We're going through a tough period with DD due to this and that and...middle school and intensity and gifted girl and boys and her quirky brain and....ergh. I don't really need to post about it specifically because it's not something I need to problem-solve as much as just get through, but it's hard, and I'm exhausted. One reason I come here is because I know that many of you know how it is to live with the intensity of these kids. I thought maybe it could be helpful to have a general support/vent/"me too"/"I feel you"/this too shall pass thread for everyone. One could simply come here and bash one's virtual head on the keyboard if need be. Like so.

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Just an idea. Post if inspired.

Good idea!

Bedtime struggles. Almost every night for the last four or five years. That is all.

My DS had a horrible time in middle school. The local public school wasn't working out because of the rigid curriculum, some bad teachers, being rigorous for the wrong reason, social cliques, etc. It was a very hard time for him. I never saw him so discouraged about school and about losing himself. Then we decided to transfer him to another school. After visiting a whole bunch of schools, each having its own issues, he picked a private GT school. This place was a feel-good place where there was social harmony at least on the surface, but the level of academics was so incredibly low that it was depressing for DS because he knew that the school was not preparing the kids for academic success. (Eventually he took matters in his own hand and did a lot of self study, and came to high school in very good shape academically.)

It was a few years of frustration, despair and sadness watching a wonderful kid going through a dark time. In hindsight, I would probably not move him to the private school. I would instead use that money to hire college students as tutors and mentors so that DS could interact daily with people who were more mature both socially and intellectually, and who have gone through middle school and have become wise about this trying time,

Love this, UM, and need it today!

I do feel for you- and yep, that intensity! Ugh. I recognize my DD in so many of your posts, and do relate. Middle school was definitely tough, though I will say I love and am very proud of the girl that emerged at the end.

We are currently in a rough spot in a few classes- the worst, at least for me to deal with, is AP world history. In our school, there really isn't much of a choice in history classes, the honors section is frankly low-level. Most of the kids DD considers peers take AP, so that's were she ended up, fully knowing the course is a test-prep fest.

She is having a hard time hiding her frustration with the required busy work and lack of real critical thinking. The other day, after a class in which kids were required to write an essay in 45 minutes citing and discussing 13 primary source documents, she became irate and walked out when the teacher tried to talk to her. She was later publicly chastised for "not wanting to challenge herself"- which is a real laugh if you actually know DD. Despite this, she has a 100 average in the class, because she has nailed the formulaic expectations and knows exactly what the teacher looks for when grading- it is a farce, she knows it, and now the teacher is defensive and angry with her. I'm not sure she can hold it in until June. The alternative is dropping down to honors level, and listening to her rants about the low level of teaching and class discussion (though I guess I am hearing those anyway, so maybe we should consider it...)

Thanks for listening, and hang in there!

"it is a farce, she knows it"--Yes, we have this happening in one class right now, and the anger is real.

DS8 is so intense that he does every single activity that he wants to do to a very high level. He has been into certain sports, music and chess since he was 4 and he is now at a really high level for his chronological age in all of them. We have a lot of asynchronous development going on as well. Add that to a double grade skip, other activities like after school clubs, orchestras, competitions etc., he is beginning to feel pressure for the first time in his life. And he is unable to keep juggling and looking like he is under control of everything. He is the kid to whom everything came easily - he used to have meltdowns if we asked him to slow down or drop something from his schedule and declare that he knows that he could handle it and be awesome at it. We let him continue if he wanted to. He has come to a standstill in most of what he does - including academic progress because the complexity of everything has jumped up and he is unable to handle it all. He is slowly learning that he is not Superman and has human limitations and this week dropped a sport in which he was advanced and had played for 4 evenings a week for more than 4 years. He is thinking of dropping one of his after school clubs as well. In a way, it is good that he is learning the lesson that overextending oneself will lead to burn outs. I am also secretly glad that I am not the bad guy who made him stop activities that he was good at.
But, it is sad to watch a kid good at something drop it after years of hard work because he has no time to devote to it any more. I am going to take him to a local lego event that he will enjoy to make up for his disappointment at himself. Don't know how to deal with an intense child even after all these years.
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DYS 11 is going through a very rough period of time. There has not been a relaxed weekend for a couple of months due to little things escalating into a meltdown situation. We are adjusting our way of communication so we have mutual respect but it is so hard to do when you are disappointed, stressed and sometime angry. I am sure for him, as well.

