Gifted Bulletin Board

Welcome to the Gifted Issues Discussion Forum.

We invite you to share your experiences and to post information about advocacy, research and other gifted education issues on this free public discussion forum.
CLICK HERE to Log In. Click here for the Board Rules.

Links


Learn about the Davidson Academy’s online campus for profoundly gifted students living anywhere in the U.S.

The Davidson Institute is a national nonprofit dedicated to supporting profoundly gifted students through the following programs:

  • Fellows Scholarship
  • Young Scholars
  • Davidson Academy
  • THINK Summer Institute
  • DITD FaceBook   DITD Twitter   DITD YouTube
    The Davidson Institute is on Facebook, Twitter and YouTube!

    How gifted-friendly is
    your state?

    Subscribe to the Davidson Institute's eNews-Update

    Who's Online
    0 registered (), 0 Guests and 91 Spiders online.
    Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
    Newest Members
    twiceExceptional, robertjohn5814, Malumier, Roadie, Skittles4
    11168 Registered Users
    June
    Su M Tu W Th F Sa
    1 2 3 4
    5 6 7 8 9 10 11
    12 13 14 15 16 17 18
    19 20 21 22 23 24 25
    26 27 28 29 30
    Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >
    Topic Options
    #202592 - 10/02/14 12:30 PM Differentiation within Gifted Program?
    Loy58 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/11/13
    Posts: 816
    I have a question for those of you who have schools with gifted programs: is there differentiation WITHIN your school's gifted program?

    I suppose it seems obvious to me that all kiddos who meet the minimum testing requirements for a given G&T program will not always learn at the same pace or be in EXACTLY the same place (rather, they are in a range, with varying strengths and weaknesses), but I think where we are at...the school is kind of hoping that they ARE all the same. At least, that seems to be the approach to instruction...just curious if this is common.

    Top
    #202593 - 10/02/14 12:47 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    slammie Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/17/14
    Posts: 161
    In our school, there is some differentiation in math in the upper elementary levels. For example, starting in 3rd, the class was split into two groups but they all learned grade level math, but at a different pace. From 4th, they split the group into two separate grade levels.

    In the lower elementary classes, they are grouped according to ability, but in all honesty, there is really is no individual differentiation since the classrooms are so project and group based, this would be difficult. Kids were tested for reading proficiency prior to acceptance so we have no centers for ELA, just math.

    My DD is the only child being subject accelerated to another math grade (1st grade to 2nd ) because we advocated for that. We had to sign an expectation contract and was warned not to discuss the acceleration with any other student/parent. She is still not placed appropriately and even worse, she is expected to make up for work she has missed since the classes are not held at the same time. The days she is not in the 2nd grade class, her group is encouraged to use higher level math to complete classwork. For example instead of using addition, use multiplication/division. She is not being taught new concepts and is very frustrated.

    I am discovering that in our experience, the gifted school has a much more rigid, inflexible view on educating gifted kids. I think schools that are set up to try and meet an individual's learning pace tend to have similar schedules for most grade levels. Our school does not.

    Top
    #202595 - 10/02/14 12:50 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    slammie Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/17/14
    Posts: 161
    I'm curious, how is differentiation being handled for your DD? Do you mind sharing?

    Top
    #202597 - 10/02/14 12:55 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    blackcat Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/23/13
    Posts: 2154
    There is for math (which I think I already told you), and they actually mix kids from various grades, but I'm still trying to figure out what they are doing for language arts. They are asking for a lot of parent volunteers for things like reading groups and testing geography (kids work at their own pace memorizing the world map) so I'm guessing they are doing ability grouping for reading at least and a lot of the material seems to be kids working at their own pace, including math. Which is fine because DD is slow and I don't want her feeling pressured or like she has to rush through work to keep up with those gifted kids who are "fast".

    I hear you on your concerns. Last year (different school) each kid identified as gifted got the "same" enrichment packet for math. Didn't matter how they tested. I think they want to feel like they are doing something without actually doing something. It's not well thought out with each kid's unique needs in mind.

