Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy Let's put replies to Kcab here, ok? DD10 hiding

Hi Kcab,
I taxied you over here so we can respond more easily.
You posted:


Hi, I'm kcab and have been surfing around here w/out registering. Saw the intro post thread and thought it was a good excuse to register & come out of anonymity. Also, maybe I can search effectively now!

I have two kids and three problems:

DD (who I'm more likely to call A) 10, 5th grade - was well served in our former (Ruf Type III) school district. She was generally in the top ranks of her class there but the differential between her and average was not as large as it is in her current school (public, good reputation & attended by many children w parents in academia, so we thought it would be good!). Also, classroom behavior & social issues were addressed well at former school. She's the source of my more pressing school-related problems, which I may end up posting about elsewhere but in a nutshell are 1) how to keep her challenged & keep her from hiding intelligence and 2) how to deal with difficulties that are coming up at least partly due to her being ahead of age group peers.

DS (also known as B) 5, in K - v. bright, & we all love his current placement in a terrific private K. He's able to delve into things as he chooses there, has a wonderful teacher who supports his interests and is able to provide additional challenges. He taught himself to read, I guess I'd nominally say last year, at 4. Likes playing around with mathematical concepts & with numbers, very dextrous and likes to see how things work. His visual-spatial skills are more obvious than my daughter's, though I've begun to think that she is oriented more that way than auditory too. Only problem with B is that we've been planning on public school starting next year, but there are no additional services available until 5th grade in this district. I'm debating whether to start talking to the principal about him now or not. It would be nicer just to enjoy B & not borrow trouble, but I'm wondering if starting now might help in the long run. I'm also hoping that the school's awareness of his sister's academic ability will help smooth the way for him. (She is in the GT program that they offer.)

For myself, I was identified as gifted long ago. My parents (both public school educators) worked hard to get my first school to add GT services. I have some scars from that fight and some biases borrowed from my parents as well. And I'm a prickly sort of person. I'm an engineer, have a Ph.D., and am currently underachieving big-time. My husband is also v. intelligent, I don't know if he was ever formally identified as anything. He's also an engineer, Ph.D., and currently achieving rather more than I am.

Anyway, off now to see if I can find old threads relevant to my daughter's situation. I have found it interesting to read some of the discussions that are currently going on, good luck to all!

Hi KCab,
don't you hate how school that have great reputations just aren't always better than what you left behind. I wish I had a quater for every time I've heard that story.

((pout))
Trinity

Well, keeping a gifted kid challenged is key - particularly for our "go-with-the-flow" girls. What do you estimate her LOG (level of giftedness)? Have you had private IQ/Achievment for A or B?

What are your alternatives?

What are her interests?

Exactly what kind of difficulties are happening at this point with her agemates?

When will your DD start a new school. Next year? Is this year the building's first year?

Here's a general bit of advice - do you have any bright, high achieving female friends who you could encourage to strike up a friendship with DD? What would any of us have given for same-sex role models at that age?

Best Wishes,
Trinity

I love those MAP tests. I hope that in the future all NCLB type test are based on their model. How does she score on them? Is she even or spiky? I've heard that when one is contemplating a gradeskip, on wants to land in a situation where the child can make A's if they work at it. Can you compare her MAP scores to the top 10 girls in the next grade?

smiles,
Trinity

Kcab,
that's excellent news. Because her school goes to 6th, then you can expect that a midyear skip, now, into 6th, would give her that important "bridge" year. In other words, if you are considering a full grade skip, then do it now, not next year, unless you are only offered next year and it's really needed. Let's face it- this age group is tough on girls, so if she's with kids who are more on her level, then she might have more success with friendships, and at least she will learn the "hard work, then achievment cycle."

I would reccomend ordering the Iowa Acceleration Scale Manual: A Guide for Whole-Grade Acceleration (K-8) 2nd Edition (Paperback)
by Nicholas Colangelo (Author), Ann, Ph.D. Lupkowski-Shoplik (Author), Jonathan Lipscomb (Author), Leslie Forstadt (Author), Susan G. Assouline (Editor) . today, if possible, and writing a lettter to the school, today, in writing, stating that you believe that she would be better served educationally and socially in 6th grade, requesting them to please change her placement. Then they will come back with an offer of an individual IQ test, which is what you need to fill out the Iowa anyway. You can email Susan G. Assouline to figure out how to use the achievement scores you have from the MAP. I'm guessing that you can use them as BOTH achievement and above-level aptitude testing, but Dr. Assouline is very approachable and helpful, and if you are going to take such a step you may as well have all your info at your fingertips.

If the school refuses testing, a local tester who is experienced in gifted and the SB-V will probably be ok to give the IQ test. Then you will have the information you need to help make a plan.

Best Wishes,
Trinity

Interesting about the "taking off" - I know that MAP provides information about what the child is expected to achieve in the future. Did she start outpacing this?

Call the MAP folks and ask them about their "predicted learning" they are nice also.


Would the school pay for an WISC IV IQ test if you asked for a skip? (Even if you don't take the skip, it's really helps fill out the IOWA)

Once you have an idea how "out there" she is, you'll know better what to do. Skipping a bridge year is tricky, particularly for the less organized, teacher pleasing souls. But in your individual situation, perhaps that is best. ((shrug)) No easy answers.

How about a changing to a private school right now, and getting improved social and improved academic all at once? Otherwise it Afterschool, afterschool, summer program and pray....I would highly reccomend some IQ test, particularly if you are going to leave her as is, because girls are so stealth! If she's really level II, well, it's ok if she's happy. But she isn't really happy is she? ((shrug))

Best Wishes,
Trinity

Like-minded peers. That's what I lived for (many yrs ago as a pre-adolescent/teenager). How to find like-minded peers? Very difficult. Either a grade skip or summer enrichment through a talent search (my son talks about his experiences all yr long as though it floats him from yr to yr). The people they meet are like them and they're cool and it's not weird to skip one grade, or two, or even more, and maybe graduate early, and some speak lots of languages...the smarter the cooler. The EXPLORE test for 6th graders is offered in most states (check out ACTs website).

Kcab,
Sounds like you have a good plan. In the meantime, see if she has any hobbies that can be turned in to social opportunites. Do what works to keep a close relationship - afterall- sometimes adults have to stand in for peer-friendships, and the key person to do that may have to be you. It's great that she has an adult friend that does craft projects with her - occuping their hands may be the perfect way to loosen their tounges! ((wink))

You will need an individually administered IQ test to fill out the Iowa Acceleration Scale - and a talent search test is a nice bonus.


Now I'll go back and reread your post to see if I have any idea for DS.

Big Smiles,
Trinity

Congrats on getting such a great placement for B right now. Sometimes getting things right in the short term is all we can ask for. I'm thinking that if he is Ruf Level II, then getting a good tradition of afterschooling going while he is young enough to obey you, plus Saturday/Summer programs may be all you need until 5th grade. I wouldn't bring it up to the Principal now IF you are comfortable that it's a Level II story. I would do everything possible so that you've built a relationship with the Principal, because if you are allowed to handpick the teachers you will do better no matter what the Level.

If you have "B" at Ruf Level III or higher, then I reccomend individual IQ testing, private and not local, and this is a "test one, test them all" reccomendation. If the current teacher would accept him next year, you can go for the "hold back and double skip ahead" path. I've found that a wonderful classroom teacher is ...wonderful!

Best Wishes,
Trinity

Hey hey KCab,
How are things going with "A" and "B" and the Iowa Acceleration Scale Manual?

Cousin Trin