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    Joined: May 2012
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    Irena Offline OP
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    Hello all!

    Need some advocacy advice and tips! My son, who has dysgraphia and dyspraxia, also gifted, is in the accelerated honors math program at his middle school. He is in 7th grade and is finishing up Algebra I. He has been in accelerated math since 4th grade. He is slated to move on to Honors Geometry next school year. However, the school is offering a summer e-school geometry course this summer that will fulfill the requirement of geometry. Technically, it is only open to those finishing 8th grade and above, not finishing 7th graders (rising 8th graders) like my son. However, since the accelerated honors 7th grade students are supposedly ready for geometry next year, and are slated to move on to geometry, the school is "piloting" a program for the rising 8th grade honors math students to take the summer geometry e-course. This "pilot" program started last year and this the second year of it. When I called to inquire I was told that, in order to be allowed to take the course, the student has to "fit a certain profile." [Here we go, right? I bet that "certain profile" does not include an IEP for a learning disability.] So, I persisted with the curriculum director to have him tell me exactly what the placement rubric is. My son got all A- grades last year in Honors math (93s each quarter). This year, my son got a B the first quarter; an A (95%) the second; and, it looks like he is getting at least a 95% this quarter and who knows what he will get for the last quarter as that has not started yet. He is also in Honors Science and is getting As (95%) there consistently. The curriculum director is telling me the "profile" is that he has to have 98%s overall in his honors math and in his honors science and has to have "teacher recommendations. Now, to be perfectly honest, my son wants to take this course for the mere reason that he hates geometry and would LOVE to get over it with in a 8 week summer e-course and move on to Algebra II because he loves Algebra (I hate math and Algebra so I can not relate to that but I can relate to trying to get a class you do not care for over quickly in the summer). He decided not to do CTY this summer and I think this is great idea to do this instead. However, I am getting a strong feeling from the school that they do not want him doing the course. The curriculum director actually seems quite against the course in general, saying studies show that middle schools who do this type of thing get "burned out" etc. I think the pilot was started last year by a different director and so that may be why this director seems overall against the idea in general.

    Nonetheless, I persisted. So, now, we have meeting next month with the IEP team, as well as the curriculum director and the middle school principal to discuss my son being permitted to do the summer geometry e-course.

    My questions for all of you fine folks are:

    (1) How hard should I push for my son to do this? My husband, a math guy (an engineer) seems to think our kiddo will have no problem with this, that it is a good idea and that he should definitely do it. My husband did something similar when he was in school and did not regret it. It is one course over the summer, plenty of time in the day to work on it. Husband or tutor can teach my son the material if he needs more one-on-one instruction. I think it is great idea because why waste a whole summer playing video games when you can get geometry out of the way to free up your schedule in the future to take college level math courses or other electives, languages etc.

    (2) How do I push for this? I think my kiddo substantially meets the requirements. He has had As in science since he started middle school. He has mostly As in his honors math classes, too, with the exception of a B grade in 1st quarter. However, The B first quarter is a problem I suppose. There were a lot of problems 1st semester. For example, my son got lyme disease and that hurt him.

    I'll be honest, my suspicion is they do not want him doing the course because he has an IEP. Just my suspicion. I am sure none of the kiddos who did it last year have IEPs for any disabilities.

    Advice appreciated!

    Last edited by Irena; 04/04/19 12:11 PM.
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    Hi Irena,

    I can not help with the advocacy at the school (our past experience with advocacy has been very mixed, to put it mildly).

    Have you considered AOPS 'Intro to Geometry' class instead?

    (It is $545 with the books: textbook + solution manual.)

    https://artofproblemsolving.com/school/course/catalog/intro-geometry?utm_source=Catalog_Side .

    The upcoming classes (24 weeks):
    - Apr 8 - Sep 30
    - Apr 26 - Oct 4.

    The AOPS class is going to be better than the local one. On the other hand, it is going to be more difficult. (Would your school be OK with grade 'B', for example?) You can judge the difficulty of the class in advance by buying the textbook (and the solution manual) first.

