Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional Handwriting as punishment for kid with dysgraphia?

DD8 has been having lots of trouble with this particular teacher (and *hates* her--long story, but we had gotten great results just from having DD report to the other teacher in the room--but she's out this week). Today somebody 'trashed' the bathroom (threw toilet paper all around) and DD got blamed. I don't think she did it (she says she didn't) but I am not sure. Anyway the teacher, who also must not have been sure, got her to confess (under duress), so the consequences were to clean it up (fine) but also to write out 25 times "I will not trash the bathroom." I would agree that a further consequence was reasonable, and this isn't a ton of writing, but it seems like an inappropriate consequence for a kid whose evaluation by the school-affiliated psychologist included a diagnosis of dysgraphia (not in so many words, but) and a recommendation that her fine motor weaknesses be accommodated by shortening written work assignments, avoiding drill work which involves copying, using word processing, voice recognition, etc. But as far as I can tell it's 'slow' dysgraphia (my term), where she takes longer to write but it looks okay when she's done. So the question is, is handwriting an appropriate consequence when a kid is supposed to get handwriting accommodations, or should it be avoided by a conscientious educator? I am just wondering whether I should point this out to the administration if we have to talk to them again this year (and I am so glad school is almost over!!).

Do you have an IEP or 504? Is there someone at the school besides the teacher that you can ask? Is a short email to the school psychologist just asking wortth your while...I would be just as concerned about my kid doing that as the possibly false confession as the punishment. I also worry about the social ramifications of some other kid knowing that they can do bad stuff in order to get my kid in trouble.

No fun either way....((hugs))
Grinity

Hi, Grinity,
Yes, we are concerned about all of it, and have been trying to work with the school this year but it has been very difficult. The wonderful former head of school left at the end of last year and this year there is an interim head who seems friendly but not particularly interested in helping 2e kids...and indeed I think the school is moving away from accepting 2e kids, which is probably why we were not invited back next year. It's been particularly difficult because this is DD's third year in this LE classroom (it's a private Montessori school) and the first two years the teachers were wonderful and helped her with her behavior and everyone was in love

So, no IEP aside from the recommendation from the school-affiliated psychologist, who was working with DD in the classroom for awhile at our expense and we were happy to pay if it helped...which it did not, because her role evolved (we thought) from trying to help DD to trying to reinforce the teachers' (IMO negative) views. So for bullying, we got the message that DD should not be a victim...no indication (to us) that they were also working with the bully to discourage her behavior. And unfortunately one of the things DD has learned is to distrust the teachers. And that other kids definitely can get her in trouble (the bully, by lying, and has done the same to at least several other girls in the class, and those parents have complained, and still we get the 'don't be a victim' speech). The whole thing really bugs me but it kind of developed gradually over the year and now again thank goodness it's almost over.

Without an IEP or 504, your reaction will need to be with velvet gloves rather than a wrecking ball. If you were going to be staying at the school, it would be worth pushing a lot harder to make sure there was a different understanding moving forward, but this would simply be the impetus for me to begin the process of getting her covered by an IEP or 504 for next year.

I think an email to her teacher and to the psychologist is warranted, just asking that in the future your daughter not be given writing assignments as punishment since writing anything at all is already punishment under the best circumstances. It will document the issue, your concern, and may help another child further down the road at that school.

As to whether your daughter did it or not, you'll never know for sure, so this is likely a good teaching moment for you with your daughter rather than a defending moment with the teacher - don't get pressured into confessing something you didn't do, but if you did do something being honest and taking responsibility will usually mean there are less consequences long term (loss of respect, trust, etc.

I've learned that kids I never thought would lie to me did indeed lie to me with great skill, and that the egg on one's face after valiantly defending a child who promised they weren't lying until infallible proof showed up is quite uncomfortable and destroys credibility with the teacher for the next time I needed to go to bat.

Hope this helps...

Thanks, MON and ABQMom.

I really don't know if she did it, and certainly we know that she is one to parse words *extremely closely* and not to be a reliable self-reporter, but she does pride herself on being truthful (although sometimes it's a technical kind of truthful). I honestly wish the teachers would put a camera in the hallway or something to keep better track of what was going on, because something similar happened in the bathroom earlier this year (twice!) and DD got blamed for that also--although the teachers did admit that nobody had seen her do it, they still had decided it was definitely her fault, partly as in your story MON because she agreed to clean it up and they thought she wouldn't do that unless she had created the mess in the first place (!).

So I totally agree if somebody saw her do it or there was no possible other explanation, then she should be punished and I would definitely back the teacher(s) up. But that doesn't seem to be the case (I have to say, between DD's reporting skills and the teachers' lack of communication generally and lack of responsiveness to our questions, I have no idea what has gone on for most of the year--which has made it really hard to work on DD's behavior at home). Our official position last time was, 'we're not sure she did it, but we'll talk to her about how inappropriate it would be to do that.' I have actually thought about getting one of those recording pens or something and having DD carry it around for a day just so I can figure it out, but that seems a little extreme even when I am most frustrated. But I'll have to talk to DD more about it because she feels like if she doesn't confess this teacher will just keep yelling at her until she does; we mentioned this last time to the teachers but it didn't seem to make any difference this time.

