I've moaned extensively on the 2E board so won't go into too many particulars here on DS and his struggles.

Thinking about doing one year (ostensibly eighth)* of homeschool to allow DS13 to relax and detox a little. DS is a classical autodidact (if that is a thing).

He enjoys:
composing music electronically
video-editing
sports (watching, reading, discussing--not playing)
politics
history/current events
creative writing
comedy

He is good at math and will do it without much fuss, but doesn't love it.

He doesn't like anything "academic." <---translation: other people's ideas about what he should be doing.

He games a little but not obsessively. I haven't allowed RPGs for him and won't until he's older. I mention this because my biggest hesitation is that DS might spend an entire year doing nothing but screens. He mostly uses screens productively, so my feelings are mixed.

If he took a year off of public school, what are the most important traditional subjects he needs to keep practicing so he doesn't end up with a skill gap in high school?

I'm thinking math, online, is the only super important one. He reads constantly, writes on his own, and is usually doing something productive on non-school time, if he's not exhausted.

I'm also thinking maybe a coding course. He has taught himself some code, but only in response to needing a Minecraft server to do something he needed. Nothing formal. Where is a good place to start learning code for a young teen?

He says he could see himself doing something music/tech related for a living, but I wouldn't even know what to call that, in terms of what formal education would lead in that direction.

Am I missing important things?

*He will technically not be missing a year of school, because he will have completed the MS curriculum this year, and will have banked some HS credits, as well. So this is a relatively low-risk experiment.

DD started with the Youth Digital class on Minecraft mods, and then took the AoPS Introduction to Programming (Python) class. I agree that coding would be a good subject to introduce if you are homeschooling, especially if he's interested in ultimately doing "something music/tech related" - even without knowing what that might be, I bet it will involve coding.

When you say "no RPGs," are you including the pencil-and-paper sit-around-a-table-and-roll-dice variety? Because those might actually be good for providing a structure for interacting with others and "experimenting" socially in a lower-stakes environment.

No, I was using that loosely. I'm talking about games like World of Warcraft, League of Legends, etc. I have seen too many adolescents become totally addicted to these can easily imagine DS in that situation.

That's a great idea about IRL gaming. He has never played D & D, for instance but might enjoy that. He has liked Pokemon and Magic at certain intervals, too. I'm fine with that sort of game. There are a few local groups, too.

I'll look at the AoPS class. I think he would definitely need some formal instruction. He likes to teach himself, but he has a low frustration tolerance when things become difficult.

DD really enjoyed the AoPS class, any only needed a little bit of prodding to persist through the hard bits. She is going to her second session of a D&D group on Friday, and she loves it.

The only other thing that I think may be missing from your list is PE. If he's going to be home all day every day, I think you're justified in insisting that he move his body regularly in some way.

IF your DS is an autodidact then he may excel with homeschooling and gain a lot of confidence. I think the issue with math, particularly, as kids get older is not losing the momentum with the standard math curriculum (algebra, geometry, algebra II, pre-cal, cal, etc.) while not boring the child to death with rote and kill. There are tons of online math programs, math textbooks or curriculum which don't tend to deviate too much from what is covered in the public schools so you shouldn't have too much difficulty in that area. The trick is finding something that will work for your ds.

On the other hand, homeschooling offers a child a lot of time to pursue other aspects and/or delve deeper, broader into various subjects. It would be a good time to go beyond computational math and the standard math curriculum if there is an interest or something that piques his curiosity. Again, there are tons of stuff online or around, if you look.

Homeschooling can be an ideal environment for those 2e kids who like to be in the driver's seat with their education and prefers teaching themselves.

I would encourage you to look at some MOOCs (udacity, coursera, canvas network are pitched to a more general audience than edX and others; udacity is particularly good for coding, I think). There's Khan which some kids like; others are not so keen on. But really you could also just grab a bunch of textbooks and see what sticks and then works rather than going online.

