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    Joined: Apr 2015
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    I don't know if this applies for your DS, but a psychologist who evaluated mine at age 7-8 ish explained it like this: DS processing speed is just average, and 30+ points difference between reasoning ability. Psych said that behavioral issues were likely related to "reaching for low hanging fruit" in his interactions with other children.

    IOW, he could quickly/easily access something low-level and silly to entertain his classmates and get some social acceptance. His more reflective process was (and still is) way far out, takes a lot more time to articulate, and would likely be experienced as odd by children who aren't similar.

    This is still true--but in his gifted program, he has found peers who "get" him. Teachers are a little more mixed...

    Another thing, and I don't really know if this is related to PSI, but I can imagine how it might be: DS is the kid who will ALWAYS get caught and in trouble for things everyone else is doing, also. I think this is related to not being attuned to social cues and perhaps also to spending a lot of time in that grey area of reconciling reasoning v. speed. He's always a few beats behind in this sort of thing. He doesn't have the savvy to both interact with peers and notice what the adults in charge are doing/thinking/cueing. He has pretty severe EF deficits, though, so this may not really be relevant to the PSI thing.

    This doesn't really apply to schoolwork, I realize. And DS can produce his work in a normal amount of time, I guess because his speed is "average" and not below. Getting him started is a bigger issue.

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    Our DS7, like eco's, has an average PSI (with about a 30 point spread between it and VCI / PRI / WMI). At the moment, I think it manifests mostly with his writing and math fluency. He seems to be a slower writer than most, and math facts have not come easily. His reading fluency "exploded" from non-existent to advanced in a matter of 1-2 months, though.

    I'm not sure if this is due to his PSI or some of his traits that seem to point in the direction of stealth dyslexia.

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    Originally Posted by suevv
    Hi all,

    Lots of our kiddos have very low processing speeds relative to VCI/PRI. DS7 is one - he has a 94 point difference between VCI and PSI.

    I wonder if any of you could offer good words/analogies to explain the struggles this can cause? I'm having a meeting tomorrow where I may offer some info about DS's assessment results. But I'm struggling to put this impact into words. Any ideas?

    Thanks,
    Sue

    Hi Sue,

    I apologize for responding a day late and most likely not responding in time before your meeting, but I've spent a bit of time mulling this topic over and not sure quite how to articulate my thoughts on it! Two of my children have relatively low PSIs - one had an extremely low PSI score and a huge discrepancy in terms of SDs of difference; the other had a lower relative gap, yet in reality is the most impacted in terms of a challenge that impacts academics.

    Personally, I think using the term "low processing speed" is confusing and somewhat meaningless. I see "processing speed" as a term that has a very specific meaning in terms of a WISC subtest, but not a well-defined meaning in terms of how a person functions. That discrepancy in relative score on the WISC can be due to a huge number of different root causes, so it's really most important (jmo) to understand what's driving the reason a student scores low on a particular type of subtest and then to be able to describe that and how it impacts academics when you advocate at school.

    It also helps a lot (again, jmo), if you have some type of recognizable diagnosis that can explain the gap. I realize not everyone is going to have that - but if you have a student who's had ability testing, seems to have symptoms that are causing issues with academics or otherwise at school (or just in life in general), and *hasn't* had further testing to determine why there is a gap, I feel that's extremely important in order to help the student (I realize you've already btdt :)). Without a specific diagnosis and without being able to explain the *why* behind challenges, I've found that it's somewhat easy for teachers or other adults who don't really have a background in testing to think "low processing speed - everyone can be slow" or "low processing speed - another way of saying not motivated" etc.

    I hope your meeting goes well today - keep us posted!

    Best wishes,

    polarbear

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    For a while in elementary school, my son started to stutter just a bit, and we think that was related to his processing speed. We likened the processing issue to a funnel: he's got all these thoughts and information swirling around in his head, but a small funnel he's got to get them through to get them out. So sometimes, there's a bottleneck as he gets his thoughts out. As he gets older, he seems to have figured out his own workarounds, but he's still relatively slow and careful at everything he does.

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    Hi all - and thank you so much.

    Polarbear - never too late! My meeting isn't for a couple more hours, and anyway this probably won't be the last time I tackle this. I was like you - kept mulling it over and couldn't figure out how to express my thoughts. And as you referenced, we did really, REALLY extensive testing to try to sort out what was going on. The neuropsych assessed him as stealth dyslexic. But I doubt "stealth dyslexia" will qualify as a recognizable diagnosis, since the school doesn't even accept "dyslexia" as a qualifying diagnosis. (They've re-worded it so that a student has to be below grade level performance.)