    Top
    #202601 - 10/02/14 01:13 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Zen Scanner Offline
    Member

    Registered: 07/13/12
    Posts: 1478
    Loc: NC
    Yes, definite differentiation from level of reading materials, to math instruction and external math resources, to direct instruction. They seem to use the full range of nuancial information from MAP to target weaker areas and nurture stronger areas. It isn't 100% all day long. There are group activities and group instruction for completeness. But it is much of the time.

    This is in a magnet with full gifted classrooms.

    Top
    #202603 - 10/02/14 01:23 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Loy58 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/11/13
    Posts: 816
    I am trying to figure out what they are actually doing, too, blackcat. Up until last year, I was silly enough to just assume that the school would know what to do with my DD when she got to 3rd/4th grade, when the G&T/advanced classes start.

    Well, we're there. She's in the programs (you have to get into math and English separately). In fact, she's now a DYS. At least in some areas, though - if not all, they have a "set curriculum" that all the kiddos are taught. This is a bit of a problem for my DD, who doesn't always "fit the mold." Some of her test scores are "out there" and I guess I just assumed the school would be prepared to handle this and would adjust accordingly (I don't discuss test scores with other parents, but I am guessing there are others that are "out there" at our schools, too). Some of what I see, however, suggests otherwise. I hope that I am wrong and we start to see something at a more appropriate level soon, but things right now don't look good.

    DD says she is bored and has learned almost nothing yet this year.

    At the same time, I realize we are lucky by even having a program. Many of our neighboring schools have had to close these programs because of a lack of funding. So things could be worse.

    Top
    #202604 - 10/02/14 01:36 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    slammie Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/17/14
    Posts: 161
    Loy, our school, which is a magnet with full GT classes have the "set curriculum" too. I might may be wrong, but like I posted before, I really don't see any differentiation for outliers (and I volunteered in my DS's 3rd classroom quite a bit last year). I also get the feeling that most are happy to have gotten into the school and don't rock the boat too much and tend to supplement at home with Kumon, etc. This is what I gathered from chatting to many parents. I often feel like I am viewed as a crazed tiger mom by the school when requesting advocacy for DD and advocacy is not something I am entirely comfortable doing.

    Top
    #202606 - 10/02/14 01:37 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    blackcat Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/23/13
    Posts: 2154
    That stinks. Yes, it's better than nothing, but still, you want her to make academic progress. This is what we were dealing with last year. It's almost like the schools put a program into place and then check if off their list saying it's done, without evaluating the effectiveness. All I can say is try to find like-minded parents and make a fuss, go to the school board, whatever. Do you have open enrollment there? What helps here is that parents can enroll somewhere else if they want to (assuming there is space). So that keeps all the schools feeling somewhat competitive with each other. They don't want to be the district that is way behind. So when one district opened a "magnet" here, for instance, or started cluster grouping, a lot of others copied. They are trying to keep the kids they have, plus attract kids from neighboring districts.

    Top
    #202615 - 10/02/14 02:32 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Loy58 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/11/13
    Posts: 816
    blackcat, moving within our local schools would not help much, because this seems to be how they are all run, as sort of a "master system."

    No gifted magnets, here, unfortunately. As I said, we are lucky compared with others in our state to have anything at all for G&T. Zen, what you describe sounds wonderful.

    Very interesting to hear the different approaches.

    Top
    #202619 - 10/02/14 03:00 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    blackcat Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/23/13
    Posts: 2154
    Do you mean schools within the same district are run under this sort of master system, or even between districts it is like that? And yes, I hear you, if your school is one of the best in the area it's going to be hard to convince admin to change anything. Is there a decent private school around? Maybe that's going to be your best bet at this point. Sometimes not, though. One of DD's classmates transferred over from one of the better private schools in the area, with her parents saying that the school refused to do anything for them in terms of acceleration/differentiation, etc. You'd probably have to find one that focuses on gifted kids. Or maybe Montessori.

