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    indigo Offline OP
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    Ranking America's High Schools - The Washington Post
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...h-schools-national-top-25-list-for-2015/

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    Originally Posted by indigo
    Ranking America's High Schools - The Washington Post
    http://apps.washingtonpost.com/local/highschoolchallenge/
    It's not a meaningful ranking, because it ignores how many students get passing scores on those tests:

    Quote
    America’s Most Challenging High Schools ranks schools through an index formula that’s a simple ratio: the number of Advanced Placement, International Baccalaureate and Advanced International Certificate of Education tests given at a school each year, divided by the number of seniors who graduated that year.
    The Challenge Index has been debunked in a post Jay Mathews gets it wrong again.

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    The school my children will eventually attend is ranked very high on this list. I must say with regret that his metric is not working well in this instance. It is a magnet high school, a school within a school, split between extremely bright, high-achieving, frantically prepping students from middle- and UMC backgrounds (mostly) who take one zillion AP tests and poor and very poor students zoned for the school, who take very few. If you look at the stats in the aggregate, sure, they probably look nice, but Mr. Mathews is being misled.

    It is a school with some good things going for it, but it is not, AFAIK, a shining example of equity. For some it is a source of resentment...

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    indigo Offline OP
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    The post to start the thread purposefully contained no commentary about the rating/ranking methods used. Fortunately you both noticed that the criteria may present a somewhat unclear or even distorted impression of schools.

    schools had to have an average SAT score below 2000 or an average ACT score below 29 to be included on the main list.
    Some may say these ratings/rankings are no longer a useful tool for identifying high-performing schools which may be a good "fit" for gifted, high-achieving pupils.

    The Challenge Index is designed to identify schools that have done the best job in persuading average students to take college-level courses and tests.
    Some may say it would be more accurate to report that the Challenge Index identifies "schools that have done the best job in persuading average the largest percentage of students to take college-level courses and tests", as the measure includes test administered, not courses taken and/or passed.

    Equity and Excellence rate, which is the percentage of all graduating seniors, including those who never took an AP course, who had at least one score of 3 or above on at least one AP test sometime in high school. The nonprofit College Board, which oversees the AP program, invented this metric. It found that the average Equity and Excellence rate in 2014 was 21.6 percent.
    Personally I'd like to see the math behind this. While described as "percentage of all graduating seniors... who", it may raise a question in some minds as to whether a senior who received >= 3 on more than 1 exam was counted only once when deriving the percentage (consistent with the written description), or whether each exam with a score >= 3 was included in deriving the percentage (which would be the number of exam scores >=3 as a percentage of graduating seniors, possibly more closely related to the "challenge index").

    Because this measure includes "those who never took an AP course", might it include homeschool students who self-studied for an AP exam, therefore not be a measure of the school, per se?

    College Board describes it this way:
    AP Equity and Excellence Report: Report displaying the percentages of a school or district's entire 10th, 11th and 12th grade classes who scored a 3 or higher on at least one AP Exam and the percentage of the senior class that scored a 3 or higher on at least one AP Exam during high school.
    The ratings/rankings seem to be a collective measure of equal outcomes, up to a ceiling (SAT <= 2000, ACT score of 29). Institutions with higher performance appear on the list of elite schools.

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    When college rankings are a stain on society for encouraging colleges to do all the wrong things in order to improve their standings (new sushi bars, $5M football coaches, fudging acceptance data, etc), we shouldn't even be entertaining the idea of ranking high schools.

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    Originally Posted by Dude
    When college rankings are a stain on society for encouraging colleges to do all the wrong things in order to improve their standings (new sushi bars, $5M football coaches, fudging acceptance data, etc), we shouldn't even be entertaining the idea of ranking high schools.

    You have that right.

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    Originally Posted by Dude
    When college rankings are a stain on society for encouraging colleges to do all the wrong things in order to improve their standings (new sushi bars, $5M football coaches, fudging acceptance data, etc), we shouldn't even be entertaining the idea of ranking high schools.
    If products costing $10-$100 are ranked on Amazon and elsewhere, it is inevitable that people consult rankings on purchases of $200K+.

    One reason college rankings are based on some unimportant criteria is that colleges, especially the most prestigious ones, do not want to publish data on learning outcomes that would let them be compared. Do Harvard students learn more in their 4 years than comparably bright students going to state schools? Since the answer may be "no", it's not in Harvard's interest to coordinate with other schools to create the data that could answer this question.

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    Originally Posted by Bostonian
    If products costing $10-$100 are ranked on Amazon and elsewhere, it is inevitable that people consult rankings on purchases of $200K+.

    A person is not a product.

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    Bostonian, that's a valid point... but I believe an important difference is in how the ratings/rankings are generated. Reviews of a product typically measure a few key factors and come with comments... whereas these rankings are almost always made up of items that can easily be gamed. I'm sure there is some flaw in my logic, but that's how I see it.

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    Don't let the folks at Google hear you say that.


    Philip Stone

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