Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional Behavioral Optometrist?

I am wondering if anyone has any experience with a Behavioral Optometrist and their 2e child.

If you have read my previous post, I asked about ADD - no H. Anyway, since then, babybear (7) has been through developmental testing and it was discovered that she has visual perceptual, visual spatial,visual tracking issues that are well below her chronological age. In doing research on my own, I found that these vision issues often mimic ADD behaviors. We are having babybear tested later this month.

Does anyone have experiences/insights into this type of testing and therapy?

TIA

Yes, BTDT with DD7. We found the right optometrist at www.covd.org . We did the testing when dd was about 6, just a couple months after having seen a pediatric opthamologist who had found no problems. (The testing that the behavioral optometrist will do is different from a regular checkup.) DD did 6 months of vision therapy (weekly therapy sessions plus daily vision homework). She can see better than I can now And, she showed dramatic improvement with her reading during that time.

An interesting note - we did a few weeks of vision therapy before starting OT with listening therapy for sensory processing disorder (ocular motor problems can be one manifestation of SPD; dd had others too). When we started vision therapy, it was really difficult for dd. The vision homework sessions were agony for both of us. Then we did the short, intensive program of OT, and because of the schedule (OT 3x per week) we put the vision therapy on hold until OT was finished three months later. When we went back to vision therapy, the vision exercises were so much easier for dd to do, and the vision therapist was shocked at the improvement from the OT. The funny thing was that the OT had told me that it would help with the vision, but I wasn't holding my breath. After the OT, dd then breezed through the remaining 20 weeks of vision therapy. Bottom line for dd was that she needed both OT and vision therapy, in that order (her other SPD issues were proprioceptive and vestibular).

Vision therapy involved sacrifice - it's costly and hard work - but for us it was well worth it. Good luck!

DD 6 had also been tested by an opthamologist who found that she was farsighted, but she would grow out of it.

We later went to a behavioral optometrist who did the same tests as the opthamologist and additional tests for the tracking and processing issues. The behavioral dr. is great. Super smart and she talks fast, like me, so I liked her even more.

She didn't dialate DD's eyes either, they have a machine now that basically takes an image of the whole eyeball instead.

DD has been having therapy for visual perception issues which is how the brain sorts, stores and processes information that is taken in by the eyes. Totally different from being farsighted/nearsighted. Additionally, she has weak fine motor and was having focusing issues on top of being farsighted and now has corrective glasses for those issues as well.

We have been very happy with the progress she's made after a little over a month of biweekly sessions and daily practice.

We found our dr. at covd.org as well.

Good luck.

Your responnses have been very encouraging!! Our Pediatrician has requested OT/PT as well, but that has not been addressed because there are many hoops to jump through for the school district who would rather just label her ADD, drug her and call it a day.

We realize that the testing and therapy are expensive, but I'm really OK with using Christmas gift money and skipping gifts for DH and I to ensure that babybear gets what she needs.

Keep the information coming....I am devouring any and all reseach. If you have web sites, books, articles that would help us wind our way through this maze, please add them!

I KNOW this child is gifted and I KNOW that once we help her with whatever is holding her back that she will take flight and be unstoppable!! I wish it was easier to get the school on board with all this...but as DH says, we will bring "a bat" just in case!

Does anyone know of any information that supports the idea that schools get more federal money for kids medicated for ADD rather than other LD issues? Or is that a false claim?

Thanks again!!!!

I have to also add my support for the vision therapy. My DS10 started vision therapy for visual tracking/processing issues a year ago and did it for about 6 months. It has made a tremendous difference in his life!!!! It is very expensive, but it has been very worth it. Some insurances will pay for it (not mine sadly), so do check your policy. Definitely check out www.covd.org to find a qualified therapist. I hope it all goes well!!!

Our insurance does cover it,but we are required to pay up front and then submit the claim. The Doctor says our particular insurance is very good about reimbursement. We are crossing fingers (and toes!)

Hi again mamabear. I know you know the school can't diagnose your child with ADD, only a doctor can. I don't know if they get better funding with that diagnosis, but it's not relative in that they cannot choose or influence whether her diagnosis is ADD of LD.

Personally, if our pediatrician diagnosed one of my children with what I consider a neurological condition(I consider ADD nuerological) I would follow up with a pediatric neurologist. But, that's just me.