    Top
    #202621 - 10/02/14 03:08 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    DeeDee Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/16/10
    Posts: 2498
    Originally Posted By: Loy58
    I have a question for those of you who have schools with gifted programs: is there differentiation WITHIN your school's gifted program?


    Yes.

    In our state, "gifted" is part of "special ed"--and is supposed to meet the individual needs of the child. You may want to read up on the regulations that apply where you are, and use those to leverage some help.

    Top
    #202644 - 10/02/14 07:57 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    blackcat Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/23/13
    Posts: 2154
    I actually called the State Dept. of Education at one point (there is a "gifted" division, or at least one person with that role!) and someone there gave me some advice and info about my particular district. It was a fascinating conversation. I had no idea, for instance, that I have a right to reject the curriculum and partial homeschool. The district wouldn't like it but it's within parents' rights to look at the curriculum and say it's not acceptable and their child will not be participating for that part of the school day (but not go the full homeschool route). Depending on how ridiculous things get with DS down the line I may very well exercise that right. So I echo what DeeDee says...if your district is unhelpful try getting advice/info from the State level. Even if the school isn't mandated to do anything with gifted ed and there is no one in that role, you could find out your other rights (like partial homeschooling).

    Top
    #202675 - 10/03/14 11:44 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: blackcat]
    Porosenok96 Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 04/12/14
    Posts: 39
    Originally Posted By: blackcat
    you could find out your other rights (like partial homeschooling).

    Unfortunately, you have to be prepared that this road might be closed at any time. My friend had her son partially home schooled last year, and was going to do this this year, but this option is no longer available - either you are a full-time homeschooler, or you are a full-time student. She was told that this has something to do with funding.
    As for the differentiation within GT classes - our district runs self-contained GT program in 2-5 grades. When kids start at 2 grade, their math is 3 grade math, and there in no differentiation at that level. If you finish your work earlier, you may read a book, that is it.
    Reading is better, they have separate reading groups according to their DRA level.


    Edited by Porosenok96 (10/03/14 11:46 AM)

    Top
    #202676 - 10/03/14 12:12 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: DeeDee]
    Dude Offline
    Member

    Registered: 10/04/11
    Posts: 2856
    Originally Posted By: DeeDee
    Originally Posted By: Loy58
    I have a question for those of you who have schools with gifted programs: is there differentiation WITHIN your school's gifted program?


    Yes.

    In our state, "gifted" is part of "special ed"--and is supposed to meet the individual needs of the child. You may want to read up on the regulations that apply where you are, and use those to leverage some help.


    It's the same here in my state. However, I've seen no evidence that the children in a specific grade level receive differentiated work in the gifted classes. All gifted children are treated more or less the same.

    This is one of the reasons why we rejected the GT program as being sufficient by itself; DD needed a full year acceleration AND the gifted program.

    Top
    #202680 - 10/03/14 12:52 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    daytripper75 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/29/10
    Posts: 341
    Yes, in our stand-alone TAG school there is differentiation in each classroom.
    Math: students are tested and placed in math classes. Students who are high achievers in their math classes are given additional projects to do.
    Reading: all done on an individual basis. Students read, log what they have read and journal about it.
    Spelling: students are grouped. Lowest group in each room is usually two grade levels ahead of typical grade level classroom. Top spellers are given Latin and Greek so that they can learn root words.
    Science: Not that I have seen. It is mostly hands on work.
    Social Studies: Not that I have seen.

    Top
    #202682 - 10/03/14 01:19 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Dude]
    DeeDee Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/16/10
    Posts: 2498
    Originally Posted By: Dude

    This is one of the reasons why we rejected the GT program as being sufficient by itself; DD needed a full year acceleration AND the gifted program.


    I'd count acceleration as a form of differentiation. And yes, it was utterly essential for us too.

