Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Age or Ability Specific Forums College Americans attending college in Canada

Have any American residents sent their children to a Canadian university for a bachelor's degree, or seriously considered doing so? What are some differences in the application process and the college experience to be aware of? (I know these are broad questions, but I know little about Canadian universities.)

The University of Toronto is highly ranked in computer science, which is my eldest son's main academic interest. It is much closer to Boston than some California schools he may apply to.

I'm not an expert on the U.S. system and my kids are still young enough that my personal experience is rather dated but I'll take a crack at this anyway.

Application process - my general overall comment is that admissions here are based on marks and that is all (at least for most undergraduate programs/schools). I think Waterloo is an exception to that and it is more complicated, not sure if UofT would fall into that boat as well. There is lots of info on the UofT website but I couldn't access the actual forms to see what you have to fill in. I know it was pretty simple back when I applied to university - picked a program, sent marks and waited for a yes. Admittedly, that was a while ago so hopefully someone with more recent experience can jump in with current info.

College experience - like the U.S. there is a wide variety of schools here so it is hard to generalize the "experience". UofT is a very large urban school. According to this https://www.macleans.ca/schools/university-of-toronto/ ~10% of students live in residence which means a lot of students live off campus which is going to be different than a smaller university town with lots of students living on campus. I suspect it would be very comparable experience to a large urban U.S. college.

Some other random thoughts -

Cost of living - the U.S. dollar is strong right now which will help and Canadian tuition is pretty cheap even when you have to pay international rates (although that depends on what you're comparing it to - a State school vs MIT - there is quite a range). I'm not sure how scholarships work for international students but many of my coworker's children have received amazing scholarships here. Toronto is not the cheapest place to live in Canada but it is likely cheaper than many large U.S. cities. Flights to Boston aren't insanely priced and driving isn't impossible.

With a UofT comp-sci degree he should have no problem with applying to jobs in the U.S. Many of the big tech companies recruit from there (as well as many other Canadian schools).

I would suggest that he looks into coop or internship programs if possible. I'm not sure what UofT has to offer along those lines, I've worked with some UofT grads but I can't recall coming across any coops or interns (it has been a while since I've been somewhere that hired students at all). As an alternative option, Waterloo Comp-Sci coop would be VERY competitive to get into but the work experience puts grads at the head of the line when they graduate. It is also great for students to figure out what they really want to do before they are looking for full time work (and earn some cash along the way). There are many other Canadian schools that offer coop (generally it extends the B.Sc. by a year and you do 4-6 4 month work terms) or internship (in between 3rd and 4th year you work for 16 months) and different schools offer different programs (it can vary by program - where I went Engineering did internships, comp-sci did coop for example). Application for those programs is often more competitive (again based on marks - or at least it was back in the day). I'm not sure how work visas (or whatever paperwork you'd need) would work exactly - that would be worth asking if he went that route. Most schools have some international placements (including the U.S.) so they should be able to sort all of that out.

Drinking age - the drinking age in Ontario is 19. If you look at other schools, it is 18 in some provinces. I mention this for grade skipped students since it has the potential to be obvious in first or second year (rather than later on if they live where it is 21).

You might want to check this out - https://www.macleans.ca/education-hub/ Every year the magazine publishes a big university guide and rating (maybe check your local library for a hard copy). There is lots of info there to go through. As with any rating system, there is lots of room for arguing the specifics but it gives some ideas.

U of T is strongly ranked for comm sci, but I’d recommend Waterloo over

The two universities mentioned are in Ontario, and applications are made through a common online portal (OUAC,but I believe that the service may only be offered to Ontario resident applicants.) Entrance criteria are based on marks (north of 90% for U of T, if I recall correctly, and above 95% for Waterloo. Students also have entrance essays to complete, they need 2-3 academic references, and a listing of extracurricular and leadership positions,

I will add this— I’m going to strongly encourage my DS to stay in Canada for his undergrad if he doesn’t receive substantial financial aid to an international school. We have several highly ranked universities that are both more affordable and well regarded by recruiters, both in Canada and the US. I’ve attended three Canadian universities, and all have had recruitment from the most competitive organizations in those fields.

Now, a word of caution—the US is getting rather bizarre in its foreign policy behaviour (e.g, listing Canada as a security threat from the War of 1812.) If your son studies in Canada, he may never want to return!

Canadian Citizenship and Immigration documents for students- https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/study-canada.html
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/information/applications/student.asp

Ontario guidelines for post-secondary study
https://www.ontario.ca/page/study-ontario-international-students

Just to add: Canadian universities are quite hungry these days for the extra tuition international students bring. If you call the schools of interest, I imagine they will be highly motivated to help you.

