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    #936 - 06/13/06 01:24 AM very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    willagayle Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/08/06
    Posts: 400
    Loc: Minnesota
    Hi,
    Ok. So dyspraxia is a theme for us as you can note from my response to the other thread.

    Last week we were informed that our son, 8, had a VCI in the very high superior range (School District Psychologist said most likely it is even higher) with all the other scores on the WISC-IV that involved fine motor skills or fine motor learning scored from 20 to 50 points lower!!

    We knew our son had dyspraxia and we have always thought of him as bright, but we had no clue that either issue was a big deal for him. We were never told dyspraxia could have such a horrible effect on the expression of ability.

    We're stunned and overwhelmed. We are doing vast amounts of research to understand both the dyspraxia and the giftedness. However, we are confused on how to approach the two together. Very little is available for the special needs, gifted child.

    Our state does very little about gifted education and our school district only clusters kids who are teacher and performance identified.

    SIGH.

    Suggestions and support highly needed and welcome.


    Willa Gayle
    _________________________
    Willa Gayle

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    #937 - 06/23/06 03:24 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    ScottsWife Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 06/23/06
    Posts: 27
    Loc: Somewhere out there
    Would you consider a cyber charter school? Our school district is so [SPAM] poor it's not even funny. Now granted I graduated from a very rich school where students with any needs wanted for nothing but this school has NOTHING and we don't live in a bad area. There is just nothing here. It's ridiculous. The best option for my son was a cyber charter school. The online classes actually would have forced him to work at the same pace as if he were in a classroom but this particular school has a program where they send books to the students and the student does their work that way and they can work as fast (or slow) as they want. Depending on the school, of course, there is great support and if it's a charter school it's a public school so it's funded like the "traditional school" but the education is customized by the parents. Just a thought. I don't know if it's conducive to your work schedule or your child's personal discipline either. Some people I know would never do it because their kids would never do the work for them yet they will work at school if that makes sense. My son would do ANYTHING to keep from having to sit bored to tears in a classroom again.
    _________________________
    "Learning can only happen when a child is interested. If he's not
    interested it's like throwing marshmallows at his head and calling it
    eating." -Anonymous

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    #938 - 06/23/06 07:23 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    willagayle Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/08/06
    Posts: 400
    Loc: Minnesota
    Its on our lists of considerations. Our school district isn't poor, but its gifted education is nonexistant--just clustering.

    Our only concern is he has very high social skills and that is one thing that might pull the disability along. He doesn't want to leave his friends. I am thinking that will change as we begin to enhance his information.
    _________________________
    Willa Gayle

    Top
    #939 - 06/23/06 10:19 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    ScottsWife Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 06/23/06
    Posts: 27
    Loc: Somewhere out there
    Well, again, this will depend on the type of school you could go with (cyber and cyber charter are different and I personally prefer charter myself because it puts control of the education in the hands of the parents) but a lot of the cyber schools do offer networking between families that are using them so the kids keep the social thing going. My son enjoys karate and played baseball through our local parks and recreation this year and will try basketball in the fall as well. The YMCA has a lot of programs available here although I have not signed him up for anything because for a 7 year old he's pretty busy already. I know our ped. is always on me about the social thing and I did discuss the option of leaving the traditional school setting before we made the leap last year with my son and he was all for trying it and now he never wants to go back. In fact the few times he wanted to drag his feet about his school work I looked at him and said "ok I'll call up the guidance counselor and tell him you're coming back to sit in the classroom." and he was right back at the desk working his tail off. I hate to sound like an ogar because really I'm not. That boy worked very hard last year to meet his goal of completing 2 grades in one school year so I don't ride him too hard about anything these days. He's enjoying his summer and has taken up Spanish as a second language...which his cyber school supplies as OPTIONAL enrichment for the summer. Well, now I'm on a tangent. I know it's not the answer for everyone, but if a school is going to leave your child behind so to speak then I say you have to remind yourself that you're the only one that's going to fight for him and make his education right. Good luck and I do hope you find something that works out for him and his future. I don't know anything about dyspraxia but allegedly my son is ADHD on top of giftedness. I don't know if I believe it though. There is too much of a parallel between the two and if he's not challenged enough of course he doesn't pay attention....but what do I know? I really don't know anything actually. I'm not the smart one, he is. shocked )
    _________________________
    "Learning can only happen when a child is interested. If he's not
    interested it's like throwing marshmallows at his head and calling it
    eating." -Anonymous

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    #940 - 06/23/06 10:43 PM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    willagayle Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/08/06
    Posts: 400
    Loc: Minnesota
    Those are good points. Eventually we'll have to take Mite out of public education.