    Top
    #202687 - 10/03/14 03:14 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Loy58 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/11/13
    Posts: 816
    Very interesting - it sounds like approaches differ. It seems that what happens with P.S. is largely determined by what state you live in - we DON'T live in one of the states that mandates or funds G&T education. So, that being said, we do feel lucky to have G&T programming at all.

    We haven't pushed for acceleration at this point, largely because both of my DC are on the young-end of their respective grades already.

    A recent glimmer of hope for DD: one of her teachers actually took the initiative to assign her language arts work that is 2-grades ahead (while the other students were completing their grade-level work). DD said it was easy, but sent this completed work to this teacher. Hopefully, it will lead to more better-leveled work. Fingers-crossed!


    Top
    #202688 - 10/03/14 03:35 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Minx Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/27/14
    Posts: 88
    Loc: Reno!
    It's pretty much the same as what daytripper has for us. DS8 is in a full-time HG classroom. It seems to be a fairly rigorous program; one of his friends who is also a DYS recently moved to a regular classroom as he couldn't keep up with the demands. I don't know whether the material was too quick or whether he also had an LD that hasn't been identified or whatever else may have slowed him down. DS8 has handwriting issues and a low processing speed, and this class seems to work pretty well for him so far but there are areas that could certainly be more intense.

    There is also a GATE pull-out program in the school for students who are not quite in the 99.9th percentile.

    Top
    #202696 - 10/03/14 06:27 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4884
    In States which do have laws to mandate and/or fund some level of gifted education, this has occurred due to parental organization and legislative advocacy. Parents may wish to gather other interested parents (and professionals such as psychologists, OTs, teachers, administrators, and the local NAGC State affiliate), organize an outreach, compose compelling impact statements, research legislation from other States, and contact legislators with statements describing how legislation would benefit the residents of your State.

    That said, many parents have described "gifted programs" which consist of curriculum one grade level advanced, which does not present an authentic learning opportunity for many gifted kiddos.

    To encourage parents that the effort is worth it, whether helping to craft legislation, or advocating for gifted services which match the program to the child rather than matching the child to the program... I'll share this article from the Davidson Database, titled Gifted children: Youth mental health update, by Julia Osborn, 1996.

    There is a section about midway through the article subtitled Special Needs of Gifted Children, which describes these four needs in detail:
    A. Need for a challenging education.
    B. Need for "true peers."
    C. The need for responsive parenting.
    D. The need for adult empathy.
    In the clinical experience of the author, a range of behavioral problems (from daydreaming to school refusal) have resulted when the school curriculum was not sufficiently challenging.

    The next section of the article, subtitled Giftedness and Self-esteem, highlights findings of a study by Miraca Gross:
    In her study of exceptionally gifted children, Gross has reported that the self-esteem of exceptionally gifted students tends to be significantly lower than the self-esteem of average students, especially when the school is unwilling or unable to allow them access to other children who share their levels of intellectual, oral and psychosocial development. Thus the gifted child is placed in the forced dilemma of choosing to minimize intellectual interests and passions for the sake of sustaining peer relations or of pursuing intellectual interests at the cost of becoming socially isolated in the classroom. As Gross poignantly added "The gifted must be one of the few remaining groups in our society who are compelled, by the constraints of the educative and social system within which they operate, to choose which of two basic psychological needs should be fulfilled."


    While I fully understand the OP's question, at the same time I want to point out that differentiation can be a meaningless buzzword which only indicates something is different... it does not imply that curriculum, placement, pacing, etc are better suited to the child or are in the child's zone of proximal development (ZPD).

    = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - = - =
    NOTE: The article "Gifted children: Youth mental health update" by Julia Osborn, 1996, published by Division of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry, Schneider Children's Hospital, is backed up on WayBack Machine, Internet archive.
    Links:
    1) article -
    https://web.archive.org/web/20200112034938/http://www.davidsongifted.org/search-database/entry/a10170
    2) list of archive dates/times -
    https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.davidsongifted.org/search-database/entry/a10170

    Top
    #202700 - 10/03/14 08:56 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Aufilia Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/25/14
    Posts: 336
    Loc: Washington
    I'm familiar with G&T in 3 districts:

    In the first, students are leveled for math placement by testing them during the first week of the school year. They are placed between 1 and 3 levels up for math--in this case, they're expected to be at least 1 year advanced, which was a little rough for some kids, actually. Otherwise, very little differentiation.

    In the 2nd, all students worked 1 grade level up in all subjects, no differentiation.

    In our new district, the program itself is less regimented and classes are split 4-5-6th grades all in 1 room, so definitely expected to be a range of abilities. Used to be lots of project-based learning and math was independent & at-your-own-pace.

    Top
    #202704 - 10/04/14 06:51 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: DeeDee]
    geofizz Offline
    Member

    Registered: 12/06/10
    Posts: 658
    Originally Posted By: DeeDee
    Originally Posted By: Dude

    This is one of the reasons why we rejected the GT program as being sufficient by itself; DD needed a full year acceleration AND the gifted program.


    I'd count acceleration as a form of differentiation. And yes, it was utterly essential for us too.


    As a matter of options open to serve a gifted kid, differentiation into acceleration should be a continuum. But be aware that in edu-speak, differentiation and acceleration are very different things.

    We've seen skillful differentation and successful acceleration within (and in parallel to) gifted services, each leading to positive outcomes. The most skillful differentiation our kids have had have nearly forced subsequent acceleration. We've also used acceleration in places where the differentiation was not implemented, implemented on the curriculum side and NOT on the instruction side, or was otherwise damaging.

    Top
    #202876 - 10/07/14 05:45 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    ultramarina Offline
    Member

    Registered: 08/24/10
    Posts: 3428
    No.

    ETA: My daughter is in a FT gifted magnet and there is no differentiation. All children do the same curriculum (however, in terms of reading, they do a lot of self-chosen independent reading). It is a weakness.

    My son is not in the magnet yet (too young) but receives gifted pull-out services (not differentiated) several times a week AND is differentiated for by his classroom teacher, who gives him his own individualized work (not by mandate but because she is great). So, he is differentiated more than his sister, who is a FT GT program. Ponder at will. He was also part-time accelerated last year. He was received a much more individualized education in the general education program at a very poor Title 1 school than dd got: #1) at a very coveted charter school known for its high test scores and personalized attention or #2) at the gifted magnet. I think he made a case for himself by being very obvious and that he got lucky with great teachers. But...he is an interesting example. Virtually no one I know would ever think to enroll their gifted K student at his school.



    Edited by ultramarina (10/07/14 05:52 AM)

    Top
    #202880 - 10/07/14 06:26 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: DeeDee]
    Dude Offline
    Member

    Registered: 10/04/11
    Posts: 2856
    Originally Posted By: DeeDee
    Originally Posted By: Dude

    This is one of the reasons why we rejected the GT program as being sufficient by itself; DD needed a full year acceleration AND the gifted program.


    I'd count acceleration as a form of differentiation. And yes, it was utterly essential for us too.


    They didn't offer acceleration, either. We had to find a way to foist it on them.

    They just offer the G/T daily pull-outs, but that's not nothing. It's just that in my HG DD's case, that's a good start, what else ya got?

    Top
    #202881 - 10/07/14 06:38 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Dude]
    geofizz Offline
    Member

    Registered: 12/06/10
    Posts: 658
    Originally Posted By: Dude
    Originally Posted By: DeeDee
    Originally Posted By: Dude

    This is one of the reasons why we rejected the GT program as being sufficient by itself; DD needed a full year acceleration AND the gifted program.


    I'd count acceleration as a form of differentiation. And yes, it was utterly essential for us too.


    They didn't offer acceleration, either. We had to find a way to foist it on them.

    They just offer the G/T daily pull-outs, but that's not nothing. It's just that in my HG DD's case, that's a good start, what else ya got?


