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    Joined: Jul 2011
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    It seems to me that a laptop with a decent sized hard drive could be loaded with enough educational software to cover everything form pre-k through high school. Text, Games, videos, practice, evaluation and tracking software. The software could identify what type of learner the student was, and suggest content that would be the most beneficial. No internet access would be required, but of course, the laptop itself would have to be cared for. Perhaps updates could be downloaded when the internet could be reached.

    Just because the content was stored on the hard drive, doesn't mean that instructions couldn't be given for building things or working with manipulatives.

    If something like that could be created without tremendous costs, then it could benefit children who don't have their needs met at school anywhere, for whatever reason.

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    Originally Posted by epoh
    Kids are going to graduate from school this year, having basically zero understanding of how the modern computer works. Not just a few kids, the vast majority of them. The same will happen next year. These kids know how to txt and upload youtube videos, but they have no idea what function a transistor plays in any of their equipment. They have no idea what the major components are of a PC. How can we be allowing an entire generation to grow up ignorant of so much what they touch on a regular basis?

    Just because most of us drive cars doesn't mean we have be able to build them or design them. Often times an engineer is just someone who makes science accessible to those that aren't technologically inclined. If we've done our jobs well, we've eliminated the need for knowledge of absolutely everything that isn't critical.

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    No need for educational software with Web 2.0 and open sources. That's the whole point! The stuff you're suggesting already exists online for FREE and there's no need for updates or downloads either. That's the old way and obsolete.

    http://web20guru.wikispaces.com/Web+2.0+Resources - An example.

    Open source means that open, free, accessible, for all - i.e. not propriety system or subject to a fee. Try searching through some livebinders.com folders to see what mean, as another example. There's stuff freely available from preschool to college, but teachers and libraries are not always knowledgeable about Web 2.0 (of course, many schools have cut librarians due to the Internet and thinking Google will suffice; not to mention the amount of teachers and librarians who like being in control and the leader).

    There's no need to pay for educational material, including a textbook. You still have to pay for the Internet though. Oh, wait, where wifi is free? The public library!

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    Originally Posted by DAD22
    Just because most of us drive cars doesn't mean we have be able to build them or design them. Often times an engineer is just someone who makes science accessible to those that aren't technologically inclined. If we've done our jobs well, we've eliminated the need for knowledge of absolutely everything that isn't critical.

    Indeed. For the Baby Boomer generation, it was a critical survival skill to be able to perform all general auto maintenance procedures yourself... everything from changing fluids to rebuilding a carburetor. Everyone either had to learn to do these things themselves, or collaborate with friends and family to get them done. Cars broke down all the time, and having a mechanic do it for you all the time was not generally an option.

    These days, advances in auto engineering have made some of these processes less necessary, and others of them less accessible to those without specialized tools and training. As a result, these are no longer necessary everyday skills.

    For Generation X, the critical skills are around electronics, specifically the abilities to manage your own PCs (hardware and software), set up and manage home networks, etc. These things are ubiquitous and require regular attention at least as often as '60's muscle-cars did, so again you either need to be able to do these things yourself, or get friends/family to help out on a regular basis.

    Nobody knows yet what the critical skills will be for our little ones, but I'd say a lot of the current skill set is already headed for obsolescence, because as miniaturization continues in the computer industry, the idea of building and upgrading your own desktop system is going to fade away.

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    Quote
    I guess what I'm saying is twofold:

    -- a computer is no substitute for alternate methods of real-world discovery, but it can become so preferred as a tool that it's easy to discard the others entirely (which is a costly mistake in the long run),

    and perhaps more importantly,

    -- we as parents may have trouble placing controls on usage because our kids have the skills to do things to work around them, but not the maturity to know why they shouldn't.

    I really, really agree with this. And since I have a daughter who is obsessed with being older and being treated as an adult, your second point is particularly relevant.

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    Originally Posted by cdfox
    No need for educational software with Web 2.0 and open sources. That's the whole point! The stuff you're suggesting already exists online for FREE and there's no need for updates or downloads either. That's the old way and obsolete.

    Not everyone has internet access, and browsing the web with the same device means it needs to be protected with antivirus, etc. Where kids are concerned, you're opening yourself up for extra complexity, responsibility, and cost. I'm picturing a device that accommodates the student's learning style and progress with minimal parent and teacher involvement.

    Many pieces that could fit into the software package I'm picturing have been created, but to my knowledge, they've never been brought together and managed appropriately. The Khan academy does nothing to cater to different types of learners (afaik). I'd also like to see games that can be tailored to the individual student's preferences, so if one student wants to practice money management at a virtual clothing store, and another wants a virtual hardware store, they just select a different skin for the same game, and they are both more interested in what they're doing as a result.

