Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy She's eating alone

DD10 appeared to be doing ok in 6th grade. I was hoping the grade skip would challenge her and maybe, just maybe she could meet some like-minded girls. Big heavy sigh. She just admitted that she is now eating alone in the lunch room. The other girls are ignoring her. Last week she stated she wished she was our dog so people would be nice to her.She shared that some girls find her annoying. We are doing everything we can to help her out with the friendship issue. Band. Art club. Science Olympiad. It doesn't matter to me that much that she's still making all A's. She's just so unhappy. I don't even know what to do. She has one friend who she sees occasionally, but it's not enough. My heart is so heavy.

I'm sorry to hear this greenlotus. From what I remember of sixth grade, the girls were especially obnoxious. How close to age 11 is your DD? (since every place seems to have a different cut-off I'm not sure what is average for your school in terms of the other girls' ages).


DD is grade accelerated and is just over age 10, but in fifth grade. So far, no social problems, but I noticed the other girls are bigger than she is. I'm hoping this doesn't become a problem next year, in terms of her coming across as immature.

Girls in middle school can be really really mean. Is there any way you can talk to the teacher and see if there isn't another nice girl who might help her assimilate back in? As much as I think there are a lot of mean girls, there are probably some nice (maybe shy) girls who might want more friends too. Often just having one person to hang out with can change the dynamic. Also, how are her social skills? The fact that she says that they find her "annoying" sounds like she is missing some cues somewhere….

With the one friend she doesn't see often, is there a way to see her more often until she has more friends at school?

She will not turn 11 until next April so she is a very young 6th grader. Sixth graders are 11 and 12.

I agree about the "mean girl" situation. I think that's only part of it. She is a rather snarky kid so that's not helping the situation. She's an artist through and through, and even the thousands of cartoons she creates are very sarcastic. Inside she's tender and kind, but she really does a good job hiding that. On top of that, she just is not into the typical table talk. She's all Minecraft and creating new decorative keyboards that she shares online. She says the girls at school are talking about hairstyles. I believe that - I see my other 6th grader (DD's big sister) spending way more time getting "beautified" in the bathroom every morning. DD10 just isn't there yet (if ever). Anyway, yes, social cues issues.

I am pulling her together with the other girl as often as possible. Once a month slumber party and Weds. afternoons. DD stated if it weren't for this girl, she would not have any friends. I also plan to email the AIG teacher who is the sweetest person on the planet. I am crossing my fingers.

That is just the sweetest thing I have every heard. As I said above, I will email the AIG teacher. The guidance counselor is a no go. Cold and scary. The AIG teacher is an angel. I will ask her if anything like this exists.

If it doesn't exist, it should be started! No one should eat alone. What a great initiative. OP, I am so sorry for your daughters situation. I was alone all through elementary school. By seventh grade, things got better.
Edited because I got cut off! I meant to say that some kids may feel (certainly I felt that way) that they are somehow unable to make friends, that they are doomed to be alone forever, that the one friend they have out of school is just the exception that proves the rule and so on, particularly if they can tell their parents are worried about them, too, and she needs to know that this WILL change.
I think both you and she should be aware, too, that this is much more about overall fit than it is about her. As you are aware and she is probably, too, if you are bullied/rejected, there is always a component about your own personality that makes you vulnerable, though this never means it is somehow your fault! But it does mean that once you fiend a better fit (and she will at some point in life!) that trait about her, in her case, for instance, her sarcastic wit, will be something that people appreciate her for as opposed to being put off by.
If she is able and willing, she may practice to fit in, trying to have silly conversations about hairstyles or whatever. Personally I feel doing this does not mean denying yourself or dumbing down, but, in adapting to your circumstances, learning a valuable skill that you may need on your professional life. It is not something one should have to do forever, but it may get her through middle school.

I agree ask the guidance counselor. Hopefully there are kids they could try and connect her up with. I bet your daughter isn't alone and she really only needs to find one friend to make thing better. In junior high girls become really catty, social groups are constantly being rearranged and it doesn't take much to be on the outs.

