Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy Math acceleration advice needed.... (kind of long)

Hello!

It has been a while because we were frustrated of getting nowhere with the school. But now, we might have a tiny hope and would appreciate any BTDT recommendations and advices:

Quick background: DD7 (2nd grade) and DS6 (kindergarten) both started 6th grade EPGY math program this summer. In the last two years, we have attempted multiple meetings to ask for math acceleration only to be told various reasons that all equaled to "no." Recently, the district has a new GT coordinator who is trying to help us.

Currently, we are asking the school to allow our kids to use ALEKS in place of their regular math curriculum. The reasons are:
1) ALEKS will allow continuity of math education beyond elementary math. More than once we got the "But if your child finished 4th grade math in 2nd grade, what are we going to teach her?"
(2) ALEKS can generate quizzes and homework and track progress and align state mandated requirements. i.e. minimize extra work for the teacher.

However, the district's technology department is concerned about adding something new to the school server and also we are still waiting for the principle and teachers' responses.

Another option is for our kids to do Singapore Math workbook during math time. Pros: no technology is required and kids can pull it out anytime. Cons: material will be purely for review purposes because teachers don't have time to teach to one child; and the lack of ability to generate quizzes and homework.

(My kids have been bringing their 5th grade Singapore Math workbooks with them to school. Although initially we were hopeful that the teachers gave their permission to bring the books, we found that kids hardly did any because they are expected to do the regular work first. They also do not want to feel "different" and feels awkward when their peers ask them questions. We were told that at our school, kids just don�t spend that much time on math in K-2 because state math exam starts in 3rd grade.)

This is a rare opportunity and we really hope to get it right this time. Any advice on which method (online math or workbook) might work better as far as independent learning in a classroom? Which method will be easier/less work for the teachers? Any pros and cons that we should consider? Also, how do/did your schools determine the grades (mainly for the second grader)? And if using ALEKS at school, do parents have access to it from home?

Thanks!
Mag

Huh?

ALEKS is HOSTED. Its like google or online banking. No need for a server, just an internet connection.

I haven't tried it (we use Linux...) but wouldn't using the streaming plugin alleviate that concern?

For that matter, I wouldn't rely on ALEKS for teaching new stuff, TBH - it has explanations, but they're terrible. OTOH, it splits stuff up into such small bites that mathy kids will quite largely teach themselves.

Scuse me a moment.... AAAARRRRRRGGGGGHHHHH. There, I feel better now.

In reverse: once your child has an account that account will work from anywhere on the web, including home. You'll only have teacher access (e.g., the power to make it do a new assessment when you want) if you are the account holder or whatever they call it, basically if you're the one paying. We don't have grades so can't help there. Are you expecting the teacher to mark the work? If so, then online is easier since then they won't have to! An issue for us with online maths was that there were only one or two computers in the classroom and using them was a big treat; it wouldn't have worked to have DS use one every maths session, the others would have been green. OTOH online's more engaging for most kids and getting immediate feedback is very valuable. In P2 (roughly 1st grade) I used to print out ALEKS worksheets at home and sent them in (as a backstop in case his teacher didn't have anything suitable for him: once she got his measure he hardly used them and ALEKS became a home thing). I wouldn't make a plan to use ALEKS for years (although if it makes school happy to do so, let them ;-) because it does get boring after a while; I also think its structure is better suited to the elementary maths than the more advanced stuff.

Must go... I'm sure others will chime in too.

Oh, I wish you the best of luck in finding the right solution!

For 3 years, my son was pulled out for his own math program, but occasional scheduling problems would leave him in the classroom during the math period. During this time, he would sometimes participate, sometimes prepare for his math period or do problem solvers independently. A valuable thing we learned:

His classmates _did_ see him as different because he is so smart, but they all accepted him and respected him and appreciated that about him. This acceptance and appreciation helped reinforce his own acceptance of his differences.

My son had a similar experience. That is the class does see my son as different, (in 5th grade his math map score was 280), but his classmates are wonderful to him! When he leaves to attend other classes, his classmates are very supportive. I wish to applaud the teachers he has had over the years, (and indeed all teachers), who have made it point to emphasize how each student should be valued and respected for his/her individality. Godbless you teachers for your long hours that seemingly go unoticed and your committment to our future!