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    Much of what you're suggesting already exists online in Web 2.0. One problem is finding these sources. If you dig and dig and dig or use the precise keyword search terms, you will find it. Another problem is using Google to retrieving systems.

    A teacher is supposed to cater to a child's learning ability. That's kind of why teachers take those education classes - to learn about multiple intelligences and how to appeal to different learners. I'm not saying they practice it. Some do. Many do not and keep to the drill/kill, rote memorization route (dead and obsolete way).

    There's a lot more than Khan Academy online, but that's the one many people are familiar with. Know Watch Learn (http://watchknowlearn.org/default.aspx) is a non-profit organization that hasn't gotten nearly as much notice as Khan.

    There's tons of educational videos and virtual stuff (games, activities, virtual clothing store, etc.), but again unless you know where to look you won't necessarily find it; of course I'm guessing that you're motivated to find it and have the time, patience, and effort to do it.

    Yes, it's true not everyone has Internet access. That's one of the goals to Creative Commons - http://creativecommons.org/education. Public libraries provide free Internet access through our taxes. And, in the Western world, the percentage of people with Internet access is high, though this doesn't mean that they know how to fully utilize it most efficiently and effectively.

    Yes, it's true the Internet differs from television in one glaring respect. With television, the US Government has some control through the FCC over profanity and inappropriate content. But, it does not have as much control over cable television stations or pay-for-view stations.

    As responsible parents, we monitor our children's television viewing. At an early age, we introduce our children to Sesame Street and encourage appropriate television viewing habits (ie. place limits on time and usage).

    With television, there's appropriate stations and there's inappropriate stations. Do we place locks on our televisions or do we use our common sense and try to steer children appropriately?

    Children learn with television to make good or bad decisions; they'll learn and have to learn with the Internet as well. I see that as part of a parent's job.

    A lot of what you're asking has to do with control and trust. It's about thinking of the Internet from an adult's perspective and not from a child's. If a child is on e-learning and playing games, they can get a certificate when they finish to prove they completed it and not been on some inappropriate site.

    Children, today, are going to grow up in a world with less governmental control, but look how much is allowed on television today than what was allowed 20-40 years ago. I'm not saying it's good or bad, but that's the reality today.

    Look, teens are always going to find inappropriate stuff whether it's online or not. If you get a child engaged in learning, then they're less likely to get into trouble. Plenty of research to point this out.

    If you want to let you children stay on commercial, fee-paying, propriety systems, that's your choice. But what I'm saying is that there's another entirely different world out there with Web 2.0. There is a non-commercial, FREE, open source one as well.

    The Internet can be for commerce and adults, but it can be a wonderful world for children and for positive social change and action.

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    Sounds great. What is web 2.0. Is it a web browser?


    Youth lives by personality, age lives by calculation. -- Aristotle on a calendar
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    Originally Posted by La Texican
    Sounds great. What is web 2.0. Is it a web browser?

    No. Please see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Web_2.0 .



    "To see what is in front of one's nose needs a constant struggle." - George Orwell
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    No, there isn't a Web 2.0 browser at the moment; probably because private industry wants to steer people to commerce and advertising revenue than free, public, open source material. That's part of the problem from my perspective.

    Web 2.0 tools are both private (propriety-system like Second Life) or public (open source like Open Sims) and available on the Internet. The Open Source movement is trying to make knowledge free and accessible to all, but remember there are copyright issues and dissemination issues with the Internet.

    Who controls how information is disseminated or retrieved or consumed - you or Google? Who enters the search terms? Is it easier to click on wikipedia or worthwhile to try Googling for other ways to find what you're looking for?

    There's a global open source movement. Global digital literacy skills are long overdue. Other countries have already made global digital literacy and citizenship a priority. Unesco, the UN, etc. have online sources, if interested.

    Facebook is a social networking Web 2.0 tool that most people are familiar with. But there's also many non-commercial, free, open source Web 2.0 tools that are not getting the coverage or knowledge about them disseminated.

    If you are motivated, savvy and have the time, energy, and patience, you can retrieve open source Web 2.0 tools. Google free educational math games instead of just math games and you'll see the difference. That's one method.

    Another method is to look at Web 2.0 sources like by entering (notice Creative Commons sponsored this wiki):
    http://web20guru.wikispaces.com/Web+2.0+Resources

    Or from Web 2.0 lists by typing in Top 100 Web 2.0 tools for students/teachers:
    http://edudemic.com/2011/11/best-web-tools/
    http://www.onlinedegree.net/100-essential-2-0-tools-for-teachers/

    Or look at what others are doing on sites like www.livebinders.com

    Years ago, in the dark ages of print, we were taught basic research and library skills; in many ways it's no different with the Internet.

    Perhaps everyone thinks Google will suffice and we don't have to stop and think and question (especially our sources) and use common sense any more???

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