As to the "no one eats alone". My DS's junior high tried this when DS was in 8th. DS ate alone out of CHOICE in 7th & part of 8th. He found empty table and read quietly during lunch. At the time I think he really needed the space from being forced to be social. He HATED it in 8th grade when they instituted a new policy that forced him to share space with other kids. Although after a few months of gripping it actually did work and he did finally find some kids he didn't mind sharing a table. DS is 16 and a junior in H.S. and honestly it did get a LOT better.

But your daughter isn't my son and clearly doesn't want to be alone so I would defiantly try and get school to intervene. My district offers social skills groups run by a social worker and I recommend you ask if they have anything. Directly working on social skills with a small group can be really beneficial to any kid struggling socially.

I would hate to be forced to interact with people every lunch time. I would just suggest she take a book and make the most of the time out but since she doesn't want that go and talk to the counselor.

Are the teachers or coaches of her extracurriculars approachable? Both band and science Olympiad are important sources of social life for my kids, but it obviously depends on the atmosphere and structure of those activities. I think we are lucky, as the teachers/coaches seem to really get this and consciously foster the social aspect.

Our band has lots of opportunities for interaction outside of actual band practice- does she have a lesson group? Playing together in lesson group or a small ensemble gives some structure that can be helpful in getting to know different kids- kids here are in groups that play in competitions, or for adjucation/feedback at festivals, or for things like the talent show at school.

Science Olympiad stuff has been the most helpful- does she have partners assigned for her events? Having the event preparation as an excuse to invite kids over works well here- the close nature of the work forces them to get to know each other well. Our team also does a lot of practices where dinner is provided- again, eating together helps them bond (though it is a lot of work for the parents!) We have found that most of the SO team is somewhat quirky and different, and they are often introverted, so perhaps it is not just your DD, and some social engineering would be beneficial to others, too.

Just a note about reading at lunch- both my kids have had friends who read at lunch at various points during middle school. I'm sure it varies from school to school, but it seemed acceptable here. My kids also both have gone through stages where they played cards or other games during lunch- a good way to avoid some of the mindless small talk, and helped my DD "break in" to an all-boys table where she felt more socially comfortable (no talk about hairstyles, thankfully.)

My DD also went through a stage when she drew/doodled/cartooned a lot during lunch (again, made her feel more comfortable sitting with a couple of boys who liked to do the same.) Are there any kids in her art club who might enjoy some kind of lunchtime drawing? Perhaps the teacher could help you out here.

Good luck- middle school lunch is one of the toughest parts of school, I think.

I wonder if this is a bad school fit, making your daughter seem even more out of place than she might otherwise. Can you investigate other schools and find one that might have more grade skippers? In our state, we can see how many students are identified as gifted at each school, which is a good way to gauge if there might be more kids like your daughter. Also, it seems like your daughter might fit in well at a STEM-focused school, where they might even have Minecraft clubs (my son's school does!).

We went through this with my son. Third through 8th grades were the hardest. The fact is, he just didn't have that much in common with age peers. They weren't that interested in him, and he really didn't have an interest in trying to fit in with them. He thought they were all immature and not very smart. After homeschooling a while, we finally found the right school for him. There was a period of transition when he started, but this year he is having such a fantastic year, I can't even believe it. He says repeatedly how happy he is, which is surprising to hear from a reserved, sarcastic kid.

In the meantime, I would reassure your daughter that things will get better, that you are working on it, and you'll help her find a solution. Tell her it's not HER, it's that the other kids just aren't at her level yet. I would also look for clubs or activities outside of school that she might be interested in, like a minecraft club (can you start one?), or an art group.

Our DD skipped 6th grade and joined middle school in 7th (around here middle schools are 6,7,8). I have often said one of the best things about that skip was giving DD one less year of middle school. Even the school principal, in our acceleration meeting, flat out said, "Middle school sucks, even for non-accelerated kids."

It took our DD a few months to finally get accepted into a group. Until then she kind of toughed it out, mostly hanging out with the kids the guidance office had asked to take her in (in addition to the acceleration, our DD was also new to the district). Now she is a junior in high school and her groups have completely changed since middle school.