I can tell you that in the past I wondered if DD6 had ADD. Mostly becuase of what I notice as her inability to focus and stay on task, limited attention span at times. But she has been tested for ADD and we have been told she does not have it.

I have noticed she is much less fidgety in academic situations since starting therapy. I do feel her issue caused her actual physical discomfort during reading tasks. This has seemed to decrease.

She is like your DD7, has a mind of her own, totally different thought process, very smart. I have decided if I choose to keep her in a public school setting, it is my job to teach her how to cope with the aspects of that setting that are at a mismatch to her personality, most likely to cause her trouble.

I have worked with her on being aware of when she is focusing and when she is not. I want her to be aware of the difference of *feeling* between those two things. The goal would be for her to learn how to "turn" focus on and off. I've seen some progress there, she is learning how to focus on tasks she is less interested in. If she had ADD I don't think I could help her learn to do this and I probably wouldn't take the approach that I am taking now.

If we find that her enviroment is not a good fit after I've done everything I can to help her, I will create an individualized education plan and homeschool her.

It's never easy. You are certainly a really good mom for doing whatever it takes to help out your children. I hope the vision therapy is helpful, it sure has been for our DD.

Thanks for your thoughts again Incog!

What has my radar up regarding pushing ADD on DD is that with all of the testing (even after finding visual deficits) the recommendation continued to be "share with Pediatrician for Attention Deficit issues". If I had not been aware that there were Behavioral Optometrists and asked if there was a reputable one in the area, we would have been in a much different position.

I have always thought that DD has "something amiss" but she has taught herself to compensate for quite some time. For instance, she is a good reader (according to the teacher she is 6 months ahead of other kids). I believe her reading level to be much higher if she didn't have visual issues since she can read words off things (charts in a doctor's office like the names of nerves and diseases and things). She asked me the other day what insipidous meant! She tends to panic if the words are small or italic. I think that is why she is comfortable with reading for her teacher using larger darker print books. Once the print gets smaller, she can't keep her place.

Her math skills are below grade level, but I believe that has to do with her trying so hard to keep her place on the page, that she can't "multitask her brain" to retain that and get the answer as well. (if that makes any sense.)

She has horrid hand writing! She doesn't create lettes or numbers in a natural progresson such as making an "n". She will make the arc and then go back and stick a short stem on it. Numbers are always backwards or sideways.

She is a really good kid and she knows that she is "different". She gets very upset when her GT sister will sit and do all of her homework for the week in 30 minutes and it takes babybear 30 minutes to copy 5 spelling words 3x each (poorly).

I never thought DD was ADD, but the school seems to cling to that label as their "easy out". So far, the Pediatrician is not entertaining anything from the school until all of the testing is done. Her teacher is excelent with her and willing to try things to help her, so that is a blessing!

Hopefully we will find the right combination before babybear's frustration has done any more damage to her self esteem!

Thanks again!! It helps to hear from those BTDT parents!!

Those descriptions of the handwriting and reading issues sound almost identical to DD6. I can't tell you how much the vision therapy has helped. Do you think it would be worth it to pursue the vision therapy and give that a chance before having her officially evalutated by ped for ADD/ADHD?

Absolutely!! She will be evaluated before Thanksgiving. I don't plan on sharing with the Pediatrician until ALL testing by the "other professionals" is done!!

Thank You Thank You Thank You!!! This has been a 4 struggle thus far!! This could be the key we have searched for?! (try to be cautiously optimistic!)

Are there any "In the mean time" accomodations the teacher could make? She seems very willing!

Oh my that does sound like DS10!!!! He has always had such trouble copying anything and I'd get so frustrated with him and wonder why on earth when it was right in front of him, he just couldn't copy it right!!!!! Imagine how guilty I felt when I learned he literally couldn't copy it right. <sigh> The vision therapy helped him tremendously, especially in the perception area - he tested 100% in that after therapy!!! I think he needs more help in the tracking area but he burned out after 6 months of therapy and we've had some other things going on that have kept us from going back. I am hopeful to get him retested in a few weeks and see if he does need more therapy for the tracking. It is WAY better than it was, but I think he could maybe use some more help and since it has already helped so much, I'd like to see it all the way through. Anyway, I hope you find a good doctor near you and that you get some answers. Keep us posted!!!

