Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment High ERB CTP-4 Scores

My daughter turned 9-years old a few days ago (rising 4th grader), and recently took the ERB CTP-4 test through her private school. This is the first time she has ever been tested in any formal way. This is the first time her school administered the test, and to my knowledge there was no rigorous test preparation.

Her %ile rank scores were as follows (national norm group/independent schools group:

Verbal Reasoning: 99% / 97%
Auditory Comprehension: 97% / 86%
Reading Comprehension: 99% / 96%
Writing Mechanics: 99% / 99%
Writing Concepts and Skills: 99% / 98%
Quantitative Reasoning: 99% / 95%
Mathematics 1&2: 99% / 99%

She "hit the ceiling" in multiple subtopics, mostly in the math sections.

We have an upcoming meeting with her school about her test scores to discuss, for lack of a better phrase, "what they mean". She is a quiet but happy kid.

Would anyone on the forum recommend further testing? Is this the point where we should start gathering information on external resources, etc? Should we just be happy that she is a "smart kid" and leave well enough alone?

This has produced a lot more anxiety for me than I anticipated. Any help would be deeply appreciated.

For us, the two key questions are always: Is she happy? Is she learning to learn?

A child in a poorly-matched educational environment often becomes frustrated or anxious, and may start to shut down or act up. Spending your life waiting to be allowed to learn is very demotivating. Forced constant socialization with kids who don't share your interests and think you are weird can be depressing.

Other kids enjoy the social scene and aren't fussed by the lack of challenge in school. However, if they are effortlessly obtaining top marks for too long, well - - - more than a few of us have experienced the unpleasant reality of finally being in a university course that requires hard work, errors, perseverance and good study habits. And discovering we possess none of the above.

So, if you think your kid is happy and challenged, then she's probably in a good place for as long as those two remain true. If any of the above raises alarm bells, though, then you may be wanting to look for some changes. Some people find the necessary challenge out of school. Others look for different school environments. The latter is where you may need testing in order to obtain access to certain options.

Final thought: assessment can also be helpful for simply developing a better understanding of your kid and their needs, especially with the kinds of kids that are particularly asynchronous, and have a lot of variation in strengths and weaknesses. Even when you can see for yourself what those strengths and weaknesses are, there is something quite different about looking at neutral data and realizing, for instance - OK, wow, he really does need math way more complex than what he's getting, maybe I need to take that a bit more seriously. And he really *can't* write any faster than that. It's not *won't*, it really is *can't*, and he needs help, not "try harder". I think neutral data gave me that little bit of extra confidence I needed to fully parent my kids the way they needed, and not the way everyone else did and thought I should conform to.

Thank you so much for your thoughtful reply. It seems like there really is a strong argument to be made for further testing. Like I said, she seems happy at her school and has a close circle of friends. However, if testing does suggest, for example, that her math aptitude is well above grade level, then external options would be the next step...

Thanks again!

Yes, this. DS was not being challenged enough last year (K) but was quite happy. However, it became really clear to us just how underchallenged he was after we got ability and achievement assessments done for him. It was kind of shocking how far from his zone of proximal development they were teaching to.

Those are, in fact, quite high scores, even among gifted kids. Generally the independent school norms are going to be the lowest because those schools are generally a lot more selective about their student body.

Have you discussed the results with her teacher? The CTP-4 measures really specific things, and there is often more to the story than just test results that the teacher should be aware of. For instance, when DS took it this year, she was able to tell us why he did well (or possibly scored lower than was believed to be his real ability) on the various subtests. It was really helpful information that provided a lot of context around said scores.

When my son hit the ceiling in many segments of the CTP-4 test, the school provided 2-3 years subject acceleration without us advocating for it. The numbers are a good source of data for the administrators and they can easily evaluate a child's abilities based on the scores. The good thing that happened to DS is that he is now placed with kids who have similar ability, so the pace of the class is in keeping with his learning abilities. Scores at these levels indicate mastery of the material and that the child can handle content that is more challenging. To provide you with a reference, these are very good scores even among gifted kids as mentioned by PP.

So, bring up acceleration or grade skip at your meeting if they don't suggest them on their own. Listen to their recommendations even if you have not considered these options yet.

Those scores are excellent....our son has taken the ERB CTP 4 three time, first as a 4th and then 5th grade , and now as a 6th grader....still waiting on the results for this year. His scores in 4th grade were very similar.
IMHO, you definitely should consider some above grade level testing for your daughter. You will probably be absolutely amazed...I know we were. I believe both Duke TIP and CTD/NUMATS are coming up with a new test to replace the ACT Explore. It will be interesting to hear what the school says...my guess is they may not have seen scores like these before...good luck!