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Hi all,

We've been doing Aleks to supplement DS's non-rigorous math at school (you know the drill). He likes it and usually does 20-30 minutes 2-3 times a week. I don't push it although I do remind him that he hasn't done much from time to time.

Anyhow, I was thinking that I would switch to EPGY when the new enrollment starts in June - I want to make sure he gets as rich and deep an exposure to math as possible. A couple questions.

Compared to Aleks, to what degree is EPGY individualized? If you show mastery do you jump over sections? Is there an assessment? How do the teaching segments work and how long are they? What sort of reports/feedback do parents get? Can you create quizzes? I guess I am asking how the individualized instruction plays out in EPGY as compared to Aleks.

Thanks Cat

We switched over to EPGY for more "depth" after completing 3rd/4th/5th on ALEKS last fall.

EPGY & ALEKS operate with the same basic strategy of not forcing the kids to do fifty problems if the kids can nail it in four.

EPGY does not have anything like ALEKS' Periodic Assessment.

EPGY has no function for creating quizzes.

EPGY gives basic as-of-the-moment % complete & % accuracy for each strand, but not much else.

EPGY's "teaching" segments are of some value, and while sometimes better than the "Explain" button in ALEKS, they aren't nearly as dynamic as Thinkwell's lectures.

-- -- --

Here are some things I miss from ALEKS:
- Detailed solutions to every exercise
- Letting the student "pick his poison" from the PIE
- Manual quiz generation
- Automatic periodic assessments
- Dynamic problem generation that gives seemingly unlimited pool of questions for each topic.
- Detailed progress & historical reports
(Especially "what he did & when" detail)
- Comparatively trouble-free interface

But we're sticking it out with EPGY for 6th because of the greater depth overall and especially the thick, juicy strands on Probability & Statistics. I've also enjoyed the interaction with our EPGY tutor -- she's been very supportive and extremely responsive. I also like the Session Playback so I can see specific answers given to each question -- similar to the detailed quiz report in ALEKS, I suppose.

If EPGY & ALEKS could join forces -- using EPGY's content & ALEKS's technology - I'd be very happy. I'd be happier still if they could get Dr. Burger from Thinkwell to do the lectures.

-- -- --

Either worked fine for our son as an independent learning environment & he used both in the classroom as a replacement curriculum. But when he hit some hard stuff along the way and he was unable to get help from his teacher, the ability to "bail" in ALEKS and pick something different from his Pie was key, and we really missed this feature in EPGY. There's a "give up" option in EPGY, but it doesn't prevent a topic from coming back during the same session.

Our son is not so internally driven that he is interested in slogging through this entirely on his own -- especially the new and/or hard stuff. While he learns very quickly, he still needs to be "taught" & "coached." His teacher has recently allowed us to "homeschool" for his math period and DS's attitude and accuracy have improved considerably since then.

We're going to give Thinkwell a test drive before we commit to anything for pre-algebra & beyond.

Dandy, thanks so much, this is very useful information. Maybe at this stage (DS is in 2nd grade) it is worth continuing to use Aleks for the ease of technology and he does seem to enjoy it. Once we get to pre-Alegebra, perhaps that is a better time to make a switch - my DS is very much still whizzing through at the show me once and I'll get it stage (sure to bump up against harder material soon) so it may be worth it to just let him roll for a little while, especially since the "brakes" are on at school for him so much (not that EPGY would be brakes obviously, but the delivery might not work for him as well).

I really appreciate your detailed thoughts. Cat

I would consider switching over no later than 6th. Thru 5th was fine on ALEKS and with two small exceptions, he was fully prepared for 6th on EPGY. When he switches from 5th to 6th in ALEKS, the pie will come up 80%+ complete. That's what spooked me. When DS switched to EPGY for 6th, EPGY revisited some of the concepts that ALEKS had tucked away in the completed section... and it turned out that DS needed that review (long-division in particular).

Dandy,

Let us all know when you do test out Thinkwell. Many users on another board have said it is not rigorous enough or as wide in it's scope and sequence. I would love some opinions here. I imagine my oldest will be done with EPGY this year unless something changes to extend the current offerings. I can't afford beyond the OE.

Dandy, very helpful. He has just moved on to 4th in Aleks and I figure we will let him stay with it until he finishes 5th - and then switch to EPGY - as you suggested.

Glad to know you felt Aleks 5 prepared him for EPGY 6th. I worried about that, and whether he would be able to switch without there being huge gaps. I know what you mean about reviewing concepts - that is one of my primary concerns - that he will move too quickly and not lock in the concept and reasoning. For things like long multiplication and division, he sometimes will forget whether to start on the left or right, or skip steps when doing it in expanded form - that is why Aleks is nice, I can do short quizzes here and there and I really think that helps with retention over the long haul (well, I think the best way to retain it is to use numbers in everyday life- but we are pretty good about that). Cat

Cat