Hanging in there, hopefully it will get better.

sorry to hear, we did also have this, more my husband butting heads with my dd. Turns out in our case she has adhd making the bedtime ritual that should be independent by now a real time-suck if we don't hound her (2 hour to get to bed!). We are all working on it and have seen some improvement (down to about 45 mins, lol). When I go to bed: 7 minutes and I'm under the covers.

34 on the ACT (for the 3rd time since age 12) Fs and Ds academically. Banging virtual head on the virtual keyboard. {_|_{}+*_{^}><_{},^£ I like that as a concept to put in to practice.

Also adding to the list: Getting home work assignments done days ahead but forget to turn in frequently. It's hard to him to get good grades due to missing and late homework and more importantly, he is just not motivated by grades at all.
Trying to set up a system to help him but DS responds negatively to any form of help!

The positive side is the quality of his work has improved tremendously partly due to more challenging materials and great teachers. He is in the same class with average 14 year olds.

I like this banging on the keyboard idea. Dd12 is currently struggling to fit in socially. She wants to play sports and has no interest in texting, talking about "crushes", etc. She is feeling abandoned and angry with some of her girl friends who have moved swiftly into adolescence and now are "boring." Dd spends lots of time at recess reading by herself. She is great at sports and I hope she can continue pouring her energy into them, but socially things are difficult right now.

Spaghetti, I can relate to that experience where teachers promise xyz is going to happen in later years and then when you get there you are let down. And we got the line about my child being too enthusiastic about learning too. Really??

We have had very rough past couple months and I am thinking there may be bullying going on at school. I am not using that term lightly, either. Very sad..

I'm so sorry. That's awful and heartbreaking.

These poor kids! Middle school is hard enough...

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Can I just leave that there?

So sorry you and your daughter are going through this. I'm beyond baffled that todays schools that turn down eager kids!

We got called in to talk to the music teacher because my DS7 is not listening in class and sighs and rolls his eyes sometimes when the teacher is teaching something. She thought he didn't appreciate music, but in fact, he's been learning piano for more than 2 years and is a talented if not gifted player. We finally showed the teacher the video from his latest recital. (By the way, that performance landed him one of the five spots to take a master class with the principal keyboardist at CSO. The other kids are 10 - 12.) The teacher was so surprised that she went speechless for a moment.

The sighing and rolling eyes are not respectful so we did talk to DS about it and ask him not to do that in class. I hope, however, the music teacher now realizes why he's behaving that way - he is just bored out of his mind in music class.

Ah, feeling like banging my head against the keyboard too. I got called to pick up DS4 from school yesterday because he tripped and fell head-first into the toilet (OT consult still pending...). Luckily, his face/head hit water and he was not injured, but he was extremely embarrassed. He has been so positive about school lately and he was crying about going in today. I think this has also set him back with regards to his issues about water on his face. SIGH. Never a dull moment.

Oh, poor baby! I totally feel for him, but maybe someday you can laugh about it.

My sister broke her nose falling against the toilet when she was very young, and yes, it is the kind of story that gets better over time (though maybe you should ask my sister...). It is brought up almost as frequently as the time she got a huge bruise on her forehead from walking into a parking meter.

Hope he puts it behind him and feels better soon.

Hi all - love this thread!

Ocelot - I feel for your DS! Mine is constantly coming home with bruises on his arms and legs, which he can't remember how he got them. One time, he burned his finger sticking it into the hand dryer.

