, his social peers are likely a few years older.

Welcome AMD!

I read your post with great interest as I also have a 5 year old (she'll be 6 in January). We managed to do early entry to K, at age 4, so she is in first grade this year. Like you, we do not have the financial resources to choose private school at this time. We had to switch schools early in the year (within our same district) but luckily we now have a wonderful teacher who is doing the best she can to work with DD5 and keep her challenged.

Your post jumped out at me because of your son's teacher saying she'd never seen a child like him. Just before Christmas break, DD5's teacher told me the same thing. She said "I've had a few highly advanced children in my class before... but I've never seen a child like your daughter." It's hard to know how to feel about a statement like that!

As for your questions, I think you're wise to pursue testing through the school system but also seek outside resources. If you have any reservations about the results/interpretation of the school's testing, you can always do independent testing as a means of comparison.

You're very lucky to already have a K teacher who recognizes your son's giftedness and a school district that seems willing to provide accomodations. If possible, try to "hand-pick" your son's teacher for next year and talk to her ahead of time to be sure she understands the situation and will be supportive of what your son needs. Don't hesitate to ask exactly how she will accommodate your son so he will actually learn something new and not have a wasted year.

Best of luck to you, and keep posting so we know what happens!

GG

AMDStreit,
I wonder if it's
Edward R. Amend, Psy.D, Amend Psychological Services, Lexington (SB L-M)
phone: (859) 269-6465, e-mail dramend@amendpsych.com

You've spoken to in Kentucky. He's lead a Davidson Young Scholar online seminar and I was Very, Very impressed. I'm wondering how the testing will go, as the holidays are upon us. If you get into the YSProgram, you many be able to have the test results reinterpreted over the phone. That feature has been Amazingly helpful for my family.

Smiles,
Trinity

Trinity, yes! I had a conversation with Edward Amend. I contacted him via e-mail and he followed up with a phone call. At that point I was looking to have my son assessed during the holiday season (that just passed...hope everyone had a great one!) but now that the school is doing it I thought I'd wait for those results. But I was impressed with Edward Amend's credentials and couldn't find anyone in my state that I thought as much of....so if/when it comes down to it, it's very good to know he is reputable as well!

GG...thanks for your reply. Yes, upon hearing things like that from my son's teacher all I can do is get teary eyed...then tear into action. hehe. She has taught kindergarten through 5th grade and has taught gifted children so it really kind of knocked the wind out of me when she said that. Good luck with your daughter too...gosh, this is hard isn't it? I'm so glad I found this place!!....Which, by the way, I found because someone sent me a link after watching a Larry King special on gifted children one night. Unfortunately I missed the program.

Wow AMDStreit,
That's so reassuring. Good for you! I hope the school testing yeilds meaningful results. Even if your child tests in a way that doesn't get you into Davidson Young Scholars Program, he will still need lots and lots of educational individuation, so it's good that you have someone local to rely on.
I hope your son enjoys the testing process - mine always did!
Smiles,
Trin