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    #249109 - 08/21/21 06:27 AM college admissions question
    Wren Offline
    Member

    Registered: 01/14/08
    Posts: 1680
    DD is applying this fall. Reading about a 1-4 grade, 1 is the best, in 4 categories for application. 1) academics 2) extracurriculars 3) athletics 4) personal.

    Does anyone know what constitutes a 1 in these categories, what is a 2? How impressive does your stuff have to be? Do you have to be recruited as an athlete to get a 1, or being an nonrecruited decent tennis player get you a 3? Non athlete a 4? Extracurricular is so wide, I wouldn't even ask anyone. But personal? If legacy, does that get you a 1? If you are first time college AA, a 1? If you are upper class white kid with no hooks, a 4?

    And then what numbers get you in? 4 total for sure. And a kid with 4 should get in. But then, I wonder where the break is. A kid with great academics, 1, top violin international competitions, 1, no athetics, 4, personal, no hooks, 4. That is a 10. How many get 10?

    Just curious if anyone has insight.

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    #249111 - 08/22/21 07:02 PM Re: college admissions question [Re: Wren]
    philly103 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/02/17
    Posts: 89
    Originally Posted By: Wren
    DD is applying this fall. Reading about a 1-4 grade, 1 is the best, in 4 categories for application. 1) academics 2) extracurriculars 3) athletics 4) personal.

    Does anyone know what constitutes a 1 in these categories, what is a 2? How impressive does your stuff have to be? Do you have to be recruited as an athlete to get a 1, or being an nonrecruited decent tennis player get you a 3? Non athlete a 4? Extracurricular is so wide, I wouldn't even ask anyone. But personal? If legacy, does that get you a 1? If you are first time college AA, a 1? If you are upper class white kid with no hooks, a 4?

    And then what numbers get you in? 4 total for sure. And a kid with 4 should get in. But then, I wonder where the break is. A kid with great academics, 1, top violin international competitions, 1, no athetics, 4, personal, no hooks, 4. That is a 10. How many get 10?

    Just curious if anyone has insight.


    I'll give the break down that I took from the Harvard lawsuit. If you have the time, you should read the judicial opinion and some of the briefs and they get into more detail.

    In athletics, a "1" is someone they consider capable of starting in that sport, so someone who will make an immediate impact. A "4" is someone who barely made an impact on their high school team. 2) In extracurriculars, "1" is someone with national level recognition/rank in that activity. So, if they're in journalism then a "1" would be someone who managed to get published in a major publication while a "4" might be someone who barely contributed to the school paper.

    Personal: A "1" is someone where the recommendations sing the praises of the student with phrases like "One of the best I've ever taught...", "I've never had a student as teachable as ..." Things like that, the more personal, the better.

    Academics follows a similar breakdown where a "1" is high level achievement away from the classroom. For example, a student who is significantly contributing in a research lab at a decent university. A real life example I know is a high school junior who is working in the quantum computing department of an Ivy League university developing things for them right alongside their graduate students. I don't know if that's the minimum for a "1" but it's what a "1" might look like.

    So, since the Harvard lawsuit and the information came out, I've thought: 1 = national level achievement. 2 = regional achievement. 3 = county level achievement. 4 = participant with school level or less recognition.

    Depending on the school, a "1" really impresses and multiple "1"s makes someone a lock. Most kids are a combination of 2s and 3s with the very rare 1 in some category.

    Here's a copy of the judicial opinion where they include some detail, hope it helps as a starting point.

    See Reading Procedures - Page 19.

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    #249115 - 08/23/21 08:28 AM Re: college admissions question [Re: Wren]
    mithawk Offline
    Member

    Registered: 11/25/11
    Posts: 268
    Hi Wren,

    I spent a lot of time on College Confidential when the Harvard lawsuit results came out. Here is my summary about the two categories I remember best.

    * Athletics: 1 is a recruited athlete. 83% are admitted. A 2 would be someone at the state champion level. A 3 would be a good high school varsity athlete. Non-athletes are 4.
    * Academics: 1 is someone truly exceptional academically. There are fewer than 100 applicants that get this, and about 50% are admitted. Examples are IMO medalists, major science award winners, significant published research. Even though these are ECs, they get put into the academic category.

    Now, the vast majority of admitted students did not have even a single 1, but multiple 2s. There are also gradations such as 1- or 2+. Note that these are aggregate stats, including hooked students (obviously recruited athlete is a hook). Unhooked students have more rigorous admissions criteria.

    FYI, my son is a current Harvard student so if you have specific questions about that, feel free to PM me.

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