Can I vent here about DS8's report card? Just received mid-term report yesterday - quite a hodgepodge. I'd like to mark it up with red ink and send it back to them!

Some background- DS is in French immersion, so he has 2 main teachers - one for English and one for French. He English teacher gets him - she's a former gifted teacher and has done her best to accommodate his DCD/dyspraxia as well as give him extra challenges in class. His French teacher - not so much. She warned me last time I spoke to her that he would have not so great marks on the 'learning skills' portion of the report card (these are things like Collaboration, Organization, Self-regulation, and so on - they don't give A, B, C's, but "Excellent, Good, Satisfactory, Needs Improvement").

She has reported to me that he is distracted in class, wanders around, and doesn't complete his work. So I was expecting some 'S's or 'N's, but not the volume of negative comments!

Comments in the learning skills area are in 2 parts - Strengths, and Next Steps (to improve). I started reading the 'strengths' section and there were very few positive comments, other than in the 'collaboration' area. The other areas were comments like "Needs to learn how to not be distracted" "Sometimes hands in homework without constant prompting by teacher", "Occasionally uses the word wall to check his incomplete work". Grrrr. How is that a positive comment?

Also, on the academic side, he did really well in math, pretty good in (English) language, and less well in anything taught in French. He got a C- in 'health' because he apparently doesn't understand fire safety rules and had trouble making an anti-bullying poster (which he had to draw)- HUH????

It's not because he doesn't understand or 'get' the French - when he reads or speaks it at home he does awesome. And last year he did well in French and really got along with the teacher.

I will need to calm down before I call his French teacher - deep breaths....

It drains me that DS6 cannot go through any aspect of life without doing it with an astounding level of intensity - he wants to play games EXACTLY according to his own rules, he is ALWAYS talking and never stops to take bite or get dressed or get ready for bed unless we prompt him about 10 times per bite or item of clothing, we can't correct him with his homework AT ALL, he gets impatient if we stop reading them a book even if it's for a nanosecond, he refuses to play with any child unless HE has decided he wants to play with them, he will not take no for an answer when he HAS decided, he is MORTIFIED if I speak in a "cute voice" (according to him) in front of other kids because it embarrasses him, and so on, and so on, and so on. It's amazing that no aspect of life is so mundane that he wouldn't be intense about it.

Does this resonate with anyone? I am mentally exhausted before I even leave the house for work in the morning, and sometimes I really resent him for it.

Don't think that this goes away in college, either.

Struggling to convey to DD that, OH YES, you do in fact still need to attend class even when the professor is someone you have zero respect for-- even when (maybe especially when??) the professor is someone who takes over a week to return a voice or e-mail messages, and when that professor's office hours overlap entirely with a class in one's major... even when the class in question seems to be a complete JOKE...


Grrrr.

Yes.

I keep thinking no one else's kids can be this exhausting. I don't know where THEY get the energy from. They must drain it right out of us.

Thought I'd give an update after my rant earlier this week. I actually had a good (long) meeting with DS8's French teacher, as well as the school resource teacher (who writes the IEPs). French teacher explained that DS wanders around the class, talks to his friends (distracting them), refuses to speak in French, sings in class then denies he is singing, refuses to work on offered extensions (or does them in English).

It sounds like she was really trying hard to engage him (as well as accommodate his DCD), but not having a lot of luck.

They were really pushing us to explore the full gifted program (which he is eligible for, but doesn't want to go to). They are speculating that he's not engaged because his mind is going faster than he can provide output in French. They wanted to know if I had suggestions on how to engage him in the class. The teacher did say that his class is having a hard time in general speaking in French - it's not just him, but they sense he doesn't want to be there.