Did your DD's acceleration plan include any monitoring and/or follow-up from the school to see how things are going for her? Having the school keeping an eye out for our DD, and getting involved in extra-curriculars (swim, band, jazz band, tennis) help quite a bit.

It was a tough time for my wife and I to see our DD not immediately thriving socially after her second acceleration, but looking back now (~4 years later), we are (and she is) so happy with both the academic and social fit and (other than a little ribbing) most of her friends don't even think about her being younger.

Best of luck,
--S.F.

Middle school is just a tough time all around so I feel for what you and your DD are going through. While my DS is not experiencing what you have written about now in middle school, when he was in 4th grade, he transferred to an all-gifted school within a school. DS is young for his grade and not a rough and tumble type. He became close friends with a few girls who had also transferred in and didn't know anyone. Even today in middle school, his ratio of friends is about 75% to 25% in favor of girls. So the suggestion above about maybe breaking into some boys groups is a good one if other avenues are not working. Sometimes the common interests are in other places.
ITA with other posters who recommend letting her know that things to get better. Best of luck to her!

I am so sorry - I was one of the girls in my school that did not want to be in groups that talked about fashion, beauty or boys during the recesses. I spent much time reading books.

I think that part of the problem she is facing is because the school that grade skipped your DD did not arrange enough support for her and is not following up on how well she has integrated into the new environment. This is a pretty common attitude and they assume that all is well if nothing is brought to their attention.

The only effective way in which my DS has found a place for himself through many rough school changes and 1 grade acceleration is by playing team sports. He loves to play sports and that has eventually given him a common ground to interact with kids who might not have any other interests in common with him. Being in ensembles, after school clubs etc have not been as effective for him as the interactions gained from playing a team sport with others. That also cuts down on talk about things that he is not interested in at lunch - he does not have exposure to popular culture and is at a loss when those topics are discussed - so, he talks about their common sport most of the time and then, after lunch he plays his sport with the kids he ate with in the little time left over in the lunch recess.

The school did arrange a "buddy" for DS when he skipped grades and changed schools this year and he showed him around and welcomed him. This was the full extent of the "support" they provided for DS and it was our good fortune that this buddy was a really nice child who was motivated to help DS. And DS is familiar with a lot of kids because they group kids randomly for science experiments, musical performances and PE. But, it has been team sports that has redeemed DS from a lot of loneliness and being left alone.

The AIG teacher or homeroom teacher might be able to help by arranging for your daughter to be with groups that have similar interests.

If your daughter might like to play a team sport, it could be a good way to make friendships without getting involved in discussions about hairstyles. And she could share a common interest and not feel that the other girls find her annoying.

Please talk to the guidance counselor. They often can help.

Sorry to hear that other kids are ignoring your daughter -- I agree, those years are tough!
Obviously making friends is the ideal in this case, but that's a process - worth it, but hard if she just can't find a person to "click" with yet. Since middle school is usually when lunches tend to become more flexible, could she eat in a classroom with one of the teachers -- maybe one or two days a week, for example - so that she isn't pressured every day too find somewhere to sit? Especially if the guidance counselor is really nice, maybe your daughter could ask her - and it's still a way to practice social skills. YMMV, but around here it's not common but definitely not usual for kids to just sort of hang around certain classes for lunches. Many kids are in there for schoolwork, anyway.

Greenlotus, I feel your pain. My dd is only 6 but going through some of this. We talked to the teacher and my dd was signed up for a friendship club that will meet once weekly. From reading your earlier posts, looks like your dd has gone thru this before as well starting from kindergarten. Isn't her sister in the same grade now? Would she be able to help? Most schools realize that middle school is tough and have support infrastructure in place for all the kids to help adjust. Does her school have anything?

It sure is nice to have all of you respond. My organizational self is going to take all the suggestions, copy them into a document, and take it to my meeting with the AIG teacher. As I stated earlier, the guidance counselor is rather cold (I'm scared of her!!!). The AIG teacher is a sweetie.

