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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 2,498
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Joined: Apr 2010
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CCN, interesting ride you're on there. My DS in KG: impulsive, odd sounding speech, chewing everything, spinning, falling out of his desk chair, lying on the floor during circle, day dreaming, fixating on things he was curious about, pathologically curious, pathologically (good word  ) friendly to a fault - had no fear of anyone and would leave with strangers, flight risk, inappropriate social responses, LOVES to run (can't "walk" either sits down or runs), intense, silly, excessively affectionate - loved to hug and climb onto people's laps, obsessed with taking things apart to see how they work (since 1 yr old), very tactile - MUST TOUCH EVERYTHING, very distractable (unless he was focused on something that interested him, played alone a lot (happily), also wanted to play with other kids but wasn't sure how, declined fidget toys because he was very self-conscious about being different. I could go on and on but I won't. Anyway, you get the idea. Some are classic spectrum things and some are not as much. This list is, to my mind, quite spectrumy. I'm surprised that the people you were working with didn't do the ADOS or other autism-specific tests. It's possible that he was too lovey/huggy and that didn't meet someone's stereotype of what autism is supposed to look like, or because he was smart they just didn't consider it. But with that collection of traits, I would consider it and want to get testing by an autism expert to rule it in or out definitively. There was a year when my DS fell out of every type of chair the elementary school owned... Now we recognize the language processing issues (likely always there), he daydreams excessively, gets emotional, still adores running!, fidgets & squirms, impulsive (but getting better), gets frustrated when he's trying to express himself verbally, gets frustrated when he knows something that others don't, intolerance for repetition, impatient, can be argumentative (i.e. too persistent), great sense of humour but has trouble recognizing the social cues of: "it's stopped being funny." Again I could go on, but you get the idea. Just like your DS he's changed dramatically but still has challenges. It sounds like he's dramatically easier now, which I would expect with maturation and good parenting-- but those challenges still sound frustrating. The intolerance for repetition, the sense that he goes on with something after everyone around him is sick of it-- those can be the inflexibility and perseveration that come with autism. But they might not be-- I do not know your kid. I'm just suggesting that what you described sounds very familiar to me... and might be worth another look from that point of view. DeeDee
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Joined: Sep 2011
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One last thought to add - re seeing signs of ASD in behaviors, seeing those things change over time, and feeling like things are resolved etc as time goes by. We kinda fell into a trap of not realizing how much *we* were compensating for our ds' quirks at home. Everything seemed normal and he seemed to be functioning really well - but once he was thrown into a situation that he couldn't handle, he imploded with anxiety. It wasn't until after he had his diagnoses and we'd learned a lot about what his challenges were that we realized we were subconsciously already accommodating at home as well as being convinced that his "normal" was the "normal" simply because we were around him and used to him. Um, "used to him" doesn't sound very loving and parental - just wanted to add that my children are the sunshine in my life and I love them all to the moon and back  polarbear
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 34
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intense, silly, excessively affectionate - loved to hug and climb onto people's laps We still have so much trouble with excessive affection from DS7. He hugs anyone and everyone. Including random men standing in front of us in line at the store, while sneaking one arm up and between their legs. Awkward. In a school context it's great, because even though he has social skill and communication problems, adults LOVE him. What's not to love about the jumping giggling cuddlebug that runs up and gives a tackle hug every day? And he just adores everyone, even if he has no idea how to have a conversation with them. But outside school it's not so great. And with other ASD kids it can be quite bad. One last thought to add - re seeing signs of ASD in behaviors, seeing those things change over time, and feeling like things are resolved etc as time goes by. We kinda fell into a trap of not realizing how much *we* were compensating for our ds' quirks at home. Everything seemed normal and he seemed to be functioning really well - but once he was thrown into a situation that he couldn't handle, he imploded with anxiety. It wasn't until after he had his diagnoses and we'd learned a lot about what his challenges were that we realized we were subconsciously already accommodating at home as well as being convinced that his "normal" was the "normal" simply because we were around him and used to him. How true.
Last edited by mgl; 09/09/12 12:34 PM.