I would also agree that while UoT is a highly reputable school, if CS or engineering is your son's goal, a co-op degree from Waterloo has been a golden ticket to employment for about 50 years. (Note Waterloo is a small town and a pretty different environment from Toronto. Though if you are in co-op, you'll be moving around a lot anyways).

A different kind of consideration if you attend a Canadian school - there was a thread here a year or two ago comparing the types of courses students were typically required to take for a degree, with some international comparisons. You may find a Canadian undergrad degree is more intensely focused on its core subject than is usual in the US: we don't have a Gen Ed model. (In my day, for instance, first year chemistry involved math, chemistry, physics and CS (all versions specific to chem/ science majors), with an elective (anything whatsoever). Subsequent years were almost fully chemistry and chem-related courses). I've looked at some examples of the "required courses" for a degree more recently, and while there seem to be more requirements for courses outside your program, it varies quite a bit both from program to program, as well as from school to school, so you may find it's worth a look for preferred fit.

Aquinas - there's essays now?! ugh. There is, alas, some movement towards the US's more "holistic" entrance requirements, but again, this is going to vary enormously not just by university, but by faculty and program, so look up your specifics.

Same variation in giving credit for APs (it will be hardest to get at Waterloo, but still varies by program).

We are in the U.S. and went through the college application process for our twins this past year. One applied to UToronto for Physics. UToronto held an open house for international prospective applicants the Saturday following Thanksgiving and ds and dh went.

At the open house, they made a big deal about differences in their application process - decisions are based almost entirely on curriculum, grades and test scores, i.e., significantly less (or no) emphasis on essays, lor and extracurriculars!

They have a terrific physics department, and therefore it was a short-listed school for ds. Plus, they have a scholarship program for international students called the Pearson scholarship - a full ride. They award quite a few of these each year.

So ds was offered admission and the Pearson, but turned it down for a private college in the U.S. And although it was financially a painful decision for the parents, it was a logical choice for the particular kid involved. UToronto is a big urban school, and although that might have been a plus for me when I was going off to college, ds chose a small, close-knit experience.

Thought of one more random small thing - slightly different school calendar (I think). Canadian universities generally start the first week of September and go until Christmas. I often wrote exams as late as Dec 23 (but I was in an exam heavy major). Most schools do a few "reading days" in Oct and of course he wouldn't have American Thanksgiving off (Canadian Thanksgiving is mid-Oct and less of a big thing).

Second Semester starts in Jan (usually had ~2 weeks off between semesters) and exams are the end of April. I think most (if not all) schools do a week off in Feb.

Some Universities offer summer courses in a compressed format - one semester in May/June and then another in July/August. Co-op schools are more likely to offer a third 4 month semester and have more courses available. My major had pretty much zero course offerings from May-Aug (most students went home and/or worked). Some did take their very few options to get them out of the way.

Reading week is usually in Feb, because that’s statistically when the most suicides occurred.

Ouch! A free ride at a natural feeder to the Ivies and Oxbridge?

Thanks to everyone who replied. I think I should dig in to the admissions web site of a school such as Toronto or Waterloo.

A drinking age of 18 or 19 in Canadian provinces was mentioned. The drinking age of 21 in the U.S. does not make sense to me. I wonder if Canadian universities have a smaller or bigger problem with alcohol abuse than American universities.

Dang - you sent me down the rabbit hole. Interesting question. Lousy data, though.

The only decent comparison I found is old, but from other bits and pieces I read, I suspect its conclusion probably still generally holds: Canadian students are more likely to drink, but American students are more likely to drink heavily.

http://archive.sph.harvard.edu/cas/Documents/Canadian1/CanadaPaper.pdf

It's worth noting a huge amount has changed in the last 20 years since this study, though. Two particular things worth noting: First, Ontario eliminated grade 13 in 2003, so all first-year students would now be assumed to be under the drinking age (19 in Ontario). As a result, alcohol is no longer part of sanctioned frosh activities, and is increasingly being reduced, especially in residences . Second, campuses have been taking their role in controlling youth drinking with increasing seriousness and most are actually doing something about it these days. (Youth overall in both countries are drinking a lot less, too. Also, Canada doesn't have much in the way of frats, UofT excepted, so that helps).

My guess is that young students will find what they are looking for. Those exploding out of control with their first taste of freedom will be able to hunt down all the wildness they want - but the significant portion who are there to learn and grow will find no shortage of like-minded peers and a generally-supportive atmosphere. Eek - it kinda all comes back to how well we as parents have managed to prepare them for this independence - and I am very, very aware that some kids take to that far more easily than others. (ADHD and risk taking, ulp).