Gifted Bulletin Board

Welcome to the Gifted Issues Discussion Forum.

We invite you to share your experiences and to post information about advocacy, research and other gifted education issues on this free public discussion forum.
CLICK HERE to Log In. Click here for the Board Rules.

Links
DITD Logo

Learn about the Davidson Academy’s online campus for profoundly gifted students living anywhere in the U.S.

The Davidson Institute for Talent Development is a national nonprofit dedicated to supporting profoundly gifted students through the following programs:

  • Davidson Fellows Scholarship
  • Davidson Young Scholars
  • Davidson Academy
  • THINK Summer Institute
  • DITD FaceBook   DITD Twitter   DITD YouTube
    The Davidson Institute is on Facebook, Twitter and YouTube!

    How gifted-friendly is
    your state?

    Subscribe to the Davidson Institute's eNews-Update

    Who's Online
    0 registered (), 0 Guests and 328 Spiders online.
    Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
    Newest Members
    Paul Kevin, salubrious, Lorens, Devaki, kitiye
    10807 Registered Users
    August
    Su M Tu W Th F Sa
    1
    2 3 4 5 6 7 8
    9 10 11 12 13 14 15
    16 17 18 19 20 21 22
    23 24 25 26 27 28 29
    30 31
    Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
    Topic Options
    #246801 - 02/16/20 07:37 AM Study Skills class recommendations needed
    madeinuk Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/18/13
    Posts: 1446
    Loc: NJ
    Our DYS DD15 still struggles with perfectionism and I cannot but think that learning better study skills would help to take her out of this particular ‘Slough of Despond’.

    I have read that many bright kids paradoxically suffer from having anemic study skills so I raising this in the hope that others that have trodden the same path can share what worked here.
    _________________________
    Become what you are

    Top
    #246803 - 02/16/20 11:22 AM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: madeinuk]
    tigerhog Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 07/10/18
    Posts: 22
    I am still working on this one with my child. She *never* study for anything and the whole time I thought that's the way it supposed to be, in elementary and all. She just started middle school and I am hoping things will change but nope. Testing is her thing. Tests are always A+ but homeworks are a mess!

    Then I realize that I have nothing to offer either, because I didn't study myself (did just ok in college). To me, "to study" is synonym of "to memorize", which is weird and not exactly what I would call learning.

    Sorry nothing to add yet but I am totally watching this thread...

    Top
    #246804 - 02/16/20 11:48 AM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: madeinuk]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4227
    Understood.org exists to address learning differences and learning disabilities. Topics such as ADD/ADHD and Executive Function Skills are covered.

    Here is a link to one webpage from Understood.org, about learning and practicing Study Skills.

    Top
    #246832 - 02/18/20 07:18 AM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: madeinuk]
    Wren Offline
    Member

    Registered: 01/14/08
    Posts: 1543
    DD has had cycles. Beating her with a stick didn't work. OK, didn't really beat her but came close during some of those cycles. She would go from distracted with the social to acing the final math exam. Saying she didn't like chemistry and why she got the 2 on the test, to getting into it and acing the final last year. This year, she is in 10th grade and since she in private school, the guidance counsellor is working with her. She has to meet weekly, the GC talks to the teachers, it is like training her for the Olympics she is in a tight path to change habits and make them consistent. I tried for 3 years and couldn't figure it out. She had 5 days off this past weekend, due to the holiday and parent teacher interviews etc. She had 12 hours of Chinese tutoring, finished a history project, filmed a baking video she had to do for Spanish, plus study for bio and chem tests. And attended her technovation girls group. She had wanted to meet up with someone and go to the mall but she said she was really proud of herself getting so much done. She did take the dog on the beach everyday and go to the gym everyday. And spent the evenings binging on Next in Fashion. So she wasn't stuck in her room. But just focused on getting the work done at a level 5, instead of just doing it is hard to maintain. I am hoping the GC oversight, instead of me helps that.

    Top
    #246834 - 02/18/20 07:44 AM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: madeinuk]
    aeh Online   content
    Member

    Registered: 04/26/14
    Posts: 3637
    This is my usual go-to recommendation for study/homework skills:
    https://www.nasponline.org/books-and-products/products/books/titles/hops-for-parents

    It's a clearly laid-out, straightforward system for explicit instruction in study/homework/organization skills. This is the parent edition; there's also a school-based edition, which is designed to be used as a semester-long systematic intervention, including a couple of parent sessions.

    Here's the school-based volume:
    https://www.nasponline.org/books-and-products/products/books/titles/hops-interventions-for-schools

    Hard to beat the tips in Dawson/Guare. This is the teen edition:
    https://www.amazon.com/Smart-but-Scatter...82040763&sr=8-1

    They also have some organizational products:
    https://www.amazon.com/Work-Smart-Academic-Planner-Revised-Write/dp/1462530206/



    Edited by aeh (02/18/20 07:48 AM)

    Top
    #246848 - 02/23/20 09:11 AM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: tigerhog]
    pinewood1 Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 01/25/19
    Posts: 34
    Originally Posted By: tigerhog
    I am still working on this one with my child. She *never* study for anything and the whole time I thought that's the way it supposed to be, in elementary and all. She just started middle school and I am hoping things will change but nope. Testing is her thing. Tests are always A+ but homeworks are a mess!