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Joined: Jun 2012
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Speech therapy (once per week, outside of school) has been *the* one therapy that has helped my ds with his expressive language disorder. This is really good to know - thank you - I'm going to push for this service for DS again this year (the school reassess year by year so it's not scheduled for him yet for grade 3), plus I'll look into my husband's coverage to see if we can also do this outside of school. Most of his therapy has been directed toward just getting his thoughts out (verbally or written), organizing his thoughts, and developing his written expression (adding descriptive detail etc). My DS needs major help with this as well... He is the only kid like him that his speech therapist has ever worked with, and she's basically developed his therapy program as she's worked with him. That's great! She sounds awesome - flexible and adaptable. ...and second, he doesn't have any kind of apraxia (I think that is the term - for physical challenges with vocalization?). Yes, you're right. My friend's son was diagnosed with apraxia. My DS, like yours, doesn't have this either. He will tell you that he just doesn't "know what to say" - and it's not like a kid who has ideas but doesn't know exactly how to put it in words or who is afraid they won't say something correctly - it's like he literally is stumped by the request to come up with anything, like there's a huge void in his brain for that particular request. Yes!! My DS tries but gets overwhelmed when his ability to verbalize can't keep pace with the thoughts in his head, and then he'll say "oh never mind! It's just too hard to explain." He's a very concrete thinker - his struggles with expression first became apparent to *us* (parents) when he wasn't able to deal with open-ended writing assignments at school (started in 2nd grade). When he had writing assignments at home he would just melt in frustration and not be able to write even a simple sentence. My DS is very abstract, but reacts the same way as your DS. Open ended questions are too much for him because his ideas out pace his written/verbal expression. By the time he was in 4th grade he started telling us he had some of the same challenges with getting his thoughts and ideas out even when it was verbal conversation - that's when it finally dawned on me that maybe an SLP could help, and around the same time I read something about speech therapy for gifted kids who had disorder of written expression. I was lucky that the school was proactive and suggested speech language therapy in grade 2, which he qualified for because of his diagnosis. I'm sure you're thinking, um, why didn't we take him for speech therapy then, but we had no clue there was any kind of anything going on other than him being a quirky kid who didn't feel like talking. He seemed to be on-track developmentally in all his other areas, his dr was never concerned at well-kid checkups, and his receptive language was a-ok. Once he did start speaking everything was in long, complex sentences so for sure we thought everything was a-ok at that point - but the flip side of it is, he wasn't being asked to do the type of expressive output that he is challenged with until he was in 2nd grade at school - and then we chalked his initial lack of output and classroom behaviors to either being bored or being a perfectionist because by then we knew he was clearly a really high IQ kid. LOL oh, so similar. His older sister waiting until 24 months to talk, then was using sentences in a few weeks, so when DS didn't talk I wasn't worried. He was so social and responsive, happy, loved peek-a-boo, curious, alert, engaged, affectionate, etc etc that none of us were worried. In fact when he did start talking, he was able to make the "K" sound early (many kids substitute this with "T") ...AND he referred to himself in the first person (many kids start off referring to themselves in the third). People commented how advanced his speech was (when he was 2-3). Pffft. Ironic? The key has been his SLP - she cared tremendously about helping ds and was challenged (in a good way - she was interested) in finding a program that would help even though she hadn't worked with a child with his set of challenges before. The right person can make all the difference. That's awesome I wonder if there might be some clues in the testing he's had (WISC etc) that could help understand the sequencing challenge. Arrrgh... I want to keep answering/discussing, but DH & the kids need me... more later...
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Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 3,363
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CNN, one last thought - my ds has to use an iPad in school this year, and it has built-in voice-to-text that works *easily* and really well. It seems to help him feel more comfortable with his writing. I wish we'd had it when he was younger. It's not going to teach him how to get his thoughts out, but when he has something to say it works much better for him than either handwriting or keyboarding.
polarbear
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It's possible that he was too lovey/huggy and that didn't meet someone's stereotype of what autism is supposed to look like, or because he was smart they just didn't consider it. Honestly, I think that's what had me confused. I was certain he had sensory integration disorder though. Not so much anymore. It sounds like he's dramatically easier now, which I would expect with maturation and good parenting-- but those challenges still sound frustrating. The intolerance for repetition, the sense that he goes on with something after everyone around him is sick of it-- those can be the inflexibility and perseveration that come with autism. But they might not be-- I do not know your kid. I'm just suggesting that what you described sounds very familiar to me... and might be worth another look from that point of view. I think it's like an ongoing puzzle... with clues that keep changing. I don't think we'll settle on a definitive diagnosis for awhile. In his file at school the ADHD and E/R language disorders are listed as "provisional."
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Joined: Jun 2012
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We still have so much trouble with excessive affection from DS7. He hugs anyone and everyone. Including random men standing in front of us in line at the store, while sneaking one arm up and between their legs. Awkward. In a school context it's great, because even though he has social skill and communication problems, adults LOVE him. What's not to love about the jumping giggling cuddlebug that runs up and gives a tackle hug every day? And he just adores everyone, even if he has no idea how to have a conversation with them.
But outside school it's not so great. And with other ASD kids it can be quite bad. Oh my goodness... SAME HERE. It's like you've channeled me and written about my DS, lol. (Except for the "still" part... this has stopped, thank heavens). Now he's much more "socially optimal" in this respect.
Last edited by CCN; 09/09/12 01:03 PM.
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 978
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This would be my one concern in keeping my child in the program - the impact of having to compensate. Children with challenges are constantly having to cope with compensating in some way or another depending on the challenge. The impact seems (from what I've seen) to be the largest in early elementary. Yes... this is a concern I have as well. Grade 3 will be a make or break year, I think. At the beginning of grade two, it looked pretty bleak. However somewhere along the way the combination of aging, development and support started to make a difference. In June DS's grade 2 teacher showed me a three paragraph piece that DS had written, in French, about our trip to Disneyland. To say I was floored is a huge understatement. His French was very basic (below grade level), and there were a lot of spelling mistakes, but he did much of the work independently. His teacher was very impressed and encouraged. Yay!!! However... grade three gets much harder. The question is, will DS continue to grow and keep pace or will he become linguistically overwhelmed? We'll see, I guess.
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Joined: Sep 2010
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My son also does the circles or pacing while he is thinking. I would say he spends at least an hour a day doing that. I wonder what that is about? It keeps the mind moving. Why, yes, I do it too . And I can't be the only one -- I was thrilled when I read a novel where the hero briefly works with a brilliant mathematician, who brings sturdy shoes because she was promised an interesting problem and the long hallways she needs for her pacing.
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Joined: May 2012
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CNN, one last thought - my ds has to use an iPad in school this year, and it has built-in voice-to-text that works *easily* and really well. It seems to help him feel more comfortable with his writing. I wish we'd had it when he was younger. It's not going to teach him how to get his thoughts out, but when he has something to say it works much better for him than either handwriting or keyboarding.
polarbear Polarbear, where can I buy this, do you know? IS there s name or a link or something?
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