Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy grade acceleration

Wel, Mite came home from camp yesterday. I broached the subject of acceleration this morning with him. He is still strongly wanting 6th grade.

I don't think the schools will let us do that AND I am not keen on him going off to junior high for various reasons. First, we live in a primarily majority community where racism is pretty prevalent in the middle and senior high. My DS14 had issues in middle school and we now shudder as we send him of to high school where it is rampant. My children, if I haven't mentioned it before, are minorities. I call them "specks of brown in the sea of white" in their classrooms and schools. So, I really worry for Mite's safety at the junior high, which is where he'd do 6th grade.

Also, there are some pretty nasty kids in the neighborhood in 6th grade and that's who he'd be with. So, if we consider that kind of leap it will only be in another district and that just isn't feasible yet.

Homeschool is not an option for us right now, at least not for the full-time.

I really think we are going to ask for a single level skip in everything but mathematics. In mathematics we will homeschool using Saxon 5/4 diveintomath program. He can go just as fast as he wants in math that way.

We are looking into private school options, but most in are area are wait-listed. So, we'll see.

sigh. why do people think raising a gifted kid is such a breeze? I can't imagine being jealous of what we all have to go through for our kids.

Hi Willa Gayle - ((hugs))

Does your son know these neighborhood 6th graders? How does he feel about them? Are there honors classes or gifted clusters in 6th grade? I hate to be such a nudge, but I'm in the middle of convincing myself that kids have some "inner intuition" about what they need. Of course they need us to take an independent perspective (see tummy time thread) buuuuuut (I know that you know this)

I can't speak to the racial issue, but here's my question - is your kid better off facing it later when he's older but more "bad fit" academically and interpersonally (he recognises that they have similar interests), or facing it right now with his own initiative and better fit academically. This assumes that he's going to have to face it either way. (I missed the part about is it you or his dad who is the "non-dominant" heritage person - if it's his dad, I missed the part about is his dad in his life, and what's his perspective on this? What does your older son think?)

Here's a little story about my life - I spent 4th and 5th grade "shunned." It was awful and I wouldn't wish it on anyone....except, when I grew up I became close friends with a lady who had never been unpopular in school, I mean never. We had infants at the same time, and would go on long gabby walks with the kids in strollers, I learned about her life. I never realized how much work, effort and self monitoring goes into never offending anyone "important" (no matter how offensive that person's demands might be.) I think she took more damage watching people like me get shunned that I did! Honestly. She still couldn't talk to people who were offending her about what her true feelings were. She told me about friendship after friendship that fell by the wayside when she finally got fed up. Did our friendship end in a similar way? Of course. Yet for all that, this person had many, many wonderful quailties. I will always be grateful to have known her, in general, and in particular due to the insiders view of the "popular" kid.

Does this little story translate to your situation? I don't know. I'm not saying it does - since I don't know what the local situation is for people of color. I just felt the urge to tell it (in front of the whole world ((red face)) no less) because maybe it will help you, Willa Gayle.

We're only in charge of doing the best we can at the time. The outcomes and ramifications are much bigger than any of us.

Love and More Love
Trinity

Dear LG,
My oldest two sons are in middle school (6th and 8th grades) and close in abilities. I let my oldest son try things first (guinea pig) and then try it on the next. For math, I've signed up for EPGY distance course for the oldest. He can try it for 3 months and then I can sign up the younger son. My oldest son has no one in his class to motivate him to learn as rapidly as he can, and he actually asked for this course, saying the last two years of math have been a waste (Moms just love hearing that, don't we? Especially when we think we're so intuned with all their educational needs, but they have failed to mention they've been coasting). I thought my younger son needed a little adjust time (new school, new curriculum) before adding a distance course, but in my mind they could inspire each other when he does start EPGY.
If my older son likes this distance learning thing, I think I'll incorporate it into his IEP so that he doesn't have to "waste" more time sitting through class, but can work online at that time (instead of doing extra at home).

Sibling rivalry is very tough though, and I think it's destructive to their relationship. I haven't figured out how to handle it with 2 of my other sons, except to keep them separate. They might be working on the same level math, but as long as the older one is always a few objectives ahead, it's been ok. The younger one who can work faster, deliberately does not because he doesn't want to catch up to his brother. I suggested he might want to skip more grades, but he immediately declined, saying, "I need to always be 2 grades behind [brother]," giving me a knowing look. Pretty astute for a 7 yr old.

"Pretty astute for a 7 yr old."

I'll say!
Trinity

Okay I need to know where did you place Mite? How is he doing?