    Here is info on grades and documentation:

    https://artofproblemsolving.com/school/handbook/current/documentation .

    Normally it takes a few weeks after the end of the class for AOPS to produce a grade report but if you ask them and explain the situation I am pretty sure they can rush the grade report.

    AOPS classes are WASC accredited.

    https://artofproblemsolving.com/school/handbook/prospective/accreditation


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    If the requirement really is 98% in the prerequisite the I guess he doesn't meet the requirement. But I would want to be sure that is a real requirement. From where I am 98% should not be consistently attainable and there should only occasionally be someone with that kind of average. If people are frequently getting grades in the mid to high 90's I would say the course is too easy or the testing regime faulty.

    I do know however it is a bit different in the US.

    Last edited by puffin; 04/04/19 01:54 PM.
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    Irena Offline OP
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    I feel like the 98% is just not .. real. An "A" equals 94%-98% in my son's school- so why does it have to be 98%? And, really, are there kids getting pretty much perfect scores (nothing under 98%) across the board in both math and science? And why such a high requirement in Algebra and Science for a geometry course? It doesn't really make sense to me that the only kids they are letting in to the program have 98%s in both subjects for all 4 quarters for a geometry course. I am skeptical. Also, I do find that schools try to make parents give up. Not sure why. Like, the curriculum director kept trying to dissuade me from the course for my son. If you really believe the course is such a bad idea overall why are you still offering it? It just seems silly. Obviously if my kid is getting mostly As in honors math and science, he will not have problem. Really.

    Last edited by Irena; 04/04/19 05:17 PM.
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    How important for you is it to do this particular summer e-course in geometry? I have heard of some schools requiring 95% or above in each quarter to get into a honors math course for summer. Those schools are reputed to be "rigorous", whatever that may mean.
    The 98% cutoff seems to be a little on the high side - as if they want kids who score consistently A+ in their math and science tests. If that were the case, why not look at other options available for summer honors geometry courses? There are various math enrichment centers offering them and you can find some locally depending on where you live. AOPS has a geometry online course that runs through summer as well.
    If your son finishes geometry on his own through other resources, you can ask the school if he can test out of geometry and be placed in Alg II for 8th.

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    Irena Offline OP
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    It's not a very big deal to me. It's really him - like I said, he wants to take this course for the mere reason that he hates geometry and would LOVE to get over it with in a 8 week summer e-course and move on to Algebra II because he really likes Algebra. Thanks for the idea to ask if he can take a similar course somewhere else and then test out. I'll see if he is interested in that and if that would work with the school if they do not let him in.

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    I have no experience with an IEP but you may take something out of my 11th graders story. She was advanced in math as part of a magnet program in our K-8 district. She had geometry in 7th and algebra 2 in 8th grade. I remember because she was getting perfect scores on every test. High school came and there was no other in a class of 500. She was in 9th and 10 th grade with kids typically 2years older than her. She got a B first semester 10th grade in Calculus BC. She got an A second semester and a 4 on the AP and she was done. MultivarIable Calculus typically is next but she had no interest. This year she has AP stats and is not planning to take a math class next year. Other kids in the magnet program continued on while others didn’t get to BC. In her I believe the push back in 3rd grade was good but I believe it caught up with her in high school.
    In your case even if you get in the summer program algebra is done after next year. Just my opinion it seems your son and your husband are in a hurry to get no where fast. Back to my daughter I believe the junior kids at her school taking BC now were probably more ready for the class this year than my daughter was last year. Again your story may be much different than ours.

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    Irena Offline OP
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    Originally Posted by nicoledad
    In her I believe the push back in 3rd grade was good but I believe it caught up with her in high school.

    What does this mean? that you think she went to fast and had holes in her foundation?

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    Irena Offline OP
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    And do you think she got burned out? Or was it just that she ran out of course to take?

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    I don’t think she had holes in her foundation. Calculus is a bit of a different world. Burn out combined with things catching up with her. High school is much different than junior high. As for classes her school had more classes after BC that wasn’t the problem. Every kid is different. Would your son have four years of math classes to take in high school.

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