    My experience is that many schools don't offer acceleration as a matter of course; it requires significant advocacy and a compelling case, including data. Accelerations are a scheduling nightmare (and don't let anyone tell you it gets easier in middle school & high school), and risk-adverse administrators are weary of testing consequences. As teacher evaluations are increasingly dependent upon student test scores, many teachers are also proving unwilling to have a top student leave the room, and many are unwilling to risk having an accelerated kid score poorly and therefore count against them.

    I've had good luck on advocacy by being aware of the problems and working as best we can to prove testing won't be a problem and to work within the system on scheduling.

    Top
    #202883 - 10/07/14 06:44 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Dude Offline
    Member

    Registered: 10/04/11
    Posts: 2856
    We were asking them to move her from Grade n to Grade n+1. No scheduling challenges. Of all the interventions available, none could be easier.

    Our school system has some bizarre beliefs about the importance of age segregation, and they go to absurd lengths to preserve it.

    Top
    #202888 - 10/07/14 07:06 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Dude]
    Loy58 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/11/13
    Posts: 816
    Originally Posted By: Dude
    It's just that in my HG DD's case, that's a good start, what else ya got?


    That's kind of where we are at...um, thanks, but...school is still too much review and SLLOOOWWWW for her. I really thought that we'd finally be at the point where she'd be doing most of her learning at school.

    We've read the IAS, and we could probably make the argument for acceleration. IMO, acceleration would need to be into the G&T program, NOT into regular classes, that would possibly be even easier one grade up, KWIM?

    I guess what I'm starting to see is that if their approach is insufficient differentiation (and I realize that it may be difficult to do), we might need acceleration. Asking for accelerated G&T classes, though, will probably be an uphill battle. Honestly, I wish they could just teach her well where she is at (and, again, I'm not claiming that this is easy).

    Have most of you then been able to get your DC into G&T classes, once accelerated?


    Edited by Loy58 (10/07/14 07:10 AM)
    Edit Reason: typo

    Top
    #202892 - 10/07/14 07:28 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    22B Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/10/13
    Posts: 1228
    We homeschool, but the public school gifted program is a full-time self-contained gifted program which does allow kids to move at their own pace. For example, I know of a 1st grader doing 4th grade math, and a 7th grader doing pre-calculus.

    The public schools here are overall horrendous, and you have to venture into high crime areas to get to the gifted programs, and have your kids used as score pawns, so we abstain from the whole system.

    Top
    #202893 - 10/07/14 07:31 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Dude Offline
    Member

    Registered: 10/04/11
    Posts: 2856
    Originally Posted By: Loy58
    Have most of you then been able to get your DC into G&T classes, once accelerated?


    Yes, with no resistance, but that's not surprising when you consider that we had basically seized all the bargaining power in the relationship. They still very much wanted a talented student to buoy their test scores and fill a seat in their G/T class (classified as special ed here, and each seat receives 1.5x the normal rate), and we had demonstrated that we could take them or leave them, with the latter being a preference.

    The way we foisted the acceleration upon them was we withdrew DD from 2nd grade, registered her as a homeschool child as a 3rd grader, had her sit for achievement testing at the end of the year as a 3rd grader (our state test, plus the SB10), and showed up to re-register her as a 4th grader the following year.

    That was the second time we had withdrawn her and homeschooled her (first was K, when full GT services were not available, and returned her for 1st grade, which DD muddled through thanks to a caring but overwhelmed homeroom teacher), so, while we didn't quite phrase it this directly, we made it very clear that this was their third and final opportunity to get it right. They would take her as a 4th grader with full G/T, or they'd never see her again.

    Top
    #202894 - 10/07/14 07:32 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Zen Scanner Offline
    Member

    Registered: 07/13/12
    Posts: 1478
    Loc: NC
    Originally Posted By: Loy58
    Have most of you then been able to get your DC into G&T classes, once accelerated?