I've met a number of parents who decided to homeschool a child for a year or two. I've heard that it's more beneficial than anything detrimental. Also, better for a child to find their passion and future interests now than shelling out the big bucks for a college with a child without any direction, I say.

I've been homeschooling my ds10 who is 2e for 4 yrs now. Some days are better than others; and I admit that I've had my share of very bad days with homeschooling where I want to put ds under a bus. Overall, however, it's still the least-worst scenario.

How are your finances? I don't know what finished middle school equals for maths but if he has done algebra he could maybe do some of the AOPS courses that go outside what seems to be the US maths sequence. If you have the money there are heaps of optilons. If you don't you need to be more creative. I would require something from maths, science, writing and PE plus reveiw if he has been doing a language. The don't have to all be every day or even concurrent just keep the momentum.

For a variety of answers to this question which may help you and your son craft a personalized plan for the next year's educational and experiential journey, you may wish to check some of these resources:
1) Common Core Standards for 8th grade and for high school
2) Gifted Homeschoolers Forum (GHF)
3) What High Schools Don't Tell You
4) What Colleges Don't Tell You
5) Youth's Highest Honor
6) Taking an out-of-grade-level test, such as taking the ACT or SAT early (through a regional talent search or signing up directly through College Board)

In some places, volunteer "service hours" are increasingly becoming a requirement for high school graduation.

Additionally this upcoming year could be seen as an opportunity to become more well-rounded or pointy.

This may be a great time for him to begin researching. One resource is the Occupational Outlook Handbook, provided free online by the U.S. Department of Labor, Bureau of Labor Statistics.

He may wish to consider entering contests/competitions, for fun, feedback, and possibly earning awards/credentials.

Although his academic accomplishments may presently be 1 year ahead, some may say that if the EF skills are not addressed and improved over the next year, and if he becomes too comfortable doing as he pleases without setting clear goals and making measurable progress toward them, the risk of him not completing high school may be great.

Document, document, document. This may include reading lists, goals & accomplishments, service hours, contests/competitions, etc. You may also wish to keep a printed record of your State's current home school laws to refer to in case they change.

Thanks for all of the encouragement! This made me LOL. If it's any consolation, you'd probably want to put him under a bus some days, even if he was going to school.

I'll check out all of the resources you mentioned. I think DS would feel so much better if he didn't spend so many hours in an environment that is over/under stimulating at the the same time. Then I could see what he is actually capable of doing.


Resources are limited, but could probably pull off a couple of virtual classes. He is supposed to do geometry next year. I am math illiterate so this is the subject that worries me most. He is good at algebra and I have no idea if he will struggle with geometry (I did, but I think I'm LD in spatial relations--not sure about DS). He does have an older brother who would help if he has trouble with geometry. I also asked his current math teacher--who has been a blessing all year--if she could tutor him next year, if we take this option, and she said she'd be happy to do that.

He was supposed to do this through Duke in December, but was too overwhelmed by finals and so I didn't have him go. I do think ACT scores would be helpful for us to see how he compares and possibly help his self-esteem, which is wrecked.

This is something he wants to do, anyway, this summer. I have a plan for the family to do some service this summer (although not for hours)--we could document that, even though that's not the point.
I think pointy might be the right direction for DS. He is academically well-rounded (as far as being grade level, etc.) but he will never be a mainstream, shiny apple student. It's not in his nature to conform (understatement).

This is what I worry about. Not the dropout thing, exactly, because I wouldn't allow that to happen, but just general misery at school for the next five years. His life skills are behind schedule, but he's made a lot of progress this year in hygiene, self-care, etc. I have this idealistic notion that if I weren't spending so much time wrangling him into doing schoolwork, it would open up some space for learning basic self-care, household chores, etc. That might increase his feelings of self-efficacy and improve EF in a non-academic way. Right now he just doesn't have the energy for much of anything.

Really, if he doesn't have stable mental health, the EF isn't going to develop positively, is my thinking. My concept of homeschool for eighth grade is an extended mental health day. For all of us.

