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    #240507 - 11/18/17 06:55 AM UPDATE: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e
    ellemenope Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/16/11
    Posts: 155
    DD is currently in 4th grade. She is given enrichment work for math at about the 5th or 6th grade level. But she has never gotten any instruction. It's just busy work. And while her reading enrichment is online the math is hand outs and she is struggling with the writing demands and keeping it clear when the answer requires a lot of steps. She still does well enough to progress at a good rate, but she has voiced concern about her handwriting and sloppiness holding her back.

    Right now she's just kind of figuring things out as she goes. So it's very likely that a problem that could be done in 3 steps she's doing in 7. And she is getting frustrated because while she understands what she is doing, when a problem takes 7 steps it is easy to make a small mistake ESPECIALLY when you have poor handwriting.

    I'm also clueless when it comes to math at this age. She is not a math kid. She is a verbal kid and is set to ace the verbal portion of the SAT. Math teacher conceded she is amazing at arithmetic but tempered that with a comment about working on problem solving. Concepts do come easier to her. Her math score on the WIAT was in the 140s as was her quantitative score on the WISC.

    2e math is so fun! She is accelerated in math but needs tutoring?


    Edited by ellemenope (04/18/18 11:47 AM)

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    #240511 - 11/18/17 11:46 AM Re: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e(dysgraphia) [Re: ellemenope]
    aeh Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/26/14
    Posts: 3457
    For handwriting and assistive technology, take a look at the Google Chrome extension EquatIO, from texthelp, or MathTalk, from the publishers of Dragon Naturally Speaking.

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    #240513 - 11/18/17 12:45 PM Re: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e(dysgraphia) [Re: Portia]
    ellemenope Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/16/11
    Posts: 155
    Originally Posted By: Portia
    Instruction is not tutoring. She cannot be expected to figure out some of the math concepts without being taught. Gifted just doesn't work that way. If the school is unwilling to provide a brief period of instruction (sometimes as litle as 20 mins per session), then she needs it from somewhere else.

    As for the handwriting. There are those on the board that will have better suggestions. My thoughts are to see if she can use one of the math language programs (like Latex) and type her answers.


    She has never received instruction. From what I can gather she is either given math puzzles or arithmetic work when she shows mastery of whatever the class is working on. For example, at the beginning of the year they were working on long division, and she told me she was given puzzles with long division and multiplication but with missing numbers.

    I think the arithmetic busy work has examples at the top of the page and she has worked incrementally. I just don't know what to think. I feel like the differentiation that I have seen by this math teacher is extremely well thought out. I'm actually quite impressed. I don't see how he could do much more, and I'm just thankful it's recognized that DD doesn't have to sit through lessons she doesn't need.

    Recently, she couldn't figure something out on her own and asked her teacher. I think it was converting decimals to fractions on a timed test (while class does fluency drills at different levels) Her teacher told her to just wait until the whole class went over it and gave her handwriting practice instead. She was upset about that. Enough to come home and tell me! Then two weeks later she told me she got the same sheet again. She "guessed" and got most of them right. So she figured it out. This tells me she wants the work and likes the challenge of figuring things out. So I'm just thankful she has these opportunities.

    I do hate she is lacking clear instruction. What really spurred this post was I noticed she was changing mixed numbers into improper fractions and then finding the common denominator and then subtracting. She was getting the right answers most of the time, but it was more work than necessary. This stuff doesn't come easy to me, so I can't just teach her off the cuff. I need a book. And the point is she needs clear instruction because of her dysgraphia.

    She doesn't get instruction at her reading level either. That could be another post. Next year will be more of the same, and then things will be different in 6th grade. For now she is challenged by a robust writing curriculum that includes grammar. She fails spelling. And sometimes math is difficult for her. We are happy because she seems happy.

    I just don't know where to begin with math. I guess spam me with the best math curriculums or online programs as well as literally how to figure out where to begin in these. Something I've learned about her: She doesn't like review.

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    #240514 - 11/18/17 01:03 PM Re: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e(dysgraphia) [Re: aeh]
    ellemenope Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/16/11
    Posts: 155
    Originally Posted By: aeh
    For handwriting and assistive technology, take a look at the Google Chrome extension EquatIO, from texthelp, or MathTalk, from the publishers of Dragon Naturally Speaking.


    Thank you! We were thinking about a chromebook for Christmas. We got her an iPad last year and put cowriter on it.

