Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional ADHD and test taking skills

3 mg is the standard adult dose for melatonin (that is what my pediatrician suggested for my son as well, even though he only weighs 85 pounds), but I've been giving him less so far.

There is also lots of research behind "good sleep hygiene" to help insomnia -- she could have a look at this too. Regular wake up time is really important, and doing something relaxing (not looking at a screen) in the evening also helps.

Don't teenagers generally have a shifted sleep schedule where they aren't sleepy until really late, and want to sleep in most of the morning? Too bad about having to get up for school!

Well, in both the long-term and short-term I'd say it means you need a new psych.

In absence of meds-- or even with them-- what needs to happen is an emphasis on teaching coping skills and adaptations while the school offers accommodations like perimeter seating, homework changes (all homework assigned Monday and due Friday, Mom can decide when there's been enough work done for the day, only requiring enough work be done to show mastery rather than the 40 problems assigned the class, etc), untimed or small group testing, etc. The school counsellor can meet with the child to work on executive functioning skills if she's able; theoretically that's the job of an OT but as long as it gets done I don't quibble. (You can google accommodations to find common ones.)

Refusal to comply or questioning rules is not only a gifted issue, it's also an AS issue. They have trouble recognizing the social hierarchy and that other people, by virtue of their roles, are allowed to give them instructions.

Worst case scenario: There are a few news stories every year about people on the autism spectrum who don't recognize that the police have authority over them and can't comply, and get into serious trouble. Rare because of watchful parents, but it happens.


You DO want someone to actually pay attention to the details of her behavior. At least, that's what we have come to expect from our developmental pediatrician who prescribes meds. If it takes an hour for me to weigh pros and cons with her and feel confident in her decision, she takes an hour.

And yet-- the way you frame this here concerns me. I don't think it's helpful to see your DD as though her raw giftedness will be altered/muted/taken away by meds. It's likely the opposite is true; by helping her manage her neurological quirks, meds could help her be the person she wants to be.

Compliance is NECESSARY for social functioning. Just try to hold almost any job without being able to comply with safety rules or the rules of the job. Understanding whose rules to follow is something most people have mastered. by your DD's age. I know the doc's phrasing was a turnoff-- and I wouldn't blame you for seeking another doc-- but raw giftedness alone without the social skills to manage it is not such a gift, as you've seen.

If meds can ease her stress and help her manage, I'd encourage you to stick with it.

DeeDee

Thanks Verona, I have downloaded some sheets on good sleep hygiene. It seems now that the weekends are the biggest problem since she has no legit reason to get up early. (Hopefully, soon a job will cure that :-)). The Melatonin seems to help her get to sleep earlier but not sleep longer, so instead of sleeping 1am-7am, she sleeps from 10:30pm - 4:30am(!) I am thinking we will try the melatonin just on weekends/holidays to help keep some sort of schedule when off the meds.


I realize now that I should have started this long ago, these things surely would have made my DDs public school experience much more tolerable/enjoyable. She is 17 now, and finishing up with homeschooling and her last 2 courses in college. She will be going to an amazing college in August that does not believe in busywork assignments or timed tests and only has small group classes where the teachers are called "tutors" and they facilitate the discussions among the students rather than perform an authoritarian/dictatorial role in class. I think this environment will fit my DD very well without extra accommodations. If the meds make it possible for her to harness her thoughts efficiently enough to write her papers, then I have high hopes for her success in college.

I do think I need to find a way to help her with coping skills and EF skills. I am having a really hard time coming up with a reasonable plan for that because:
a) the shaky parent/teen relationship at this point (although that has been improving exponentially lately)and mostly,
B) because these are areas that I struggle with too and my DD is very different from me, so she balks at the strategies that work for me.

I would love to find a coach to work with her but money is very tight right now and I don't even know where to find the type of person that I need.

"Refusal to comply or questioning rules is not only a gifted issue, it's also an AS issue. They have trouble recognizing the social hierarchy and that other people, by virtue of their roles, are allowed to give them instructions."

(sorry, I don't know how to quote twice in the same response!)

I am still trying to determine how much of this is Aspie and how much is Gifted and/or ODD. I don't remember my DD having problems with authority/rules when she was a lot younger, in fact people used to comment on how well she minded me. I think it was at about age 11 that she declared herself to be equal to adults. She has told me recently that if I would have just explained valid reasons for the rules/expectations, she would have followed them.

"And yet-- the way you frame this here concerns me. I don't think it's helpful to see your DD as though her raw giftedness will be altered/muted/taken away by meds. It's likely the opposite is true; by helping her manage her neurological quirks, meds could help her be the person she wants to be."

You are absolutely right Dee Dee, I am no longer concerned about the meds changing her personality, I realize this fear was misplaced. My DD has reassured me they do not affect her in that way and she has convinced me that they are helpful, so I do plan to stick with them.

I do have some questions about the meds:
The first trial of meds has shown to be helpful with no adverse side effects...I guess I should count our lucky stars...but how do we know that a higher dose wouldn't be even better? My DD mentioned that they do seem to help but not like the first day, am I looking for trouble in thinking a higher dose might be even better?

Do the ADD meds also help with anxiety? I can't tell if my DD suffers from anxiety or if what I suspect is anxiety is really just a combination of other issues. The diagnostician told me I would probably need to help my DD with "starting" things. That she has issues with the act of getting started. Is that an anxiety issue or an EF?

Thanks so much for everyone's continued help and support help as I muddle through all of this!

"...by helping her manage her neurological quirks, meds could help her be the person she wants to be."

As someone diagnosed with ADD as an adult, this has been my experience. I feel *more* myself when on meds.

Also--"I only started to think there was a real problem when she couldn�t pull it together to write her college application essays in a timely manner for the school she desperately wanted to go to."

College applications seemed like an insurmountable task to me--so I chose to apply to a school with rolling binding early admission, because completing only 1 application and being done was the most attractive choice. In retrospect I know a big part of that decision was because I was overwhelmed with all of the applications. It was a great a school, and if I knew then what I know now, it could have been an even better experience and education. But it was not the best fit, and knowing what I know now, I would have chosen differently.

Sounds like 10:30 pm was too early for her to go to sleep and that's why she woke up at 4:30 am (same thing happens to me if I go to sleep too early). I was told to start by deciding when I needed to wake up (say 7 am), then decide how many hours of sleep I needed (say 7.5) and calculate the appropriate time to go to sleep from there (11:30 pm) and not to go to bed earlier, even if I wanted to!