    Right now, Mite's only motivation is in the social area. We didn't notice how burned out he was getting in school, but he has a group of friends that are natural peer advocates for him and he screams when he thinks he will lose those. I think a couple of them are also very exceptional intellectually and all 5 of the boys are very nice, well-mannered kids. So, at least until we have a better understanding of what is going on with him both in intelligence and in impairment, we'll try to keep the his social support group intact.

    I do think he's going to be like your son when he figures out how much fun it is to learn when there are no constraints. Right now he is researching facial cancer in tasmanian devils and it is amazing to see the ideas and concepts he both understands and pursues. I'm hoping it motivates him to take on other solo research endeavors.
    _________________________
    Willa Gayle

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    #941 - 06/24/06 09:20 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    ScottsWife Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 06/23/06
    Posts: 27
    Loc: Somewhere out there
    Well my son has a lot to learn yet about learning without constraints because I know I hold him back to some degree yet. I worry about him just being a 7 year old and he talks about college like it's happening tomorrow. He's only entering 4th grade in the fall and while I realize that's an accomplishment for a 7 year old I know that had I let him he would likely be further along then that but I worry about the maturity VS content issue arising too. Today the kids were feeding some goats and he says "so how do we know which ones are boys and which ones are girls?" yeah there are some very very basic things we have not touched on yet. I really want him to just hang onto that innocent boyhood forever but *sigh* I know that's going to come to an end sooner rather then later. I told him (for now) that only girls have babies so we don't know right now because none of them were popping out babies. ha ha ha. We moved onto the deer real quick after that. *snicker* In some ways I know I must be a bad mom for this but....*sigh* I'm just not ready for that yet and I don't know that he is either. shocked ( My son likes to share EVERYTHING he knows with anyone who will listen so.....I don't know that we want to talk about all of that if we don't HAVE to......today. Maybe tomorrow....or the next day....or 10 years from now. *chuckle*

    I think it's great that your son has strong bonds with his friends. My son has some good friends but there is a boy in the neighborhood he wants to hang out with so bad who just has so little time for him and I feel so bad for my son. shocked ( He has been asking to take up skateboarding now in hopes that this kid will want to spend more time with him since that's what he's in to right now. Well this kid and the other boys he runs with are not the nicest kids and they have been pretty hard on my son at times and I told my son that a skateboard will NOT make him like those boys and that he doesn't need friends like that. My husband and I do hope to move to an area with a more promising school district for our daughter (the temperamental artist) and quite possibly some day even my son if it's a good fit. I am all for the traditional school setting if they can accommodate and enrich a child's learning abilities without just giving them extra worksheets to do or whatever. It's sad that "no child left behind" doesn't really apply to ALL children. shocked (

    What an exciting study your son is doing! I am sure I wouldn't know how to direct my son if he were into something like that. Oh the things to look forward to as he advances....*sigh*
    _________________________
    "Learning can only happen when a child is interested. If he's not
    interested it's like throwing marshmallows at his head and calling it
    eating." -Anonymous

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    #942 - 06/24/06 10:53 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    willagayle Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/08/06
    Posts: 400
    Loc: Minnesota
    Gosh! I don't know how to direct Mite about the Tasmanian Devil. He's so intense about it and worried about the animals. He wants to do fund raisers for them. I just try to reign him in though I think if I were a better mom I'd help him do one.

    Our school district does nada for special education. We want to see what they have to say at the IEP meeting and see how they are going to handle things.

    Can the online charter school be year round or is it only like a regular school year?
    _________________________
    Willa Gayle

    Top
    #943 - 06/25/06 09:08 PM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    ScottsWife Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 06/23/06
    Posts: 27
    Loc: Somewhere out there
    Again, I'd have to say it depends on the school. We use Pa Cyber Charter which is obviously for residents of Pa. The students have to do 180 days of school just like the students in the traditional school setting (as a charter school must meet the same criteria as your regular run of the mill school) although his teacher offered to have his 4th grade curriculum sent out before he was even finished with the 3rd grade stuff so that he'd have it. I told him he could wait and have it sent in August as I did want my son to enjoy his summer and we did already have some things planned for the summer months but I did ask if they (the school) reccommended one summer program for gifted students over another. The teacher informed me that they did offer their own enrichment over the summer and after going over some of those materials my son selected foreign language and a discoveries in reading program he's working on although it's completely optional. Next year I plan on getting him into the program that Mansfield University has over the summer. shocked ) Anyway, I know the school we're using allows the teachers to order curriculum for students whenever parents want it but I can't say that all schools offer it that way. If there comes a time that you're seriously looking into it then I'd say just call around to potential schools and ask every question you can think of. I was so nervous about making the leap from the traditional school and worried that I would mess my poor kid up but now I'm so happy we did it and he's so happy too. From reading what you've said about your son it seems like things are a little different and certainly you don't want to see him suffer if he is thriving right now with the social aspect of things. My son was clearly being singled out by kids who were telling him he couldn't play with them because he was younger then they were etc etc and that wasn't exactly a benefit at all. He is the youngest and the smallest almost everywhere he goes and most children are accepting of him but some of them just don't have any sense of manners I guess and that really hurts him. I hope your school is able to find a way to challenge your son so he can stay with his friends and still get something out of school as well.
    _________________________
    "Learning can only happen when a child is interested. If he's not
    interested it's like throwing marshmallows at his head and calling it
    eating." -Anonymous