DD has always struggled with friendships. Both in K and 1st she had best friends who eventually told her they didn't want to be friends anymore. She chose not to have friends for awhile after that. We did go to a therapist for a bit then. Anyway, she tends to make friends with those who are with her for long periods of time (the kid who sits next to her all day long in 3rd grade for example). Well, that's not how middle school works. They zip in and out of class all day long.

I am buying that book about friendship mentioned on another post. In fact, I need to order Christmas presents so I will get to that in a minute.

I will give you all an update after I speak to the AIG teacher.
Christmas cookies to all those who posted so many good ideas!!!!!!

Aww, hugs to your DD, greenlotus. That is so hard. FWIW, DYS DD10 would probably love your DD. She'd chat her up about Minecraft and not care one whit about beautification of any variety.

Can't big sis help "bridge the gap" a bit by helping your DD meet some like-minded 6th graders? I know that you probably don't want to put that on your older DD, but it would be a "kind sibling" move. My mom was grade-skipped into her brother's grade...I think the only thing that he ever "helped" her with (according to family lore) was bringing and setting loose snakes at a girl's birthday party...

Ditto to this. DD can make herself fit in by talking about the "girlie" stuff but I don't think any of her friends would sit around playing Minecraft all day like she does. And I can't even get DD to comb through her unruly hair much less be concerned with hairstyles. I am not sure how many times per day she rolls her eyes and says "oh my god" and makes a sarcastic comment, so they could do that with each other as well. I think it's just a matter of finding peers rather than something wrong with your DD.

This.

blackcat, are you sure that you are not raising my DD?

Could not agree with blackcat more. Your DD just needs to find her peers.

My DD10 would be at Greenlotus, Blackcat and Loy58's table were they in the same school and grade I am sure. She is into Minecraft too and given her druthers would happily while away hours playing it. I tend to restrict it to a) not get her over exposed to it and bored b) not spend all day looking at a screen.

DD does paint her nails sometimes but that's about it the beauty department (so far) she is not that much of a girly girl. I would be completely fine if she ever wanted to be (as long as she didn't turn into a simpering, vacuous airhead) but I don't ever see that being the case.

I can see requests to dye her hair like the girl in Dark Matter soon, though...

Mine too! My DD10 has been griping all year about how so many of the girls in the class are all about crushes, fashion, etc. No one really shares her same interests. She has dyed a chunk of hair blue, but otherwise just isn't that interested.

To her credit, rather than just be on the sidelines, she's decided to read up on fashion and crushes so she has something to talk to them about (just like I used to read the sports section mostly for work chit-chat purposes, actually). She'd rather do Minecraft contests (the ones where you build a specified project, like a tent, and then everyone goes around rating each other's tents) but recognizes that that doesn't buy her social currency at lunch.

We are ordering the American Girl Smart Girl's Guides on point, and I may show her some sophisticated breakdowns of fashion (i.e., approaching it as art/costuming in a historical and cultural context, vs. "Who Wore It Best?!" superficial tabloid commentary). Mentioning in case it's a helpful tactic to any other girls stuck without a non-fashion-y cohort.

I'll ask mine if she'd be interested in email/pen-pals. Maybe they can play Minecraft together sometime!

Gee, I wouldn't want my kid at this school. I am of the opinion that middle school does not have to suck. My DD is not finding that it sucks and I don't think her friends think it sucks either. She is a quirky kid with quirky interests, but her school is full of such kids and the school culture supports that.

I notice that many parents have kneejerk negative beliefs about middle school. Gently, I would say that I don't think this helps. If we tell our kids that kids this age suck and are mean, this may be what they look for and expect.

I do think that middle schools in this day and age vary widely, though. Some are really with it as far as being on top of anti-bullying, social inclusion, etc, while others may be stuck in the dark ages.

Re fashion, your daughters might possibly enjoy the site polyvore.com (disclaimer: you are supposed to be 13). It's sort of like online paper dolls. With such a wide range of available clothing, even kids with a very alternative style can find outfits they like. I am not at all a fashion person, but even I found it fun for a bit.