I didn't see your last post. My DS10's teacher was fantastic last year. She let him have extra time to do tests and other assignments if needed, also I came up with graph sheets for his math assignments since he had such trouble lining numbers up. The graph sheets really helped him keep the numbers in line. She checked his agenda to make sure he had copied everything down properly since he had such trouble with copying and basically she was just fantastic about helping anyway she could. Definitely take advantage of this if the teacher is willing to help!

As I said in a previous post, I am trying to be cautiously optimistic...but now I border on...."THIS IS IT!!!"

EandC - I do know the guilt. We have been told that we needed parenting classes to "handle her" (not so), that she needed more spankings (NOT DOING THAT), That we have too high expectations and she is just lazy and slow. I KNEW that she needed none of these things and that she most definitely was NOT slow or lazy.

She is a "people pleaser" and I know that it just breaks her heart when she doesn't measure up to academic and peer expectations. She beats herself up over what she "can't do" and is now fabricating scenarios for what she thinks people want to hear, such as I got the training wheels off and I ride my bike. Well, yes training wheels are off, but she is scared to death of it now and doesn't ride it. She is 7 and it hurts that the 4 year old next door is riding his bike. We are told that this has to do with her visual issues as well.

Do I feel guilty? More that I care to admit. I am just hoping that this is the right path for her and that she her skills can catch up to what she holds in her mind. I KNOW she is quite bright.

Again, Thank you for your responses!!!!

Thank you so much for that link!!! I took DD8 to 2 diff. drs last yr thinking maybe vision was the reason for reading difficulties. Both said her vision was fine then she failed the school screening this year. Maybe it's gotten bad in a year but she has some other issues as well with school (she's not my HG kid). There is a dr less than 1 mile away! I'm so excited to call on Monday for an appt. I just have hope that based on her issues, we might find some answers there.

Steph

I hope this information is as useful to you as I hope it is for me!

Good Luck!!!

Okay, count us in. Finally decided to give it a try and DS8 started vision therapy this past Thursday. We also bought the "HTS Computerized Home Vision Therapy." He loved the in office visit, but had a hard time with the home version. It wasn't adjusted for him yet, so it's possible it was longer than it would have been. Here's hoping. All the professionals I spoke to said it's untested, probably bogus - but based upon the personal experiences I've read about here, I figured might as well try it. Worth the $$$ if it works. Also, I was thinking about what makes my DS tired - writing, math computation which involves writing, finding the little pieces in big tubs of pieces at robotics... Hmmmmm.

I would rather try this and than jump on the "give the kid a pill" bandwagon right away. (not "fightin' words for those who have chosen medication)

Hope it works out for your DS - questions!! My dd7 gets evaluated in two weeks!! I can't wait!

Thanks. We are homeschooling using a teacher and she sees "serious attention issues" that revolve around writing. I've also been told that perhaps the problem is he's not challenged. He quite clearly says he's bored and the work is too easy and repetitive and that he can't help it, his brain shuts off on the boring stuff. We're in the same boat, it seems.

Good luck to you, too.

My dd days writing and math are as well. The teacher said that she thought babybear may not be challenged, but clearly after some trials dd just doesn't want to write. We have been through so many attempts at diagnosis and I am just not entertaining ADD at all. I read that there are atleast 50 issues that mimick ADD and until we rule them all out without success then I just don't want to hear it.

How does your ds do with computer or oral activities? DD does better orally since "hunt and peck" slows her down.

Hi Mamabear,

I just want to add that we too are doing vision therapy and it is definitively worth it.

Not being able to ride the bike can be due to those vision problems, I know that for my own experience. As an adult, my equilibrium was so bad that I could not stand on a chair or go up/down the stairs without holding to something. After vision therapy (as an adult) I have had not more problems anymore.

For DD, the regular ophthalmologist did not find anything wrong, but the behavioral optometrist did. We had very bad luck with the first one because she was 'playing psychologist' with DD in front of her but I found another one and now we do our exercises at home.

At the beginning those exercises were extremely difficult for DD and it was really difficult to motivate her - I had to use bribery - but now that she herself if noticing the improvement she is more and more into doing them.

In our experience it was better to start with very simple exercises and very very gradually increase the difficulty and give a lot of praise on how well she is improving.

off the track: Incogneato: if you like people who talk fast then you would love me

http://www.incrediblehorizons.com/mimic-adhd.htm

Here's the link of 50 conditions that mimic ADD.

I have really bad vision myself. So, I know how frustrating it can be! I can not drive a car! My vision issues are a different track though.(DD is adopted) If this works for DD, I know that she will finally be able to show her teacher what she is capable of. I feel terrible that we didn't find this route sooner!!!