    Top
    #944 - 06/28/06 12:05 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    willagayle Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/08/06
    Posts: 400
    Loc: Minnesota
    I meant to say they do nada for gifted education.

    You know, I have to fess up. I had NO clue my kid was so gifted. I knew he was bright and doing better than his teachers were telling me, but I never knew he was...

    I've been spending the last couple of weeks just getting to know my kid. I feel like such a schmuck. I'm supposedly profoundly gifted myself, and I didn't even recognize it in my kid. He was so reserved and quiet as a baby and young child. It just never showed and I never thought to check him out. Our older son is also highly gifted and I guess I just expected Mite to act like him if he was gifted.

    Anyhow, I'm trying to mend my errors now. I was shocked the other day when I was talking to my older son about a bar room brawl that happened in my area. The people didn't understand what the victim was saying and thought he was saying something else, offensive, and there was a big brawl over it. I said, "He had poor enunciation so there was a big melee" (I was using big words to protect Mite from the story). Mite said, "So they had a fight just because they couldn't understand what he said? That's so ridiculous."

    How in the heck did I MISS that in him. I had no idea. I feel so ashamed.

    Anyhow, because of my ignorance, Mite has had no extra stimulation or guidance other than to be given free roam in his interests and play. So, I don't even know if he's ready to take on acceleration in any form.

    I'm checking into local cyber charters, but the only one I've found so far lost their accredidation last year. :^(
    _________________________
    Willa Gayle

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    #945 - 06/29/06 02:36 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    ScottsWife Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 06/23/06
    Posts: 27
    Loc: Somewhere out there
    Well there are some cyber schools that are still out there up and running. I personally prefer the charter version for reasons previously stated but I have a friend who was recently considering both and there actually didn't seem to be too much difference...except of course considering the whole fact that charters ARE public schools.

    It sounds like your Mite has done very well regardless of when you found out his intellectual abilities. I don't think you can beat yourself up about it. Well, you can but I don't think it will do any good and I'm sure he would tell you the same thing. He seems to be thriving in his own ways and although a little more enrichment will likely go a long way for him at least you know NOW rather then NEVER. shocked ) Something is always better then nothing and now is better then never. Nobody's perfect and I am positive your son knows better then to have that expectation of you or anyone else. shocked ) Don't be so hard on yourself.

    I'll tell you what I have to wonder....I read some of the stuff people's kids are doing at such young ages and I gather that they are in the same range as my son and I scratch my head and think "so is my son just a little more dumb or have I been neglecting him or not pushing him enough or what?" Ok, I'd never call him dumb, I was being dramatic of course but you get the idea I hope? I am certainly pleased that he's entering 4th grade in the fall at only age 7 and in fact he informed me yesterday that he has every intention of clearing 2 grades again this year. I did tell him we'd see what the curriculum looks like and we'd talk again about whether or not that was a realistic goal and I also praised him for having such high expectations of himself. He looked at me like I had fallen off the moon of course because if he wants to do it I'm sure he will but again with the maturity and content and then I am back to thinking...have I held him back too much? *sigh* It does help to know that in August I am having him re-tested. This is a dr our ped. reccommended and our insurance will pay for the 4 hours of testing and she'll give me the results right away. I asked my son if he minded doing the tests and he said he would do them. Part of my reasoning is because when the school tested him (about 2 weeks after he turned 5) I knew they didn't WANT to test him, I know they have ceilings on their tests, and he tested on a level of the average 3rd or 4th grader for some of the stuff they tested him on...aside from the astounding IQ they recorded for him. Anyway, I'd still like a completely unbiased person doing the test of their own and I'm looking for a more well rounded eval. because I want to know socially and emotionally what the dr's views are and whether I should just let him keep plowing through stuff or what. I am terrified of doing the wrong thing and just seeing irrepairable damage done to such a great mind and I can't stand the thought of that so....I have to rely on someone smarter then me to tell me what to do I guess; or at least offer some guidance or insight. I hope I haven't completely squashed the time in his life where he'll really excell and use his exceptional mind though by encouraging him to be a kid. I want him to enjoy his childhood and not be such a little adult all the time. I grew up like that and I don't wish that for my children. shocked ( Now I have run off on a tangent.....sorry. *blush*
    _________________________
    "Learning can only happen when a child is interested. If he's not
    interested it's like throwing marshmallows at his head and calling it
    eating." -Anonymous

    Top
    #946 - 06/29/06 11:40 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    willagayle Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/08/06
    Posts: 400
    Loc: Minnesota
    I like your tangents. The give me some idea of what to expect down the road and what I need to do. I was just reading on the Davidson Gifted Database that if the WISC IV was administered it has a very low ceiling and might look less gifted than is actually the case. So, it suggests getting someone to administer the Standford Binet LM. I'm going to look into it, because the more I look into it now the more I realize he's a lot brighter than even the school's testing indicated.

