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    #233327 08/30/16 09:34 AM
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    DS9 is in occupational therapy. He is not dx w/ dysgraphia but has almost all the symptoms. He doesn't put proper spacing between letters and words. If there are spaces, they are usually in the wrong spot. He isn't reversing letters but is excessively slow writing the alphabet. Sometimes his 0's look like 9's, pencil strokes on anything are not consistent and his writing looks very much like preschool writing. On the BOT for fine motor he was in the 5th or 6th percentile for most of it, but the motor coordination subtest of the Beery VMI he was .02 percentile (I think this involved doing mazes and staying in the lines, which he didn't). His overall score on the Beery VMI when he did it in the past (without the motor coordiation subtest, which may be supplemental), was around 65th percentile becasue he does fine on visual perceptual tests. So the poor motor coordination subtest goes along with his DCD diagnosis from a few years ago. He has an awkward pencil grip, tends to press down too hard or too lightly when he writes, complains about his hand hurting after a while, etc. He has low muscle tone/low strength in general.

    The OT can't diagnose dysgraphia but has been doing visual perceptual type activities w/ him. But here's the thing. DS can draw perfect, detailed maps from memory. I gave him 4 sticky notes with the names of random states written on them (Alabama, Missouri, Ohio, and North Carolina)--I deliberately didn't do any "square" states. His drawings are almost perfect. Who knows that there is a little protrubance on the bottom left side of Alabama with a bay in the middle? But DS did know that because it's in his drawing. DS has never been to Alabama. He did these drawings in about 1.5 min. for all of them. The only thing that's a little off is that North Carolina isn't quite skinny enough. He has never drawn any of these states before and he hasn't been studying maps, or at least not in a way that is odd or obsessive. He does tend to enjoy looking at maps.

    So how am I to reconcile this with his preschool level artwork at school, illegible handwriting, not lining up columns for math, not writing on lines...basically all of his schoolwork is a mess, no matter what it is? What is his issue? If you can draw a perfect outline of Ohio from memory, shouldn't you be able to write a legible 9 and put spaces between your words?


    Last edited by blackcat; 08/30/16 08:10 PM.
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    My limited understanding is that you are actually using a different part of your brain when drawing from what you use when writing. In fact, that's part of why some dysgraphics can produce very neat writing, albeit very slowly, when pressed - they are "drawing" each letter instead of writing it.

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    I wish I had one of my severely dysgraphic ds' preschool drawings handy where I could upload it to this forum - he can draw with such detail, even at a very young age, that people's jaws would drop open (not saying that to brag, just trying to give you a visual idea of what he was capable of). One of the suggestions included with his first neuropsych eval at 8, when he was diagnosed and sent off with a long list of suggestions for AT, OT, etc... was that we ask a local artist to work with him to develop his artistic ability - not because he needed help, but because he's extremely talented. (FWIW, we never did that - ds wasn't interested lol!).

    I asked the very same question you have blackcat, when the neuropsych first mentioned dysgraphia - how is it possible that a child who can draw with such detail could also have a disability impacting their ability to use handwriting? Another aspect that was very confusing to me when I heard his dysgraphia was fine motor in origin was his ability to create teeny-tiny clay figures with incredible accuracy and detail. The key is that the drawing and the manipulating of clay into detailed figures aren't tasks that rely on automaticity, and dysgraphia is a neurological impairment in the ability to develop automaticity. Your ds can draw detailed maps because he can visualize them and work through putting that vision onto paper; he can also write an "h" because he can see it and put it on paper - but if he's dysgraphic, his brain will not develop an automaticity of that motion, so he's essentially redrawing it every time he has to make an "h".

    Hope that makes sense!

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    ps - just one more quick note: we found out my dd with vision issues had vision issues through neuropsych testing in 3rd grade. When the neuropsych saw dd's handwriting samples prior to the actual testing, her first remark was "wow! you have another dysgraphic child!" However, DD's ability to copy a drawing was very limited compared to ds' - which led neuropsych to conclude (along with other tests) that dd had vision challenges rather than dysgraphia. I only mention this because otherwise her handwriting at that time looked very much like a dysgraphic students' handwriting. She didn't, however, complain of wrist pain (as ds did), and while she held her face at an odd angle when looking at her papers, she didn't hold onto her wrist while writing, which ds did.

    polarbear

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    Thanks Elizabeth and polarbear. I guess that makes sense about automatcity. When he does jumping jacks, for instance, he doesn't look fluid he looks odd and jerky. But he did 5 in a row well enough to "pass" that section of the BOT. I made a typo w/ his scores, above, so went back and edited. He didn't do the full beery vmi, he just did the motor coordination subtest and the rest of the testing was the BOT.

    I am questioning whether the OT should really be doing these visual perceptual exercises w/ him. I think she is assuming that if he does not put proper spacing between his words, or stay in the lines w/ mazes, it's some sort of visual perceptual issue that needs to be remediated. I'm not sure that's the case and fear she is wasting her time. I told her he can draw states from memory and she gave me the same look that the preschool teachers gave me 5 or 6 years ago when I mentioned he could read fluently. I'll bring in the sticky notes and show her. Unless there really is a reason she should be doing this visual stuff.


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