So for now we are talking about all of that stuff with DD--responsibility, not lying, being respectful to others, etc. And trying to have her make sure the teachers know when she leaves the bathroom and it is clean, so they don't blame her if there is a problem later. Hopefully this will all sink in at some point so she can get along better. And we are working a lot on DD's behavior so hopefully next year with a new teacher everyone will be happy again.

Thanks though for the reality check--it just seems weird to me for a kid to be given a consequence that is at odds with the psychologist's recommendation for regular classwork. And this teacher always says things in such a negative way that even though I try to be objective and of course respectful it is pretty challenging.

I would be upset too and I would probably try to speak with the teacher about maybe allowing her to type the punishment (if possible) or a different punishment not related to writing. If you're not returning next year I would be less likely to agree to this punishment given the circumstances.

Also, I can see my 8 yo dd offering to clean up something like that as well even if she wasn't the one to make the mess. That is just the way she is, she likes people to be happy, she likes things to be clean, and she is extremely helpful and would probably just agree to clean it to appease the teacher. So I don't think it's fair for a teacher to assume that a child readily agreeing to clean up a mess is the same as admitting to making the mess.

I'm not sure what I'd do in this particular situation because there's a lot I don't personally know about the situation - but re your original question, is handwriting an inappropriate consequence for a student with dysgraphia, imo, yes.

This is what I would consider doing - but again, there's a lot I don't know about what's happened prior to this incident or what your intentions are re next year: if your dd has a 504 plan in place (or an IEP) that states her handwriting accommodations, I would send an email to the teacher and the 504 (or IEP) team stating what happened, quoting the accommodations as listed for handwriting and voicing my concerns that the consequence was inappropriate and possibly in violation of the 504/IEP. If your dd has already done the handwriting, and if she mentioned any complaints about fatigue, hand hurting etc, I'd mention it in the email. You could also mention that there is a cumulative impact on kids with dysgraphia as the school day passes - if they have to write in the morning, for instance, they may be able to rally and get through that assignment ok, but will be fatigued (mentally and physically) later in the school day when they need to be fully engaged to do other classroom work or pay attention to a lesson.

My gut feeling here is that the larger issue is understanding what's really up at school. Is your dd telling the truth, are the issues your dd has had with her teacher all about the teacher or is there more to it that you need to understand before next year happens, etc.

polarbear

Thanks, mountainmom and polarbear.

That's what DD is saying (that she cleaned it up just so the teachers wouldn't get mad because they were already blaming her, even though the first time she said there was p**p on the wall (!) which if true I definitely would not believe she did). I actually agree with the teachers that it is a little different from DD's usual stance to agree readily to correct something she didn't do. But on the other hand she really *insists* she didn't do this--so I still really don't know (b/c I also don't want to get in the position ABQMom mentions of defending her when she's wrong--especially because these teachers already don't like her, or us for that matter even though we have really tried hard to make things work this year). So I'm really looking forward to the end of this school year and getting along with the teachers next year (I hope), so I'm not in this weird place of not knowing what is going on or what to do about it. I think this year is beyond repair, even though I feel like we did everything we could under the circumstances to try to make it work--including having DD evaluated by the school-affiliated psychologist (I think inaccurately), paying for said psychologist to come into the classroom weekly to try to help, and constantly trying to reinforce appropriate behavior with DD--all ultimately unsuccessful. *Very* frustrating.

I think it's a consequence you wouldn't see happen for a dysgraphic kid if you have a teacher who understands the nature of dysgraphia and who is truly invested in helping your child. I would not be surprised in general that it happened for two possible reasons - I suspect the most likely (just based on our experiences) is that the teacher either isn't familiar with dysgraphia, doesn't understand or care to understand it, or is just simply too busy to keep up with each individual student's set of accommodations in every situation that comes up. The second reason could be that the teacher simply doesn't care. Hopefully that's not the case!

Soooo.... as I'm replying my answer keeps evolving - sorry about that! But - fwiw, if you are thinking of staying at this school, I think you do want to follow up in some way with some education for the staff re dysgraphia.

polarbear

Thanks, polarbear.

Actually I think we're doing overlapping posts! Funny. But anyway, I think it's fair to say at least that this teacher is a very bad fit for DD. It's hard to understand how the teachers at this school can vary so much; the earlier ones were so marvelous, and this one is so very disappointing. She does always mention how many kids are in the class (I think it's 26 now, but there are two full-status teachers) and seems overwhelmed but I think the main problem from DD's perspective is that she frequently imposes unexpected and harsh consequences, and often sides with other kids against DD. Leading DD to conclude that she is not a very good teacher, and unfair.

For next year, we have shared all of the reports with them, and they agreed to take DD on anyway--so I am planning to be the best volunteer ever. I really hope it works out.