    DS has symptoms that ping in SPD, ASD and ADHD. But our painfully detailed assessment didn't turn up any of those for him. Sometimes I do think it would be easier to get help if it had. Instead, I'm standing there with "stealth dyslexia," low-average PSI that is more than six (6!) standard deviations below his VCI, and the dismissive opinion that DS is "smart enough to know better."

    But the funnel analogy (thanks Syoblrig) and the low-hanging fruit (thanks eco) and the lovely "deep thinker" (thanks daytripper) add nicely to aeh's awesome explanation. I should emphasize how fortunate I am that the school is willing to work with DS and us. It's just that none of this is easy to explain in a way that won't fall on deaf ears because we do live in a Special Snowflake community.

    Two further notes. George - DS did the same thing last year a couple months into first grade. Not reading to fluent reader in just a few weeks. Crazy.

    And eco - DS is the king of low-hanging fruit and obtuseness. Yesterday he wrote a curse word on the bathroom wall because he thought other kids would think it was funny. Bless the principal for understanding he did it out of isolation and loneliness - and for helping him get that this is NOT the right way to make friends. Now if I can just help her understand more about why he feels that way!

    Anyway - thanks again,
    Sue

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    Originally Posted by suevv
    And eco - DS is the king of low-hanging fruit and obtuseness. Yesterday he wrote a curse word on the bathroom wall because he thought other kids would think it was funny. Bless the principal for understanding he did it out of isolation and loneliness - and for helping him get that this is NOT the right way to make friends. Now if I can just help her understand more about why he feels that way!
    Oh gosh, we went through a horrible curse word thing at about that age. I have never been so mortified (nor have I ever tried so many useless interventions). OT but FWIW, the most compelling argument I ever used with DS about this was that even though the kids laugh, they will probably feel uncomfortable about it and tell their parents, who will then think he isn't a "nice" kid with "nice" parents.

    Good luck in your meeting! This stuff is really hard to explain. I never even understood until recently that the PSI on WISC (V, anyhow) is essentially a test to see how quickly they perform "pencil and paper tasks." I think there is more to it than that, really, but the NP simplified it to that degree in her report.

    As far as loneliness goes--ONE good friend can be a lifesaver. I hate the themes of loneliness and isolation you mention. Thank goodness your DS has you.

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    Thanks I've found this helpful. Having my son diagnosed with low Processing Speed (low average) and reading these posts of other parents describing low processing speed makes me wonder if perhaps I have low processing speed as well.

    The struggle I've always had that make me think this is I can't "think on my feet" very well. I'd make a terrible stand up comic. I'm always 5 minutes behind on conversations particularly arguments/discussion with more than one person involved. It's not that I don't get what they are saying right away but that by the time I figured out how to respond the conversation has already moved on. And because I'm still thinking about how to respond I'm not 100% listening to the direction the conversation is taking. My observation is my son is the same way and I think this has really gotten in his way socially in the past.

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    Back from my meeting. It was interesting and will be helpful I think.

    Principal asked several questions that led me to believe she was listening. At first, the biggest struggle was, "I get that he feels uneasy in kid-to-kid interaction, because it feels unpredictable and scary. But I don't get why this would cause him to go on the offensive, or do such silly things. So I don't know how to help him stop himself."

    We worked through DS's unshakable belief that he is going to fail at social interaction, and SHE pointed out that he probably sabotages scary interactions so he can "hurt them before they hurt me." And she immediately recognized that some of his ridiculous behavior is a failed attempt to make friends by being funny. She's a little notorious for pranking colleagues, and I saw the stunned look in her eye when I pointed out that sometimes, DS thinks he playing a prank, not being mean.

    That led her to shake her ahead and remark how DS is having troubles that he shouldn't face until he's more grown up. Subtle stuff like the delicate line between a mean trick and an April Fool's joke, and how it's different for every person in every setting. "Little kid society should just be so much simpler than this." But she also remarked that she often talked to him almost as a peer about human interactions, trust, friendship, social pressure, loss, etc.

    I think she ended up baffled, but thinking hard about how to help him. And one of her last points was "You just can't talk to him the way you talk to other kids. He just doesn't reason or think the same way they do." I think I'll have to take that as a win.

    Thanks all for your help.

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