But, I am trying to take my guilt energy and turn it into a positive learning experience for all involved: dd, family, teachers and the IEP team members, Hopefully it will help other children in the future as well!

Thank you! This is a great link.

Thank you! I hope it is helpful to many parents!

We met w/the dr Tuesday & she confirmed that her actual eyesight is fine. So she agreed w/our 2 eye dr checks in 2007. However, she recommends further testing due to some processing issues. She would say A if a V was shown, s for z type stuff. She mentioned something about her eyes focusing a lot during the tests. We have 2 appts for 1 hr tests each, then she'll sit down & have some answers after that.

I did wonder a little how many they say are fine w/no further testing needed but I also strongly believe there is something else going on w/DD8.

We've always said she is just set on a different speed than the rest of us. I think she had some sensory issues as a toddler that I never knew to address, numerous ear infections, tiny neat handwriting & mixes up words that are similar in meaning but totally different spellings when she reads.

Update:
We saw the Optometrist!! OH MY!!!

We are overwhelmed!! We are feeling like horrible parents for not getting to this point sooner!!!

We still have more testing and such before we have a final outcome with treatment, school recommendations, etc.

Again I want to thank everyone here for your responses!! As hard as it is to know that babybear has "significant perceptual deficits", it is encouraging that we have found the crux of her difficulties!

Hey, don't beat yourself up for not recognizing the problem sooner. You DID recognize it, and that's what counts. I think you're a good mom for recognizing it at all! It's not like you were neglecting her!

{{{hugs}}}

Here's to a bright future for Babybear!

I hear what your saying...and the head will catch up with the heart at some point.

I do believe the future for babybear will be even brighter, when she comprehends what she is seeing! (lol).

Thank you for your encouragement!

Mamabear, I felt horrible too when I realized my DS had the tracking/perception problems. But Kriston is absolutely right, you have now recognized what is going on and you are getting her help and there is no sense beating yourself up over something you didn't know about before!!! The future will be even brighter for her once she gets the help she needs. My DS was talking the other day about how much easier it is to read now and how he didn't even realize how much trouble he was having before. She'll be there too before too long!!!!

What is odd about DD is that she reads above grade level! But, she can not write well nor can she deal with math at all.

I think she reads well because we are such avid readers and she has learned to compensate for whatever she is not "perceiving".

I know that there is no changing the past but I have to say that we were totally bombarded with information right before a holiday and it takes some time to decompress and digest it all.

Believe me when I say that we are careful that babybear does not see nor hear any of our angst about all this. She is happy with the Doctor and even asked her own questions! We are so proud of her!!!

Now, the question is HOw do we get the school on board with all this?!

We are truly are forward thinking..... so if there is anything we should know or should ask...we are interested!!!

My DS read well above grade level too and I've always found that interesting. He was just able to compensate and "read between the lines" to understand what he read. What I was mainly concerned about was his handwriting, it was atrocious! He couldn't line numbers up either. I just didn't realize his reading off the line, and reversing words and his handwriting were all related to the same problem.

The school told me he wasn't eligible for services (???) so they did nothing formal. He was getting really good grades and I was taking care of everything anyway, so I didn't need them to really do anything and I didn't pursue it further. His teacher was wonderful about giving him accommodations though so it wasn't a problem. If you have an understanding teacher that is a great place to start. If you can get something formal, that would be even better, because then you don't have to just hope for understanding in the future. I hope you have better luck than we did! But the good news is, after about 6 months of vision therapy he was so much better he didn't need very many accommodations any more anyway. Hopefully you'll have the same kind of success!!!

Mamabear, so glad they were able to find out what the problem was. DD6 has been helped greatly by her therapy, they can really make progress with vision processing issues these days.



Hey, I liked you from way back! Now that I know you are a fast talker, I like you even better!

Here is bold question:

If anyone wishes to answer, I am curious how much $$$ this cost where you are. By the time all of the testing is complete, we will have spent around $1600.00!! I know you have to do what you have to do, but the cost is really a struggle especially with the economic issues.

Does that seem like $1600.00 in the ball park? And then what can we expect for therapy sessions?

I can not understand why these Doctors do not participate in Insurances! (Ours may reimburse but we are not completely optimistic that we will see that happen.)

That's just for testing? No therapy or glasses included in there?