DS has told us (me and DH) that he enjoys learning French - and there is no doubt he can do it - he as a beautiful French accent and picks up vocabulary quickly. Language (verbal anyway) is a real strength for him. Last year he did fine in French (had trouble with the English teacher, but that's another story). My suspicion - it's mostly perfectionism and he feels uncomfortable making mistakes when speaking in French. But this is something he's going to have to learn to deal with - in FI, or not - no?

Unfortunately, I have not very many ideas for making him do things he doesn't want to - we have the same problem at home!

I did give them a few ideas, which they are going to try: we sent in a pair of noise-cancelling ear muffs - thinking it may help to reduce distractions and also be a physical reminder that he is supposed to be on task (he is very sensory and seems to like the pressure on his ears); the teacher will offer him breaks to go get a drink of water or walk in the hall when he needs to get up and move around (he has trouble sitting still long). THey are going to work on having him use voice recognition so that he doesn't have to always print his work (which is very slow).

So, we'll see - teacher reported today that he did better the last few days with the ear muffs working. We'll have to see if it continues after the March break (next week).

We didn't even have time to get into how to deal with his organization and EF issues, but they were really, really happy to hear we are considering having him do a private psycho-ed assessment, to see if there are any issues we are missing.

Yes, it certainly feels that way!!

Hugs... I know that my biggest complaint with DS although it doesn't seem quite so extreme. DS17 has gotten better in many many way but his grades still don't show his full potential. And English.. yikes the kid needs to PASS English and that means turning in all the little stupid pieces of homework and not just the tests & large writing assignments.

I long ago gave up attempting to correct homework. DD11 does her homework and I don't even look any more. It's her work, the teacher will correct it (or not!), and she doesn't learn from me pointing out mistakes - she just gets mad!

I still 'help' DS8 with with homework, but it's mostly prompting him to do it (or scribing when necessary).

It's great that your DS's teacher is proactively trying to help him in spite of how she might have appeared to have been dealing with it from her comments on the report card.

Our DS6's teacher warned me in advance that his report card wouldn't be great. She explained that she has to mark based on output and that his output is not reflective of his cognitive abilities. He hasn't been tested yet but she is quite convinced that he is gifted. It really helped that she warned me in advance, because his report card is rather average and not what I would have expected from him.

The problem is, DS6's homework is mostly reading at this point and he has to do it with someone. It's very painful sitting there if he's struggling with a word - I can't correct him because he'll get mad at me. But if it takes too long, he'll get mad at everyone. If only reading were one of his strengths! But alas, then the problem would lie elsewhere...

Oh that must be frustrating! We've had reading struggles too, and part of the problem is, he's tired in the evening when he has to do it. It's not the best part of his day.

I honestly wish teachers would get rid of homework - at least in grade 1 and 2. I just don't see the value - it's either too easy (and then just busywork), or something he struggles with, and sometimes - just can't do it at the end of the day.

Yes, DS's French teacher said the same - even if she 'knows' he understands everything, she has to mark on the work he's done. But, they are trying, and I now understand a lot better what is happening in class - so that's a positive.

I must admit to a certain naivety when DS was first identified gifted by the school board. I figured - well school should be easy then! So not true!

I think from a previous thread you said you are having your DS tested soon? Hopefully it will give you some answers as to what is going on, and things the teachers can do to make school work better for him.

I actually thought that witnessing giftedness (if he is indeed gifted, since he hasn't been tested yet) would be fun, but it can certainly be a lot of work.

Yes, hopefully we'll get some answers that will help. DS is interesting though - sometimes, just when we're at our wits' end with him, a switch seems to go off and he behaves really well and seems so well adjusted. I wonder if others have had that experience. It's almost like he has "behaviour waves". We're in a good wave right now, fingers crossed that it lasts a while!

DS7 told me this yesterday:

I don't like so-and-so because he doesn't teach me how to be good.

After over a year of reading social stories, he still doesn't "get" how to behave appropriately. Sigh...