    Then I realize that I have nothing to offer either, because I didn't study myself (did just ok in college). To me, "to study" is synonym of "to memorize", which is weird and not exactly what I would call learning.

    Sorry nothing to add yet but I am totally watching this thread...


    I think a lot of people conflate the common concept of "studying" (a weird procedure of reviewing/memorizing that I have never understood) with something else that gets called "study skills," which is more about time management and organization.

    Anyone can benefit from the latter, but the former doesn't work for a lot of higher LOG people.

    Personally, I'm the kind of higher LOG person that learns in "quantum leaps"/"zero to sixty," and always have been. It's not just a kid thing; I'm in my thirties. What has helped me gain more control over my learning process is not trying to shove myself in the "studying" box, but learning to recognize the patterns of when and how that largely subconscious process is likely to manifest, and learning to facilitate the conditions for it.

    (I can talk more about this if people would like, but I'm not sure how generally applicable what I have to say is.)

    Top
    #246849 - 02/23/20 12:25 PM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: madeinuk]
    Wren Offline
    Member

    Registered: 01/14/08
    Posts: 1543
    Learning material is one thing, but doing projects (which in the real world translates into a bunch of things -- covered in reports.) If you cannot develop the study habits to get the resources, do the research, organize the research, cite the research and write coherently, that is a problem. And for most kids who learn easily and quickly, the discipline to do good, quality research is a problem. I know. I had problems. And I had a job that required discipline and research. I had to explain my thinking in detail so others could understand my thinking. It was SO HARD. Hence I went from equity research to derivative trading wherre I explained nothing. But seriously. Getting it quickly, not required studying can be a real detriment. I am making my kid do detailed projects in history. A course this year that saw some slacking. I said you have to know how to do real research. The work. The detail. When you make quantum leaps, doing the detail research so that others can understand is an acquired skill. Hardest for HG kids in my opinion, who want to skip, hop and jump to conclusions they see more easily.

    Top
    #246850 - 02/23/20 02:21 PM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: Wren]
    aeh Online   content
    Member

    Registered: 04/26/14
    Posts: 3637
    This is the skill I explain to my children as communication. It's why you sometimes (often) have to show your work in math, even though the intervening steps seem obvious (or invisible, for some of the most math-y kids), and why the answers to your science test questions sometimes have to be in complete sentences. Some day, when you are solving real problems and inventing/discovering novel skills/processes/tools, etc., you will need to be able to communicate your thought process in sufficient detail that a person with no prior knowledge of your process (but reasonable general content expertise) would be able to reproduce it based on your documentation. So right now, your learning objective is not really only (or even primarily) the surface content of the assignment (which may be both lacking in cognitive challenge and personally irrelevant), but the highly transferable long-term skill of communicating your thinking. Effective communication is what will extend the reach of your thinking, problem solving and creativity beyond your immediate circumstances.

    Top
    #246851 - 02/23/20 02:50 PM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: aeh]
    pinewood1 Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 01/25/19
    Posts: 34
    Yeah, exactly. If you can look at stuff like this (and stuff like being the assigned class tutor) as an exercise in learning psychology and communication skills, everything becomes much more interesting.

    Top
    #246852 - 02/23/20 02:57 PM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: aeh]
    MumOfThree Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/07/11
    Posts: 1628
    Loc: Australia
    Originally Posted By: aeh
    This is the skill I explain to my children as communication. It's why you sometimes (often) have to show your work in math, even though the intervening steps seem obvious (or invisible, for some of the most math-y kids), and why the answers to your science test questions sometimes have to be in complete sentences. Some day, when you are solving real problems and inventing/discovering novel skills/processes/tools, etc., you will need to be able to communicate your thought process in sufficient detail that a person with no prior knowledge of your process (but reasonable general content expertise) would be able to reproduce it based on your documentation. So right now, your learning objective is not really only (or even primarily) the surface content of the assignment (which may be both lacking in cognitive challenge and personally irrelevant), but the highly transferable long-term skill of communicating your thinking. Effective communication is what will extend the reach of your thinking, problem solving and creativity beyond your immediate circumstances.


    Bingo! Such a shame it is rarely possible for our children to actually get INTERESTING work, where this part of the effort seems like a valid thing to do, relative to the content it is required for.

    Top
    #246854 - 02/24/20 03:06 AM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: madeinuk]
    Wren Offline
    Member

    Registered: 01/14/08
    Posts: 1543
    I agree that it is communication. But how do you teach good communication skills? Besides just showing your work. I had a prof in engineering that was really good at explaining, giving examples. I still remember his teaching, these decades later because it was unusual. Not just the writing equations on the board and copying it down. What is the skill set that develops good communication? I had a friend, brilliant. Practically a perfect average graduating from Physics, then PhD in related. She was offered classified jobs. She questioned how I could go into business. Two years after research, she said, now I know why you went into business. And she went into project management and consulting. That requires serious discipline in writing skills. A kid never knows where they may end up in life and the skills necessary.