What tests were done, do you know? How long did it take?

That's a lot more than we paid, but my DS is only 4yo, and the testing took only an hour or so. It was a couple hundred dollars, if memory serves. Plus $180 for his reading glasses.

It is a huge battery of tests. Part one took 4 hours, Part 2 is anticipated to last 2+ hours and then we have a 2 hour case presentation. That does not include therapy or glasses (if she needs them.)

I really feel like she could benefit from this, so I may have to just bite the bullet!

I am thinking I may try to find an alternative Optometrist and see what the difference in cost would be.

It's a tough call. They sound very thorough! DD6 had about an hour worth of testing, maybe a little longer. It was $250. Insurance did not pay for the test, but they do pay for therapy minus a co-pay.

Did you get your person's name off of COVD.org?

I got the name from the school psychologist and checked him out with several organizations. He is a member in good standing, but his costs are a surprise!

We are waiting to see what insurance does with the claim. We were told that they were "good about it". Whatever that means in insurance world. If all goes well, there should only be a co pay.

Wow that is expensive! Our testing was $300 but it only lasted an hour to an hour and a half. The computer therapy I bought for home was $300 and I paid $80 for every therapy session in the office. Our insurance excludes vision therapy so that is why they didn't pay. I hope yours does!!!! If you think his costs are too high you might still check www.covd.org and see if there is anyone else in your area that might be more reasonable.

I am in the midst of checking. There is only one more in the area.

I think it is totally reasonable to let the office or doctor know that you are worried about how much it costs. Ask if there are ways to find out what insurance typically pays, if the office will write off a certain amount if the insurance doesn't pay, if there are certains tests he thinks you can reasonably skip or postpone to save money, etc.

Many offices are very open working with you financially, but usually you have to ask. Most doctors are trained to do what they think is the best medically and are actually not aware of costs unless specifically asked. At least that has been my experience.

Thanks again for your input!!! I found another doctor who charges 50% less than the doc we saw! Her office indicated that they end up with a good number of patients from the first doc because he charges $6000.00 UP FRONT for therapy!! Yikes!! So we would be forking over almost $10,000 in a very short period of time. I don't know about any of you, but I don't have that kind of money lying around!

We saw this guy the day before Thanksgiving and the check becleared our account on Monday!!

This, along with a few other "feely" red flags lead me to beleive (after the smoke cleared) that this is not the Doc for us, even though we know babybear needs that kind of help!

Nothing ever comes easy does it!!

Send good thoughts!!!!!!

I'm glad you found a better option! I've learned to listen to my spidey sense very closely as I get older!

My spidey sense can often be set in hyperwarp when it comes to the children....Fatherbear often reminds me but it appears we are both on the same page at this point.

ugh...and pardon my grammar and spelling on the last post...oh my!!

Didn't read all the responses yet, but no schools don't make money for kids on ADHD (at least not that I have ever heard of). I think teachers and schools find it easier to manage behaviors and suggest meds at times (however I don't at all feel it is a teachers place to suggest medication to a parent at any time). I work in a school as a social worker and have many years working with children with mental health issues and have suggested consultations (and possibly medication if recommended by a dr.) to parents that clearly have Achildren with ADHD and often parents have opposed this...and their children are clearly struggling. Don't get me wrong. I am not a fan of putting kids on drugs when not needed, I am a fan of doing all you can first...but when all else fails and it is chemical imbalance and you see their self-esteem failing because of it...then I feel that it is time to look into other options. I look at it this way, what are the side effects of giving them the medication vs. the side effects of not.

shelly...Have you ever consoled a mother who's son died as a result of ADD drug use? I have. I realize that research indicates that this is a one in a million chance, but how do you know which kid is the millionth one?

I also know that my nephew has suffered serious side affects and DH's nephew is incarcerated for drug trafficing that began with his Ritalin prescription

Again, every parent has to make their own choice and for me, these experiences speak very loudly against medications for my child.

I am sorry you went through that, I have worked with children for years that are on ADHD medications and have never encountered any serious side effects, and have researched medications extensively as well. I will say I have read about a few similar cases usually posted by parents, as I have read about with tylenol and vitamins as well, but I would guess that there is more to the story. I would imagine in the case you have experienced that there was something else going on. Either a doctor that was not experienced in dosage levels was prescribing, or there were signs that were ignored by doctors, or the child took more than one dose at a time. At the clinic I worked at you could call at any time around the clock to speak with someone, and if you had any side effects at all you were to call. We didn't really get calls with ADHD meds, but a few with some other meds.