Excellent that he wants to volunteer. The Congressional Award for American Youth is a great way to acknowledge a kid's unsung accomplishments. Prior to volunteering, your sons may want to register with a mentor and establish goals. Then document the hours and activities. It is amazing how the efforts can add up... and lead to goals in new directions.

From a cost-reduction perspective, keep in mind that AoPS books are very clearly written and easy to follow, and its on-line community is extremely active and free to join. For a kid who is a natural autodidact anyway, he may do great with the books and on-line access, without needing the actual (quite expensive) on-line courses to keep him moving along. If he has questions, other kids and monitors on the AoPS forum could probably help a ton, even if he doesn't have direct access to a teacher via a specific course. Or he could do one class as a formal course (I'd tend towards the coding, personally), build some comfort and a network, and then do others on his own.

I would expect by now it should even be possible to find some AoPS books in used form.

Awesome you are doing this, eco! I think you and your DS will both benefit greatly. Good for you for being brave enough to try a new path. (And for what it's worth, I suspect there is a vast range of emerging careers out there based on electronic music composition. Though my old-school mind can't conceive of them, I think my DS is busy inventing a few. The intersection with coding could be particularly cool.)

Well, it sounds like you'll be in good shape and on a 'good' track. I've had to deal with the EF aspects since homeschooling ds10 as well -- but it's definitely more doable when your ds is in a better mental state than in school AND with some time, patience, and maturity. I definitely can relate to having a child who is not in any way or shape conformist, but I think you'll find homeschooling will mesh more for your ds and, if not, there's always the possibility of returning to school again (earlier if necessary too).

There are some freely available study skills courses online (some may retrieved under 'how to study' or 'time management'). Those may help. There's the book - Smart, But Scattered, and plenty on pinterest to help too.

I was geometric phobic in hs and was apprehensive to homeschool ds due to the math. However, I did try out Education Portal's hs geometry (now study.com) for free when it was in beta mode for an education blog on online learning and it was completely different (in a positive way) to what had been taught in hs; and I'm not recommending that particular website but just emphasizing that there are different ways of teaching and learning geometry and to what can be done in a classroom vs. with homeschooling. So between a tutor and what you can find around online and elsewhere, you should be ok .

I mean this to be funny, but it may not be (except to slightly hysterical me).

Talking to DS about the AoPS Python class, and he responds: Um, no, I don't want to learn PYTHON, it is outdated and nobody uses it any more. [I have no expertise so no idea if he has any clue about this.] So, DS, what language do people use? He says, C++ and he "already knows a little about it." Whatever, DS. See? Has to be his idea or no-thank-you. I told him it could be useful for learning the lingo, so will wait and see if that idea percolates into something nonresistant.

As an aside that belongs on a different thread: he has one class in which it's impossible to know what's going on (multiple writing pieces, each goes through a conference/draft process, all due the last day) that he claims to be caught up--so I ask teacher via email if she can confirm--no response. That was last week.

This week, he has multiple projects and presentations along with finals in all of his classes NEXT week and he can't remember when his presentation for the aforementioned class is scheduled (and it's not in planner), so I email, yesterday, and say "DS can't remember when his presentation is scheduled, will you let me know, please?" I received a response today: "He scheduled it for a day, he will need to check in class today." I think that teacher doesn't want me to ask these questions, would you agree?

He writes no due dates in the planner and I guess my check-in email is supposed to communicate nothing? I guess she really doesn't recognize that DS can't remember to do these things without support. I try to support him but it's such a damned if you don't, damned if you do situation.

I can't wait until May 19!

On electronic music: there is already a range of careers, some of which are not so obvious.

At the most conventional, and well-established, end of the range, there is the whole category of music production and engineering (live and studio) in the ordinary sense of music.

Then there are all the people who do sound design for other media: film, video games, apps, etc. This includes musical elements and foley.

Some individuals are actually making a living in part or in whole by designing and selling ringtones.

If he is interested in careers in these areas, he may enjoy browsing some of the industry publications, like Mix magazine or Electronic Musician.

