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    #29289 - 10/29/08 08:45 PM NUMATS, SCAT, or others
    MNTCMom Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 10/24/08
    Posts: 28
    Not for going to any of the programs, but for the purpose of possibly working it out with the school to actually add some acceleration to DS8's individual subject(s), will NUMATS or SCAT both tell me where he is subject-wise? Or anything else I should be looking into? If either will work, any differences between the two, given we are in MN, but DS definitely is more comfortable with computerized tests than paper ones (which he tends to get distracted during).

    Thank you very much for the advice.

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    #29326 - 10/30/08 09:06 AM Re: NUMATS, SCAT, or others [Re: Dottie]
    doodlebug Offline
    Member

    Registered: 10/04/06
    Posts: 433
    Loc: Illinios
    I found some information on the EXPLORE in the book Developing Math Talent. It states that there has been a lot of research on the EXPLORE and that it is useful for placement in terms of math as the score range your child achieves indicates what concepts have been mastered and what the child is likely to be ready to study. My son will take his first EXPLORE test in Feb with NUMATS so I can't speak from experience, just what I've read.

    My understanding of the NUMATS program is also that you recieve two reports, one from ACT that compares your child's scores to 8th graders and then another one from Northwestern CTD that details how your child scored compared to others in the same grade level who took the test. That report is also supposed to provide some recommendations for educational planning such as acceleration and other approaches to meet needs based on the test results. The CTD website lists benefits of participating in the testing here:
    http://www.ctd.northwestern.edu/numats/program/benefits/

    Again, we will be participating in NUMATS for the first time in Feb 09, so I'm not speaking from experience. But, my personal experience has been that when advocating for our son's needs in the public school it was the out of level testing that made them notice his needs. My son has previously taken a ERB-CTP and then the SAT10 out of level tests. Both of those were effective tools to advocate for needs. I think out of level testing in general helps tremendously to show where your child is advanced. I think using tests that the school is familiar with helps even more.

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    #29414 - 10/31/08 09:00 PM Re: NUMATS, SCAT, or others [Re: doodlebug]
    MNTCMom Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 10/24/08
    Posts: 28
    Thanks for all the details, Dottie and Debbie.
    I think I will go with SCAT for now and get a feeling of it.

    I've also noticed that the school district's application form for acceleration has a line item for Woodcock Johnson test. Can that be the out-of-level test used by the school district? (I am afraid of asking too much to the teacher, thus trying to do these outside tests before asking them to do anything.)

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    #29436 - 11/01/08 04:54 PM Re: NUMATS, SCAT, or others [Re: Dottie]
    MNTCMom Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 10/24/08
    Posts: 28
    Dottie,
    Thank you very much for the explanation.

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    #29669 - 11/05/08 09:39 AM Re: NUMATS, SCAT, or others [Re: MNTCMom]
    az1 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/05/08
    Posts: 71
    What a timely post. I have a 2nd grader whose MAP scores were in the 99% across in all tested subject areas, except for general science, which his teacher said was fine as they did not have much science exposure. He still fit into the "high" performance category for science. I have the RIT value sheet for the MAP and his scores put him at the middle-of-the-year 4th for math, end-of-the-year 4th for reading, and beginning-of-the-year 4th for language, and beginning-of-the-year 4th for science.

    He has been differentiated in spelling, reading, language and math. I don't think it has made a bit of difference. He said he talks most of the time in math(pull-out in anther classroom differentiation) because the work is easy and boring and that he finishes the problems right away and spends the rest of his time chatting. He also told me that during his morning work they are allowed to make up their own math worksheets and that he is writing multiplication and division questions while the rest of his class is writing out simple addition and subtraction.

    The school seems to think this differentiation is working but he is not challenged and has told me he is bored. I am entertaining the idea of having him take the SCAT through JHU. He qualifies both through his MAP scores and through the basic "parental referral" option. I am not too familiar with the SCAT but would the school tend to pay more attention to his scores on the SCAT if they were out of norm for his grade? He is just too young to take the EXPLORE so that option is out.

    He is the "perfect child" at school. He never gets in trouble, never complains, is a great helper, and is very polite. I think because he is embarrassed to tell the teacher how bored he is because he does not want to stick out. He tends to like the status quo.

    Any thoughts?


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    #30701 - 11/17/08 05:27 AM Re: NUMATS, SCAT, or others [Re: Dottie]
    az1 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/05/08
    Posts: 71
    I have another question regarding the SCAT, specifically the score reporting option available through CTY. The basic score results come with the standard fee. CTY describes an "individualized report" for an additional $200 that includes the basic report plus individual educational placement and planning." At what point do you go for the individualized report? I am having my 2nd grader take the SCAT because he scored very high on his MAP, in all areas, has been placed in a pull-out math program, given above grade spelling, and is in the highest literature group his 2nd grade offers, and he is still bored.

    My initial thought is to wait for the basic report, come here with his scores, post them and see what our resident experts think I should do. If they feel that his scores are enough that they warrant additional action at school, then maybe the individualized report would be extremely helpful, especially coming from an independent 3rd party - Johns Hopkins, nonetheless.

    Thoughts?

    The problem is I feel like the clock is ticking, he is bored. We are waiting to get our info from CTY, and it will be a while before we actually get numbers. Uhhhhh- sometimes I feel like I am spinning my wheels and going nowhere!


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    #30712 - 11/17/08 06:56 AM Re: NUMATS, SCAT, or others [Re: az1]
    RJH Offline
    Member

    Registered: 11/06/08
    Posts: 142
    Loc: Va
    Quote:
    The basic score results come with the standard fee. CTY describes an "individualized report" for an additional $200 that includes the basic report plus individual educational placement and planning."


    Where did you find this info? I didn't know this was an option. I would like to know too, what kind of extra info could they give from such a short test.

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    #30713 - 11/17/08 07:10 AM Re: NUMATS, SCAT, or others [Re: RJH]
    az1 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/05/08
    Posts: 71
    Two score reporting options are available for SCAT and STEP testing:

    A basic score report contains a summary of the results, including the number of items correct and percentile scores. The testing fee ($50 for SCAT, $60 for STEP) includes this report.
    An individualized report contains all of the information included with the basic score report, as well as recommendations for specific educational planning and placement. This report costs $200 above the SCAT and STEP testing fees.

    http://cty.jhu.edu/gifted/dcc/abilityachievement.html

    Hope that helps.

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    #30714 - 11/17/08 07:42 AM Re: NUMATS, SCAT, or others [Re: az1]
    RJH Offline
    Member

    Registered: 11/06/08
    Posts: 142
    Loc: Va
    Hmmmm....interesting. I'm not sure if it would benefit us, since we are homeschooling right now. I wonder if you can request the additional report after you get the initial test scores.

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    #30748 - 11/17/08 10:13 AM Re: NUMATS, SCAT, or others [Re: Dottie]
    az1 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/05/08
    Posts: 71
    ok Dottie.....I'm marking your words! If I need a writeup, I'm coming for you!



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