What I have seen is a TON of is children that have clear ADHD and can not focus on tasks at all. Children that are isolated by peers and are highly impulsive (knocking into kids accidently, blurting things out at inappropriate times, etc.). Children that can't sit when they are asked to sit, and can't do what they are asked to do even when they are trying hard. Children that can't understand why they are different and why the can't make sense of all the stuff going on in there heads and can't organize it. Children that are constantly forgetting things and feeling like there is something wrong with them and that they are stupid when they are not at all. Children that want friends, but have a hard time making/keeping them. Children that if you wait long enough and don't address it become very depressed. I have also met them as adults and heard them talk to me about what it was like before they were diagnosed and treated. I can't even count how many circumstances I have seen like this. Again, I am not a fan of medication for everyone. My philosophy is try everything else first, and if all else fails and you have weighed the side effects then try it. (But if you have ever tried to counsel a child with pretty extreme ADHD that is not on meds, good luck with that).

I have also seen parents that were originally against medication try it with their child (usually they are so against it they wait until after the child is failing and falling apart) these children truly blossom and feel so confident about themselves, it is truly a joy to watch. And despite all those people out there who truly don't know much at all about it and say "my friend had a child on meds who became a complete zombie on ADHD meds" I haven't seen it with ADHD meds. The few stories I have heard are usually about other drugs that people think are ADHD meds or were taken in the wrong manner. And if there were side effects, I would hope they would go back to the doctor to address it because it shouldn't be that way. I am not getting paid by drug companies to do advertisements, and like I said I don't think every kid that can't sit still should be on meds (or else my son would be on ADHD meds as well). I do think that it overdiagnosed in some school systems and doctors offices in children that are either active, gifted, or even sometimes that have parents that don't set clear limits so their child is used to doing whatever. I just can't stand watching how many children truly have ADHD and are suffering because parents don't look into everything and weigh the costs and benefits. I see it often. Parents who say "I would never put my kids on meds" and I just watch their child fall apart more and more each day. It is sad to watch.

I not post to start an arguement with you.

Yes, I have worked with kids with ADD/ADHD and I agree that there are a FEW cases where meds may be the answer, but as a last resort only. Many parents are unwilling to implement the rigors of a consistant schedule or anything that is inconvenient.

Again, it is a parent's choice and I will leave it at that.

Sorry, I didn't feel like I was arguing and didn't feel you were either. Just sharing thoughts and opinions. I know there are different sides and views on everything, which isn't at all a bad thing.

I agree that often times parents don't want to try other things and go straight for the meds. I have seen that side as well. In my previous job we would never just medicate without working with parents and families, and before medication for ADHD would even be considered parents would have to attend a series of classes about parenting strategies and routines to implement first and info about children with ADHD to better understand how their mind works. They were also educated about different medication options as well. Some parents were very eager to get strategies and then didn't need the medication with some changes at home. Some made changes and still went with meds. But it would always amaze me when we would see parents that were convinced they needed no changes at home and had this attitude like "just give me the meds...NOW!" They act as if it is a magic pill that is going to change everything and make their children little robots.

You know, I almost piped in when I read Mamabear's comment that Shelly is commenting on.

Logically, it's a fallacious argument: Argument by selective observation. However, it does evoke a stong emotion, I think.

I was an HG child who had those symptons and was unfairly labelled, misdiagnosed and wrongly medicated.

My DH was an HG child who did have ADD inattentive, but was never diagnosed and had many difficulties growing up. He was diagnosed as an adult and couldn't imagine his life without medication.

It is a very hard decision to make when considering having your child take a chemical that interferes with brain chemistry(whether you think that is positive or negative). It's also a very private decision that only the parents have a right to make and I don't think anyone else really gets an opinion one way or the other.

A lot of ADD symtoms are executive function and research tells us that the frontal lobe is not fully developed until a person is in their 20's! So how is a parent supposed to know if a child will "grow" into their "impulsiveness" or not, especially taking into consideration the asynchronistic development a lot of our children seem to experience.

Mama, I know the comment wasn't meant to be inflammatory, however, I just felt I should comment. I've made comments myself that I thought were fine, only to have a very unexpected reaction from others that I wasn't trying to provoke!