DD13 is really having a tough time with girl drama. She doesn't understand it and gets extremely frustrated with the shallow nature of her "friends," particularly when they aren't loyal to each other or to her. Add in her emotional intensity and it's a recipe for some craziness. This too shall pass...

We attended a music concert for kids on the weekend and DS6 kept scowling at and making comments to a little girl sitting behind him who was being pretty disruptive.

It dawned on me that this is probably how he behaves with other kids all the time. If that's the case, he is going to have a tough time with friendships! We've tried to remind him that he can be the disruptive one when he's bored with something, we've also pointed it out to him when it's happening, and we've reminded him that he needs to be more patient with others (because he his being rude to others and his friendships could suffer otherwise). But nothing seems to sink in.

I realize that this is probably related to his intensity and potential/likely OEs, but I'm at a loss as to what to do about it. Any ideas?

My DD5 has a few issues too.

A few weeks ago, a boy at an event was being disruptive. When he and his mother who was clearly upset with her son left during the intermission, my DD had a very snarky expression on her face and I firmly told her that I was disappointed with her and she needed to think about why she did what she did. In retrospect, I overreacted a little bit but I was not happy that she would put another child down behind his back.

My solution has been to get her to spend more time with a friend is a wonderful model for social skills (not competitive, not bossy, asks interesting questions, thoughtful, etc. She really is an amazing 6 year old girl). After each playdate, I talk about how happy I am about their friendship and discuss details. I'm not sure how much of it is sinking in but I'm looking forward to the girls spending more time over summer.

It's so hard not to get frustrated with them sometimes, isn't it?!

This morning, DS6 was devastated and completely messed up the morning routine because a plant had died. Only it wasn't just a regular plant, it was a weed that he'd found at the park and decided to transplant in our garden because he loved it so much.

Here are some of the comments he made: “Fuzzy Junior has died, I’m so sad. I made him a burial chamber. I know daddy says he’s just a weed, but I don’t care.” “Even when he’s dirt, I’ll always remember and love him.” “I don’t want to transplant another fuzzy, because what if she dies too?” “Can we get a seed instead?”

He cried and snuggled me for an extra 20 minutes at drop off. I really do love how caring he can be about all living things, but it can sometimes take a toll on all of us! At least he had the sense to avoid letting the other kids know why he was upset...

DS6 takes his Single subject acceleration math test this week to skip 1st grade. He has to get a perfect score to pass, including showing his work.

I have given him last year's test 5-6 times over this year and he always makes some silly mistake. This weekend he did the whole test right, but when writing the equation that matches the story for one problem he copied 2 + x = 20 (answer was 8) instead of 12 + x = 20 in the show your work part despite getting the right answer of 8 to the problem.

So basically he knows the math but he doesn't have the patience/focus to take tests perfectly yet. And he's 6, so that seems not at all age appropriate anyway!

I kind of hate that I made him spend any time preparing for a dog and pony show that is so rigged he is sure to fail. But one way or another here we are and this week is the week.

This is heinous. Here's an old post discussing this practice. Is there any opportunity to negotiate a different cut score, such as 90%?

Wishing him good luck on his test-taking skills, as his math skills seem to be solidly in place.

DD9 is a super lovely, compliant, law abiding, polite, hard working, diligent student, who does exactly what's expected of her and is great at fitting right in. So I really wish, that just once, she'd look her teacher in the eye and say, "What is this $*&^? Stuff your papier mache and poster-making and fill-in-the-missing-word-even-though-its-right-there-in-the-list-worksheet &#(&%($, I'm going home to invent hovercraft.' I'd be so proud!
*sigh* Because in the meantime, I'm *that* weirdo mother, making up stuff about her daughter :P

(off to brag in the other thread about DD inventing hovercraft!)

Thanks!!

Next year to skip 2nd grade only 85% correct is required. So we will get there, eventually. Supposedly we can appeal the decision this year and they will look at each case one by one, but I think really they don't think 1st grade kids are old enough to skip yet. Anyway, we will work the system the best we can! First he needs to get his usual 49/50 points so we have a solid case to make.