You might point out to the school that ALEKS is also set up to use with the RTI process (remediation/special ed), and if the school gets a school-wide license, it might really simplify things for teachers who need to provide additional support for kids who are behind the curve as well as providing a simple means for meeting the needs of students who are ahead.

The program pre-tests, post-tests, and provides basic explanations, freeing the teacher from "grunt work" tasks like grading papers, keeping separate records of differentiated assignments, creating worksheets, and acting as a "talking textbook" - things that aren't necessarily the best use of valuable teacher time.

If you want this resource for your kids, sell it to the school in terms of what it will do for the school and the teachers as well as for your children.

Hi Mag,
My DS7 is in 3rd this year. Our school put him in a 4th grade math class last year where he completed the curriculum and pretty much the 5th grade curriculum too. They also put him on a computer program that our school uses (called successmaker through pearson). They didn't start it for him until almost the end of last year. They let him do this some during the 4th grade math class when they were repeating stuff he already knew, and during morning work time. He has almost completed the program though because it only goes up to 8th grade so not sure what they are going to do in terms of computer programs. They also let him do Khan academy some last year, but now he just does it at home some. But those were nice programs because they were about 20 minute sessions and you can stop when you are done. It doesn't seem to take much work for the teacher because they can put it on when other kids are doing morning work or something else that our kids don't need to do.

So this year they put DS7 in a 5th grade class for math. We may change this as the year goes on because he already knows all the material. The problem is the school only goes up to 5th grade and they didn't want to send him to middle school this year. So for now he goes to the 5th grade class, and then they let him do the 7th grade math on the computer. In the last couple years I sent in singapore math books and some other challenge math things and they let him work on those when the computer wasn't working or when something else unexpected happened. He also is on the 5th grade math olympiad team so that challenges him some. It's not completely perfect, but we are pretty happy with it so far. The also didn't want to use EPGY or any of that other stuff I suggested, but they were willing to use a program they already had for kids at school. And when I bought the program from home, the did let him use it some at school...but the loading took too long for some reason. Anyhow, I would check if your district has a computer program they already use.

good luck!

On ALEKS' Download web page, it requires a "plug-in" for the school setting. (Although there is also the "streaming" plug-in for use in public library etc., it is not recommended.)

Thanks,
Mag

Everyone (principle, GT teacher, teachers, district GT coordinator) all agree that there is a need. For at least the last two years, "we meet each student's need with in class differentiation."

"Pushing for an advanced class, not just for your child, but for the top 20% of the class that is probably ready for more advanced material. Once you have some differentiation, the rest can come more easily."

That will be awesome! Several teachers have tried to talk to the district without much success. Last year, the first graders were ability-grouped for math classes. This year, they are "studying" this cohort of students to see if the ability grouping made any difference in kids math skills. (However, no more ability grouping this year.)

At one point, we were so excited that school had agreed to allow DD (DS was not in elementary school yet) to go to a higher grade level for math and reading. However, this was blocked by the previous district GT coordinator. Since then, the principle and teachers stated that this plan would not work due to schedule logistics.

Currently, there is a weekly pull-out enrichment program for 3rd and 4th graders. We have asked the teacher to see if she could pull DD for these classes. She said no.... and "what is DD going to learn later?"

"For example, in our public schools here, K teaches K math and 1st grade math. In first grade, they can start 2nd grade math. One teacher takes all the kids who are ready for advancement and another takes the grade level. The teacher who is teaching advanced can teach more of the optional parts of math too since the class is able to keep up."

You are very lucky to have this option at your school.

Thanks for sharing your experience!
Mag

Hello ColinsMum,

Thank you for your input with ALEKS... After reading your post, we read a few more reviews on ALEKS. It seems many other parents also recommend using it as more of a supplemental material (rather than primary teaching tool).

Either online or worksheets, we do not expect the teacher to review or grade any of the material. We are trying to find something that will cause no to minimum work for the teacher.

The school is already concerned that offering this differentiation in class will cause enough headaches for the teacher and principle. (How come so-and-so got to use the computer for math all the time? How come so-and-so got to do something different? How could my kid get the same treatment? Sad, but a very realistic reason the school has mentioned as their hesitation to offer individualized differentiation.)

Thank you also for the virtual scream....

Mag