    My husband is balking at the prospect of educating from home. I think I need to show him it can work before he'll consider it. The cyber charter sounds intriguing and is definitely a possibility.

    Right now, I'm just finding out what stimulates Mite. His motivation is soooooooooooooooo low because of the h*ll he's been through. I'm so dismayed to discover how much he has suffered.

    Well, your'e right. I need to move forward and not wallow in regrets. I've gotta get him going and put my energies into progressive efforts.

    thanks

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    #947 - 06/30/06 03:05 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    ScottsWife Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 06/23/06
    Posts: 27
    Loc: Somewhere out there
    From the way you describe your son it sounds like he's a happy boy so like I said don't beat yourself up about the past. He has a future and that's what you have to look toward. shocked )

    I know the testing my son had at the school was a WPPSI-R and the Wood****-Johnson tests. What that means in "English"...well I know very little. I know how the scores he got translate but I really didn't know there were such a wide array of IQ tests until after the fact. I actually don't know what test the Dr will use when he's tested in August but I went with her because she was highly reccommended by our ped. I did look up her credentials and she actually has several books published on a variety of topics in child psychology so I am thinking she was the right choice as far as his testing goes. One can hope anyway.

    Best of luck with your husband. Mine really didn't put up a fight. I just had to answer the same questions a hundred and ninety-two times, "Is it going to cost anything? Are you sure they send him a computer? Do they really reimburse for internet and did you get that in writing? Are you sure it's considered a public school?"...and on and on. *rolling eyes* My husband second guesses me on everything one minute and the next he tells me how smart I am and I just sigh and humor him continually answering the same questions over and over and over again. It was a nerve wracking decision to pull my son from the local school and go Pa Cyber Charter at first but once we did it and I saw him flying through the material and saw his grades and how happy he was I knew I had made the right decision. We will move eventually because the schools here leave a LOT to be desired and they're only getting worse and our 3 year old daughter will NOT be staying home for any type of school or we'll all need straight jackets. *gasp* The top priority in relocation when we're ready to move will be schools because of the kids...primarily my son although it looks like our daughter is going to need some sort of enrichment for her artistic endeavors. Time will tell. At any rate, I'm sure your husband will come around. Just be sure you have all the facts before you make any leaps...and I'm sure you will. I know it's just sort of a nervous feeling at first if you're making the choice to pull out of the traditional school setting but if it comes to that...well your child has to come first. Who knows? Maybe they'll find a way to accommodate him? Keep us posted. I enjoy hearing about him! shocked )
    _________________________
    "Learning can only happen when a child is interested. If he's not
    interested it's like throwing marshmallows at his head and calling it
    eating." -Anonymous

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    #948 - 06/30/06 08:38 PM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    athena2 Offline
    New Member

    Registered: 05/21/06
    Posts: 1
    Dypraxia is not a diagnosis of a condition but a description of the symptoms. Dyspraxia is a greek word that means you have a hard time moving. That is what my doctor told me. My daughter had dyspraxia when using her large motor skills. She is now four and a half. After 3 years of PT/OT services that early intervention/insurance payed for until she was three, and that our town payed for until this spring when she graduated from these services, and more additional services at Children's Hospital that we opted to pay for in addition to all the free ones, she is now caught up and a jock to top it all off.
    I recommend that you read "the out of sync child", a book recommended to us by Childrens Hospital. Practice makes all these skills that are not developed yet come together. Believe me.

    Top
    #949 - 07/01/06 01:38 AM Re: very superior VCI and dyspraxia
    willagayle Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/08/06
    Posts: 400
    Loc: Minnesota
    I'll get the book.

    Mite was delayed in large motor development during his preschool years. He had 18 months of OT and the lower limbs are now up to par; however, his upper limb fine motor skills still aren't there completely. His upper limit reaction speed measured at 10 years 11 months, but fine motor score at 4 year 11 months. He's 8.

    He's great at jump rope. He great at soccer! He's lousy at bouncing a ball, drawing, writing, etc. So, some large motor things aren't there in the upper limbs yet and some are.
    _________________________
    Willa Gayle

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