ITA. Middle school can be challenging for sure, but it can also be a really fun time in a child's life. I have two dds in middle school, and really and truly, the girls (and boys) in their classes are wonderful. It's tough to find your space and fit in at a new school, and I'm guessing the girls that your dd sees everyday most likely went to elementary school together too, which doesn't help make it easier to find quick friends - but I'm also guessing there are at least *some* nice girls (really, I'm guessing most of the girls are nice... just haven't known that many kids who aren't nice once you get to know them)... so I would focus on finding ways to encourage her to find friends at school, in her classes.

The one thing I'd add - there seems to be an idea here that only quirky high-IQ kids are into Minecraft - almost every early middle school kid I've known (all over any spectrum you can think of) loves Minecraft. Your dd might not be seeing them playing it at school, but that doesn't mean the other girls wouldn't enjoy playing it. Even girls who are all about fashion, boys, whatever.


Also agree - with this situation (this post), I wouldn't be quick to assume right away that the inability to find like-minded friends is due to not having found the "best-fit" friend. I think there's opportunity here to help learn how to find friends *wherever* you are. Even if the op was able to find an outside-of-school bff for her dd, wouldn't it still be nice to fit in and have a few friends at school to enjoy school with?

Best wishes,

polarbear

I don't (and didn't) have any problem with a blunt speaking administrator. It was quite refreshing compared to the wishy-washy principal my DD had for kindergarten.

All kids are different, so perhaps yours would not have like it there, but our DD had an overall great experience at this school with its matter-of-fact administration.

Best of luck,
--S.F.

My 9dd sounds just like your dd, right down to the humor, interests, and approaches to friendships. It took her a few years to make friends and now she has quite a few, but her closest friends she spends time with at school are boys.

Matter-of-fact is okay--I'm very matter-of-fact--but I would want to see a principal believe that middle school, particularly THEIR middle school, CAN be great. I would be perfectly okay with a principal who said, in a meeting about my child having a hard time, "Middle school sucks sometimes," but not a blanket assertion that it always and generally sucks. To me, that sounds like someone burned out on middle schoolers!

I am in the middle school does not have to suck camp. Yes, it is challenging socially and emotionally for most kids but it is also a great opportunity to mature and gain self-confidence and independence. I have two 7th graders and have witnessed their development over the last 1 1/2 years. Yes, fashion and crushes are major topics for many 6th grade girls (including DD12) but I would be shocked to hear that none of them have any other interests/hobbies/conversations. They can't all be two dimensional caricatures in a typical middle school. DD12 has her GT friends, magnet friends, artsy friends, music friends, and fashion friends as well as some "specific class only" friends although there are a lot of overlap among the groups and her closest buddies belong to multiple groups. In a way, the multiple classroom nature and group project opportunites of middle school make it much easier to make friends: If you struck out in math and social studies, there is always language arts, science and electives and clubs. If your DD is conscious that her behavior annoys the other girls, then she is in a good position to modify her behavior, assuming that she wants to make friends with any of these girls. Since your DD has a sister who appears to be more socially savvy, perhaps you can enlist her help to point your DD to some girls who may be wiling to befriend her. Although DS12 haven't had any social difficulties thus far, he is not always tactful and sometimes behave in an obnoxious way; he is lucky that his groups of friends put up with him but DD12 often calls him on it (she isn't usually a witness but privy to the grapevines) and I think that has helped his social skills.

I am with Quantum. DD 9 is one of the older in her grade and I have just seen a blossoming interest in fashion, make-up etc this year. I worked at a middle school for a long time and middle school is a challenging time for most girls. However, the girls that are interested in make-up and fashion are also interested in a lot of other things, sports, dance, music etc.. I think the biggest problem is that it is possible that your daughter may become interested in those things at least to a small extent later, however, she is just not ready to hang with those girls socially right now. 6th graders with fall birthdays will be almost 13 by the end of the school year, your daughter is just ten. They probably look at her like a little girl and not necessarily a peer, at least socially. There is such a huge gap between ten and twelve, especially in a child's ability to understand social cues. This will most likely be easier later but it is one of the main issues with acceleration. I hope that your DD finds someone to eat with soon and school gets easier!