Ok Gyus, now I need some help....
My DS11, gave us quite a headache last night.
He goes to charter school that accelerates in subjects and does ability grouping for math and language within a grade. So, my DS takes highest level grade 6 math, higest level language arts class (teacher opted out a textbook, instead they do novels and tons, tons of writing) and geometry (the school devoted two periods to math). But because he is the only sixth grader taking geometry, there are some scheduling conflicts. The school was really great trying to accomodate my DS, so last year, at the end of the fifth grade they gave him an end of level 6 th grade science test, which basically showed that he knows almost everything out of the 6th grade science core. So this year, while his "higher ability" class takes science, my DS has geometry and takes science with another class "not as bright", to quote his teacher. And here again they try to accomodate him, he does have an unlimited access to the computer on which he is to do research for his science projects coordinated by the teacher. But... there are lots of buts...everything is really complicated. Because he is doing science this way, sometimes he misses computer, which he really enjoys (they do coool things, like animated movies, ads etc...), so the teacher sends him to the computer lab. When this happens, he misses science for the day. Basically he never knows for sure what his schedule for the day is going to be. On top of that, he almost failed the last science quiz, becasue the teacher assumed that he is so brilliant he probably knows everything and she did not even gave him the script to study from, or maybe did not stress enough the importance of studying from it, I don't know ....
Another but.... he brings home copious amounts of homework, and yesterday on the way back from school I questioned his friend and it turns out that in his case homework is not such a big deal.
Yet another but....my DS is totally not motivated. If given a choice he would play on the computer all day long and stress about homework the last thing of the day.
My theory on what is happening goes like that: he plainly has too much freedom at school which he can't handle. Instead of concentrating on the work that needs to be done, because the teacher is going to check on it, he is just playing genius and spends time downloading music for his power point presentations . He is very smart but not very mature, he enjoys the company of younger kids (they do not question his strange play ideas????) and as I have mentioned he is absolutely not self motivated. Please tell me that this comes with age....
We have a conference with his teacher coming up in a couple of weeks and I am going to do something about his science curriculum. I will probably request a book for him, or maybe all the scripts that she teaches from, and make sure that he gets tested from each chapter. I do not want to remove the privilige of computer use, but what can I do to make my son control himslef a little better? I can't expect the teacher to control him all the time, she has another 24 students to take care of.
My dilema about my DS has to do with grade skipping. His math teacher asked us last year if we would consider it (much easier for the school to accomodate him that way)and we said no, based on his immaturity, his tendency to play with younger kids. I also believe that by skipping grades a certain advantage will be taken away from him - I am talking about competitions here.
I love his 6th grade teacher, she is so smart and so devoted to all the kids. 7/8 grade team does not look very bright to me, especially the english teachers. I was thinkig about maybe skipping 7 grade, but then again we are looking
into an IBprogram for High School, and they do not allow any acceleration. But if we skip 7th grade, then he will be a freshman ready to take pre-calculus, if we won't skip, he should be taking calculus his first year of HS, and nobody in an IB program will let him do that!
What to do? Why does it get even more complex the older they become? Would love to here from someone who has experience with middle/high school kids.And what to do about this total lack of self motivation?
Ania

The total lack of self motivation is a pretty normal reaction, I think. Especially at that age.

My son is only 7 - so I can't give you definitive answers, but we opted this year to be a completely normal third grader - just with a little extra enrichment (some computerized at school and some at home and personalized). The weird schedule last year (missing some of PE in order to do 4th grade math etc) was too hard on him. The stress was ridiculous.

We questioned the grade skip because of his maturity, but have found that a single year didn't make much difference - but maybe that is related to his age.

Oh well... no magic answers. Have you read Genius Denied? How to help your gifte child soar? Maybe some of them would be helpful

Mary

Ania, I can relate to so much of what you write about your son. The lack of self-motivation sure is frustrating.

My son is younger than yours (will be 8 next month) and exhibits many of the same traits. He would definitely play on the computer all day long if he could (but isn't that true of many adults, too!). He is impatient about doing homework, about practicing/studying for anything, or doing anything he views as unnecessary busywork. For example, he hates having to write an answer in a complete sentence instead of a short phrase. He wants to rush through schoolwork and get it over with, which means he makes careless mistakes. He often misses points because he doesn't read the complete directions. And yet, he cares very much about getting good grades and being viewed as smart. He is upset if he doesn't get good grades.

My son tends to get along well with either much older kids (if they will deign to play with him) or younger kids, because then he can be the leader. I also liked what you said about your son in this regard--that perhaps the younger kids don't question his strange play ideas.

I think your theory (too much freedom at school) is good. Is his computer time pretty much a free-for-all where he can do whatever he wants? Maybe you could work with the teacher to find ways to narrow the scope of what he can do with that time--create specific assignments he has to do on the computer.

Hi Ania,
My heart goes out to you.
here's a question - What, exactly does your son do on the computer? Is it meeting social needs, such as Runescape or World of Warcraft - or intellectual needs? Computer life is as varied as IRL, but much faster and easier - so I'm wondering what he's getting "out there."

I also think it's weird that he has to take science tests when he already placed out of science. Can he take a CC science class in the evening to entirely replace science - easing up the "chicken dance" a bit?

My DS10 also rushes through homework, particularly if the challenge level is too easy. I call it the "close your eyes and think of England" approach.(Not within his hearing - LOL!) Last week when he finally got math at an appropriate challenge level, I happend to be around, and it was a completely different experience - a steady pace, huffing and puffing, and satisfaction on arrival.

What does he say about the "whole thing?"

Just so you know - DS10 looses computer privaleges from time to time, 3 days or a full week, if he acts too demanding, or doesn't do his responsibilities. good details in Ending The Homework Hassle Paperback by John Rosemond.

Also - if you are part of the YSP, try the parents of teen email list or the Parent's Forum.

Best Wishes,
Trinty

Hi,
I just wanted to add to the issue of computer usage privileges. We have a house rule that the kids are not allowed to play Game-cube, Play station or entertainment-only computer games except on Fri, Sat, and Sun. This is a non-negotiable rule just like the requirement to wear a seatbelt. I think it has served them well in pursuing academic achievement.