    Top
    #246855 - 02/24/20 03:56 AM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: madeinuk]
    cricket3 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 11/02/09
    Posts: 665
    This is one reason I think the oft-dreaded group projects, and presentations, can have real value. It obviously depends on how the projects/presentations are implemented, but if well done, they have great value. It’s one way where ‘differentiation’ can happen organically, and if done thoughtfully, can be a real learning experience.
    This was done really well in my kids’ foreign language classes- they were constantly preparing videos, written work and oral presentations (for obvious reasons). For some reason, it was less well-done in English courses, though there was certainly emphasis on written work there. DD had a great class in AP bio where this was done particularly well. The lab portion had a lot of focus on communication, which took it well beyond the basic lab. For some labs, groups had to prepare posters, as in a scientific poster session, and present them. They did serious critiquing of each other’s posters, as well- lots of emphasis on reasoning, but also clear, effective communication.
    It is one of the main reasons we found the science olympiad team to be valuable, as well (and something I suspect kids also learn in other team settings, to some degree). In our experience, any smart kid can self-study advanced topics (minor hyperbole, I admit), but learning to work well together and balance workload and responsibilities, discover and respect and use each kids individual areas of strength, for the greater success of a group- that is an entirely different thing. There was a significant emphasis here on writing clearly, oral communication and managing group dynamics, motivations, egos, etc. And I agree, it’s difficult to teach unless it is valued by both the teacher and the learner (and this is probably less and less common, as there is not a ready-made assessment to measure this kind of thing).


    Edited by cricket3 (02/24/20 05:31 AM)
    Edit Reason: Typos

    Top
    #246859 - 02/25/20 05:39 AM Re: Study Skills class recommendations needed [Re: madeinuk]
    cricket3 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 11/02/09
    Posts: 665
    So, madeinuk, I was re-reading this thread and feel like your original question got a bit lost.

    Do you have more specifics on what you’re looking for? You asked about a class in the title, are you asking for suggestions about a class explicitly for study skills? You mentioned perfectionism and despondency, maybe more details would help others to understand what you are looking for. Part of the problem may be as others have noted, “studying” is kind of a broad term and has many different interpretations.

    I’m sorry but we don’t have any help as far as classes go, although I do know others who have taken classes of this sort, everything from speed-reading to organizational/time management strategies to specific test prep classes, though I’m not clear if that’s what you’re asking about.

    As far as studying academically goes, as you noted in your question, our kids didn’t seem to do a lot of that, though I think it really depends on what type of class/subject you’re talking about. So many classes in HS were much more about written work or presentations, I feel like there were not many typical “tests”.
    For things like math and science, the teachers did a lot of scaffolding (too much, in my opinion) where there was often a review packet or similar materials that were assigned, so everyone had to do it- this was more than enough. If that’s not happening, I think I would have her look for problems to work, either in the textbook or online, or in a review book, that correspond with the unit/material. For things like history, the AP classes did have a lot of multiple choice “quizzes”- these my kids did study for, as the level of detail and volume of material was crazy. They had to take notes on the readings for class, so these were reviewed (sometimes re-writing/organizing them can help and is enough to commit them to memory). They also used material from review books specific to the subject where they could basically do practice questions or tests. I think this is a good strategy for standardized tests, too. Our library offers free practice tests for SAT and ACT testing a couple times a year, given under the same conditions as a real test, though you could certainly replicate much of this at home. I have also heard that the Kahn academy SAT materials are good, though no direct experience.

    If the issue is perfectionism, we definitely have experience with that, as I’m sure many others here do. I can’t say that we managed it that effectively, to be honest. The most helpful things we did do involved finding opportunities outside of the regular classroom where learning (and sometimes studying) happened, so that it was kind of divorced from grades, the competitive atmosphere of peers, etc. We made sure to emphasize the learning and not the grade, and generally didn’t put much stock in things like GPA, though that is hard to avoid if your school values it (ours is thankfully moving away from this trend, and reports only which decile kids fall into). Studying music helped for DD, though she had to wait until high school and wider opportunities were presented before she was able to stretch herself and really need/want to work hard at it. I’ve mentioned the science olympiad team before- again, this was an opportunity where motivations were related to a group effort and common good, very important for my socially-focused DD. I think athletics, even volunteering, or other challenging opportunities where kids are out of their comfort zone and want to/have to push themselves to improve can be a huge help. You want to find a way to tap into their intrinsic motivation, though that can be hard to find, I know.

    Hope some of this ramble is helpful, and that your DD finds what works for her.

    Top
    Page 1 of 2 1 2 >


    Moderator:  M-Moderator 
    Recent Posts
    Career/taking control of my life at 26
    by raphael
    Yesterday at 09:54 AM
    Does anyone have experience of this program?
    by nialcoxworth
    Yesterday at 04:35 AM
    Aging
    by aeh
    08/02/20 08:46 AM
    Equity for 2e students / Neurodiversity-Disab
    ility

    by indigo
    08/02/20 07:23 AM
    How bad is the social aspect of grade skipping?
    by Eagle Mum
    08/01/20 09:47 PM
    Davidson Institute Twitter