    She is oddly so resistant to technology. She plays no video games. She just has very little interest. I've always wondered if it was because of her visual processing disorder. Learning to type has gone nowhere. And she's not taken to assistive technology at all. I think it will be great for writing eventually. I could be wrong, but I can't imagine typing math work would be easier for her. She has pretty sloppy writing, but she's never experienced fatigue or pain. And she actually writes fast. I don't want her to have to type math either if I'm being honest.

    She would totally benefit from just having twice as much room per problem. And she would be unstoppable with a math scribe.

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    #240515 - 11/18/17 01:28 PM Re: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e(dysgraphia) [Re: ellemenope]
    aeh Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/26/14
    Posts: 3457
    To clarify, the two apps I mentioned are speech-to-text for math, not typing math.

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    #240516 - 11/18/17 01:34 PM Re: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e(dysgraphia) [Re: ellemenope]
    ellemenope Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/16/11
    Posts: 155
    Oh, I see. I think I had watched a tutorial last year that was typing. I will look into this again. She may really like that.

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    #242146 - 04/18/18 11:46 AM Re: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e(dysgraphia) [Re: ellemenope]
    ellemenope Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/16/11
    Posts: 155
    Update: itís been about 5 months.

    After standardized test results and parent-teacher conferences DD9 started a new online math program as homework. (she otherwise never brings anything home.) I try to get her to do about 10 min a day. Iím not great at achieving this.

    The program (mathletics) has instructional videos but I can also encourage her to try Kahn academy. She is 1/3 the way through 7th grade.

    I also bought a workbook for her called prealgebra essential skills by fisher. I was hoping it had a lot of room to write. It is ok in that regard. Not great. But itís also very easy conceptually. And nothing looks too hard flipping through it. Though I do think there is plenty of new concepts. She is secure on order of operations, with fractions, negatives, and fractions with exponents. Oh, and prime factorization which sheís applied to finding LCM. I think I have that right. But I think I saw new stuff in the workbook. I thought she could do it for fun over the summer.

    Something I noticed: her penmanship has improved tremendously. It seems like the more secure she is about the math the better her handwriting.

    She is coasting at school. She has a great math teacher this year.

    The fastest possible track at her school is Algebra I in 7th. While I have no desire to push her too hard in math with her disability, Iím also thinking she will be more than ready as it is over 2 years away. But I am a little concerned.

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    #244732 - 01/28/19 11:12 AM Re: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e(dysgraphia) [Re: ellemenope]
    ellemenope Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/16/11
    Posts: 155
    Originally Posted By: ellemenope
    The fastest possible track at her school is Algebra I in 7th. While I have no desire to push her too hard in math with her disability, Iím also thinking she will be more than ready as it is over 2 years away. But I am a little concerned.

    Quoting myself to update. This is still true, but we may have a strong case for algebra I in 6th grade.

    A barrier to this is a scheduling conflict.

    DD(10) is currently finishing AOPS Algebra online and getting loads of problem solving enrichment at school that is at about the 7-8th grade level.

    She prefers some kind of challenging math in her life because it makes her happy.

    Also, she is a highly gifted reader and reasoner. We really need proper above level testing for this which means ACT or SAT soon. I donít want to hurt her chances on the math portion.There is a chance she would qualify for DYS.

    From what Iíve read AOPS is most recommended for challenge and depth. Itís working fine. I think studying ahead 1/2 years is ideal for her because of her dysgraphia. But I could be wrong. Iím interested in stories of working ahead without acceleration.

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    #244739 - 01/29/19 08:15 AM Re: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e(dysgraphia) [Re: ellemenope]
    Portia Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/17/13
    Posts: 1764
    Hello ellemenope,
    There are many very strong mathy children who work AoPS along with the iMACS math. This might give you the expansion you seek without acceleration. Warning - iMACS is pricey.

    https://www.eimacs.com/

    In addition, AoPS offers Introduction to Counting and Probability as well as Introduction to Number Theory, which are very enjoyable courses that are not covered within the mainstream math programs. This might provide a diversion of sorts. They are 12 week courses, but you can work on your own if you like.

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    #244778 - 02/06/19 11:45 AM Re: math supplement w/ instruction for 2e(dysgraphia) [Re: ellemenope]
    ellemenope Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/16/11
    Posts: 155
    Thanks for the help, Portia! DD will begin probability in March which should take her close to schoolís end. Next year she should start geometry.

    I should be more clear. I do not want to hold her back from studying math on her own. My concern is that if accelerated she might be forced to learn math beyond calculus in high school when maybe she wonít want to.

    Unfortunately, dh and I know nothing about coding or computer science (or high level math for that matter.) DD isnít interested and we donít know where to begin with getting her interested.

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