I program for a living so I'll mention this in case it helps your case - most of learning to program is learning all of the various constructs (variables, arrays, pointers (if applicable), data management, functions/tasks, if/elsif, case, loops, etc). The first language I learned was useless to have on a resume but it was enough of a foundation that I could quickly learn the syntax of the ones I needed to. I've worked in about 10 languages based on that foundation. Language fads come and go and languages have different strengths/uses so it is pretty rare that people learn just one and spend their whole career just doing only that.

I looked at the AoPS programming courses and their second one is OOP Python. I unfortunately don't know enough about Python to know how similar/different it is but I've done C++ and 3 other object oriented languages for work and the better your foundation is the faster you can pick the new ones up. If he wants to be a C++ guru then having a solid OOP platform will go a long ways. If AoPS does programming half as well as it does Math then I think it would be a great start.

C++ predates Python by about six years, FYI. Python is a much better language to learn to program in, in my opinion. And saying that "nobody uses it any more" is a gross overexaggeration at best. Plus, frankly, the opinion of a child who doesn't even know how to code yet on which language to choose is not an opinion to be given much weight.

I was very impressed with the AoPS beginning programming course from watching my daughter take it. I do think it would have been equally impressive in C++ or in Python, and the language used is not nearly as important as the concepts taught.

Even though I'm just reading this on the internet and not experiencing it directly in real life, the teacher's non-informative response, which seemed to reiterate normal classroom procedure rather than providing any support required by the 504 for your son to access his education, made my blood pressure rise and my adrenaline run.

In general, you may wish to refer to the 504 in each communication with the school. You may even wish to lead with it. For example, "I'm checking his planner, which does not seem to be up to date. As outlined on the 504, assignments are to be listed in the planner, yet I do not see the scheduled date for his presentation listed in the planner. Would you please ensure this presentation date gets written in his planner?"

Rather than posing your inquiries apologetically, as though you are asking for a personal favor, this wording keeps the onus on them, and holds them accountable to follow through and deliver on what they agreed to when crafting his 504.

You may also wish to keep the teacher's replies in mind when crafting any future IEP/504, in order to close any potential loopholes.

Thanks for weighing in, chay!

I know, was just illustrating what I'm up against! It's difficult when it's a subject I know nothing about, and DS knows just enough to be ridiculous. I think he feels so burned right now about anything "formal" that he immediately opposes me. Maybe. Or maybe he is just kind of a know-it-all-13-year-old.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking, too. I think maybe she has forgotten he has a 504 or doesn't believe he has a disability, at all.

The loophole thing in the 504 drives me crazy. I can't think of every possible way it can go wrong, until it does. Then I sound adversarial in the meeting, asking for more clarification.

The thing is--the teachers seem to either be very supportive/communicative or not at all. It's interesting that the worst about supporting him are the ones who are specifically his "gifted" teachers, while the high school teachers are much more skilled. It makes me wonder if they've been given some directive to treat him/me/us this way, by the program coordinator.

Now I have two of my dearest friends, with slightly older children who have been through this program, suggesting that I:

--Raise heck via attorney about the 504 problems and refused evaluation.
--Encourage DS to hang in there, because the program is considerably more enjoyable in eighth grade. And easier, because they aren't compacting two years into one in two core subjects.

One of these friends, whose younger child is same grade as DS, is also unimpressed by the teacher who hasn't graded anything (the same teacher who refuses to communicate real information with me via email). I guess teacher is finally grading some papers and friend's DS went from a D- to an A, yesterday. My DS' work remains unrecorded and I have no idea if he's turned in his work. He says that he has, but he is frequently...wrong.

DS refused school (via anxiety meltdown) yesterday, but he is caught up on his work (as far as I know) and plans to attend today.

We may be in a holding pattern. I haven't yet decided whether or not this decision (home vs. school) should be left to DS or I should make it for him. Any thoughts about that?

Assuming he isn't booted next week--he would be off academic probation next year, so the pressure would be somewhat less.