Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy Honors Biology vs AP Biology

Just a quick question to the group, why would you need to take Honors Biology before you can take AP Biology in HS. DS12 with be attending a local public HS next year and we wanted to take AP science courses in 9th, 10th and 11th (AP Biology, AP Chemistry, AP Physics). We wanted most of his AP courses completed before 12th especially in Math and Science. He will still AP courses in 12th but these will be more of elective choices depending on what the school has to offer or even online or courses at one of the nearby colleges. The HS counselor stated DS 12 can take the AP course but first let’s give him the Honors final this year. I don’t see the purpose in this other than to show us that MS science is not enough to prepare for the Honors Biology final. It almost seems patronizing to me. I just don’t see the need for taking 2 biology courses in HS.

This is fairly standard. Our school requires H.S. Biology & H.S. Chemistry before AP Biology, and H.S. Chemistry before AP Chemistry. (Honors or non-honors) And at least Algebra II before AP Physics. If you go look at the AP site this is what college board suggests. Our school doesn't allow any AP to be taken freshman year, except for the really rare kid who started Algebra as a 5th grader and who has already finished pre-calculus with an A. And no AP science till junior year. What kids who want to take the full load of Biology, Chem, Physics AP courses does is double up in their junior or senior year.

My son took Honors Biology last year and it's not junior high science. The text book was quite dense. The AP Biology class in our school expects not just H.S. Biology but H.S. Chemistry before you take it. AP Classes are 'supposed' to be college level. And the teacher/curriculum for A.P. Biology expects that kids are already proficient at material and often will skip over basic material. This is why they want you to take a test.

Yes your son could possibly already know this level of material and pick it up easy if he is gifted. I don't see why you should be upset by their requiring a test to skip over the H.S. class. I am impressed they are offering your son the chance to take the test and skip over the class.

I'm curious by your comment that in 12th grade he will then take an elective choice. What elective choice AP Environmental Science? Have you checked out the schools offerings? The second year of Physics? What AP Science classes does your school offer? There really are only 4 AP Science classes, with 4 versions of AP Physics one sequence with Calculus and one without. What version or versions of AP Physics do they offer. (Our school to my annoyance only offers the new AP Physics 1 - Mechanics without calculus.) Additionally there is AP Environmental Science. But at our school that is the AP Science class who didn't do well in science, even though I do think it's a worthwhile class.

Every school is different, of course, but can the Honors class perhaps be as good or better prep for the AP test as the AP class? Our HS offered AP classes that were actually said to be "less challenging" than the honors classes. This allowed more students to have the opportunity to earn AP credit, because it was easier to get into AP versions of classes than honors. I never took the AP class, only the honors version, but that was sufficient to get the desired AP score.

It may be standard-- and yeah, we heard a lot of this tripe, too, when DD was in high school.

The bottom line is that this kind of "prerequisite" can generally be waived-- I know of three instances in which our school happily did so (aside from in my DD's case).

She took AP coursework without "prerequisite" coursework in the subject (a year of honors) in physics, mathematics, English, and (if I recall) US history.

I think that for kids who are beyond MG, this kind of prerequisite requirement is usually toxic.

This is pretty standard, as others have mentioned. My middle kid took Honors Biology in 9th and was one of the few recommended for AP Bio in 10th (typically a 12th grade course). However, the school insists you take Chemistry in 10th grade (as well as swimming, which caused some problems too). Since she takes two languages, she couldn't fit two sciences in the schedule.

So kid took Chemistry at a private school over the summer prior to 10th. This was the only approved Chemistry course for our public HS. After the HS got her transcript, they said she needed to take the HS Chemistry final - and she had to take the Honors final - and get an 80%. They would not give her a copy of the HS Chemistry textbook (covered a few different topics than the course she took), wouldn't give her the study guide, and told her it was all multiple choice (not true). She took the final and a few weeks later I got an email that she got a 90%. Then they asked her to do a lab so she could prove she understood things...it is an endless battle.

You are fortunate that the school will let him take the final to place into AP Bio. But multiple AP sciences can be done, as my kid will have AP Bio, AP Physics 1 and AP Physics C by the time she is finished, as well as two languages through AP level.

Can you get a hold of the book & syllabus for both classes? Do you know of anyone in both classes who could let you see the book if the school doesn't. Do you know anyone who has skipped H. Biology and gone straight to AP Biology in YOUR SCHOOL? Biology is a huge topic and the AP covers a lot of material. As you can see from the variety of answers this depends on how the class is taught. And your child's learning style. Keep in mind that some schools the AMOUNT of work ramps up a lot is all the classes in high school. IMO the best way to answer this question is if you can see what the difference is between the two classes.

Had to chime in … My 9th grader (accelerated in the sciences, top EXPLORE score etc…) originally started AP Bio but after realizing how picky the teacher was going to be on the lab reports, quickly switched to Honors Bio. He is definitely challenged in this course and can somewhat breathe … He had to find a balance with the class and also daily practice/games with his varsity sport. As a freshman he is also taking AP World History, which he absolutely loves for all of the enormous learning. Even though it's a TOUGH class for his GPA, it's his favorite!