Mamabear - I just wanted to pipe in on the cost issue. For DD7, we first paid around $25 for a screening, then around $100 for the testing. It did not take as long as you describe (I can't remember, but it was probably an hour and a half total, plus a half-hour conference at a later date; maybe two-thirds of the evaluation was done by a vision therapist and the rest by the optometrist). Vision therapy was around $2600, which included 6 months - 24 weekly visits - of therapy plus several progress exams with the optometrist.

Curious about the differences between optometrists, I took my 5 y.o. twin boys to a different but highly recommended behavioral optometrist for this type of evaluation (which was shorter, given their age at the time - actually, they were only 4.5 y.o. at the time) and I paid $125 each for the evaluation. I later had them evaluated by the same guy who DD7 goes to. No problems have been found so far; we expect to go back in a year to have them re-checked.

For the docs we saw, my sense is that they aim to not have the cost of testing be so high that people don't do it, so maybe some of the testing cost is built into the therapy charges.

hope this helps

At seven, my son was fidgety, wouldn't read more than a few paragraphs, was too interested in everything in the room and wanted to ask too many questions and the developmental pediatrician told us there were people who might think he had ADHD, but she didn't think he did.

He had tracking issues that caused him to skip lines if he didn't keep a finger underneath the words as he read and his eyes tired after reading a paragraph or two at that age. In spite of this difficulty he was able to read from a Newsweek magazine for the optometrist. It was hard to believe that he could actually have a vision problem when he managed to read without being taught at 2 and somehow managed to get enough practice to be able to read a magazine that adults read. He seemed to be able to see just fine until his eyes got tired.

In piano lessons the teacher had to use her pencil to point to where he was in the song or he would lose his place. Tests showed his visual motor integration was a few years behind when tested. He also had trouble reading some analog clocks, but not others and it was because he had difficulty telling which hand was longer on some of them. For a long time I thought he was just kidding when he told me he couldn't read our living room clock when he could easily read the one in our computer room, but then I noticed there is more of a difference in the length of the hands on our computer room clock.

My son had to use flipper glasses for a few months and that helped with the tracking problem. He was able to read longer without his eyes getting tired. He could read an article on Wikipedia after vision therapy because he didn't have to have his finger underneath the words. The piano teacher noticed the difference.

But he still has the problem with some analog clocks and I wonder if he will always have this problem. When his visual motor integration was tested the last time, less than a year ago, his visual motor integration was still low but the optometrist had just told us there was nothing more he could do for him.

That's great that they identified what the issue was with your son and he has had improvement. I had a book once about misdiagnosis of gifted children. It was quite interesting (Unfortunately I leant it to someone and never got it back). It is interesting how many gifted children are labelled with ADHD when they truly don't meet the full criteria. I know some gifted children do have it as well, but it is interesting that some people believe that if you don't always sit and focus on certain tasks you must have ADHD. I worried that my son's last preschool would think that as well, but instead they said they think he had something on the Autism spectrum. Their rationale was that they had never seen a 3 year old as smart as he was that didn't have something on the Autism spectrum. So I guess they didn't even need that diagnostic criteria with that conclusion. We figured we would have that question later in life so took him to a developmental pediatrician so we could at least have something in writing saying he didn't meet the criteria. I figure evaluations can't hurt, maybe they can provide more understanding or ideas.

A quick update:

Babybear's evalaution results from the Optometrist indicate that she is 2-3 years BELOW chronological age for visual motor/visual perceptual skills!

We will start vision therapy ASAP!!

The Doctor thinks we are looking at 1-2 years of weekly therapy!

I think we will take it one session at a time and hope for a shorter term!

Thanks again!

That's so great that you have an idea of what the issue is and have a plan. Best of luck to you! DD6 has been in vision therapy since end of Sept. and we have seen really big results.

I would suggest that you try to do whatever she is prescribed to do. I had a very uncomfortable time trying to DD6's.

It helps in understanding when they are having a bad day. I know C's excersises are very uncomfortable for her. I give her lots of praise and encouragement, but I do "push" her to finish and try her hardest. There have been a few days I wanted to let her off the hook because I felt so bad for her, but that was more about me!

I do give her rewards so she looks at therapy as steps toward a goal. Because really it is, but she'll have a hard time understanding what the medical goal is. But she totally *gets* Webkinz!!

Good luck!

Oh, wow! I'm so glad you caught it so early. Best wishes for a fast improvement.