If one more teacher, administrator, support person says "you're a smart kid, this should not be a problem for you" to my child, I am not responsible for my reaction. Oh,and in the last meeting, the school psychologist smiled at my son that he is in the 99th percentile, then, bizarrely proceeded to explain to him what that means. Um, he's in the 99th percentile, he knows what it means.
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Actually, I always explain what the 99th %ile means, even if the student knows, though I also ask if they do, first. Usually at least some staff at the meeting don't, so I'm really explaining for them, but it's less obvious if I direct it to the student.

Thanks for the better perspective, aeh I need to re-adjust my attitude sometimes.

Dropping off DS on a day where he spends 2+ hours with a teacher who seems to be playing a huge role in the "school makes me hate myself" saga. In what should be DS' wheelhouse subject.

Instructing DS not to speak unless spoken to, period.

Four more days....

^#{%<\%^~%**%|}\ (banging head on smartphone keyboard)

I can't remember if your DS has neuropsych testing but you might mention that in a factual way--"Yes, cognitive ability is in 99th, but EF (or ability to manage anxiety, etc.) is not."

I remember one of the first things I heard here, and from DS' neuropsych, is that school folks default to that "if you're so smart...why can't you..." I assume this is because they don't understand. I wouldn't understand, either, if I hadn't been forced to understand.

It is very frustrating to hear that! Especially if the child starts to internalize and equate intelligence with EF.

(((Hugs)))

Eco, in the "better late than never" category, DS17 is being evaluated over a couple of weeks. In fact, it took me a while to understand what was going on, and to get the school on board with doing assessments. So for his last year of high school, he may finally receive the support he needs. Our meeting is next week, when we will learn the results of all the evaluations and if he qualifies for services.

I PM'd you, Nother.

good god, and these people have college degrees? Their own kids where test scores came home and they had to interpret the result?

Yup. I'll just allude here to my oft-stated observation on math anxiety in education majors.

It's also an opportunity for me to emphasize just how different these kids are from the norm, in an attempt to persuade decision-makers and classroom staff that a couple of extra problem sets or essays will not suffice to meet the student's needs.

It has always bothered me --- considerably --- that people who are math-phobic (let's face it and say they don't understand math) are allowed to teach it. I mean, it's one thing to not understand vectors in three dimensions, but basic stuff like percentiles? Imagine hiring a skating or gymnastics teacher who had never done a one-foot glide or a cartwheel. It wouldn't happen. It's appalling.

Along the lines of IQ and executive function, I remember a meeting with a math teacher who didn't understand how I could claim that my grade-skipped daughter was "so smart" (I never used that term; it was her phrase), when she would forget to bring her book to class or have a messy backpack.

I said, "Oh, that's a difference in the development of executive function and cognitive ability," and gave a basic explanation. She listened, and then said, "I still don't believe it." That was in October, and it was a year that scarred both my kids.

I think that some people don't get it and don't want to. When you encounter one of them, I'm not sure there's much that can be done apart from a tactic of avoidance wherever possible.

Unfortunately elementary school teachers are generally bad at math. My DS7's teacher has written in the weekly more than once this year they are working on a difficult concept, once for doubles and once for making tens in subtractions. I was really afraid that some kids may indeed internalize that and think of math as "so hard". Luckily my son and his friends are more likely to claim math is "so easy" than not.

You have no idea what kind of "science" and "computer science" teachers my local school district hires (BA in Recreation and BA in Physical Education - I looked them up on Linkedin)! I admit that these people teach elementary school where subject matter is not very advanced, but, what if a child had a relevant question that is not covered in the syllabus? Would these people shut the kid down or give wrong answers or worse still, ignore the child? I shudder to think about it.

I just give up on school math. Now to work on my attitude so my kid doesn't pick up on it.