    We went to a meeting with the G&T coordinator to make that argument when DS was in 1st. She made the suggestion before us. So, DS skipped 2nd specifically to get into the G&T program starting in 3rd.

    Top
    #202897 - 10/07/14 08:26 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Loy58 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/11/13
    Posts: 816
    Very, very interesting.

    I don't think DH would be in favor of pulling either DC out of school, but seeing how much they recently accomplished on sick days just "playing" with academics at the "correct" level at home has left me wondering a bit whether I should be sending them to school.

    We do have very high test scores on our side, Dude, but it is a big school - not sure how much they care about loosing one child's test scores at a larger school.

    DS is in 1st. His situation is probably worse than DD's. No G&T programming until 3rd/4th. I'm not sure if the school really understands what he is capable of - he is quiet, but I did "out" him by having him tested, and he is now a DYS.

    Zen, I'm assuming your school's 1st & 3rd grades are housed in the same school? Problem for DS is that his SCHOOL has no G&T coordinator, because G&T is housed in another school with the higher grades.

    22B - that is actually super-impressive that a 1st grader is allowed to work on 4th grade material. I am sorry that the schools didn't work out, though.

    Top
    #202910 - 10/07/14 11:29 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Zen Scanner Offline
    Member

    Registered: 07/13/12
    Posts: 1478
    Loc: NC
    Originally Posted By: Loy58
    Zen, I'm assuming your school's 1st & 3rd grades are housed in the same school? Problem for DS is that his SCHOOL has no G&T coordinator, because G&T is housed in another school with the higher grades.


    Yes, it is the same school from K to 5. Identification is school-based but per district-wide policy. In your situation I would be talking to the coordinator at the other school.

    Top
    #202911 - 10/07/14 12:14 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    blackcat Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/23/13
    Posts: 2154
    In terms of your question about acceleration and g/t programming, and whether kids still qualify...this was "sort of" a problem with DD. She did a full grade acceleration but she had to score 98th percentile or above for math/reading even after accelerating. After acceleration, she was no longer at the top of the class which was the POINT. I just wanted her to have work that was challenging, I didn't care if she wasn't the top kid in the class. Luckily by the time it mattered she was at 99 for math and 97 for reading so her math score was high enough. I had the g/t coordinator grumbling about her reading score, though. It would have been absurd for them to keep her out when she did as well as she did even after acceleration, but that was potentially a problem that we would have been dealing with. She may not have met their rigid cut-offs for achievement requirements because of the acceleration.

    Top
    #206271 - 11/21/14 09:14 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Cola Offline
    Member

    Registered: 08/25/12
    Posts: 219
    I'm very interested in this thread. Ds is in a gifted 4th grade but all students only work one grade level ahead at the same time doing the same thing. They just started working on factor trees which is yet again in regards to multiplication tables. Ds has shut down but they won't move forward. This is now going on week 5 of multiplication just in a different way. They said he's to immature for skipping a grade and instead should be evaluated by an outside source for ADHD as he won't sit still and do the work he's provided. I'm Trying to find an alternative school now that moves faster but we are in Arizona and it already has a horrible education system.

    Top
    #206299 - 11/22/14 03:21 PM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: Loy58]
    Loy58 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/11/13
    Posts: 816
    I know that this differs by school, but in ours, the students in the G&T program outscore the "regular" students several grades up in regular classes on testing. Actually, if you look at talent search data, none of this is really that surprising. DD appears to be outscoring many of the GIFTED students several grades up on the school's own testing. Acceleration, then, would make absolutely NO sense unless it was into the G&T classes.

    Dude, I love that you found a way to make it work for your DD (talk about taking the bull by the horns!), but DH is not in favor of any homeschooling. Honesty, I am not certain if it would work for DD anyway, at this point. DD seems to love the social aspect of school, but says generally she "hates school, because it is boring." DD would miss her friends and she is awfully self-directed for ME to be the one to homeschool her.

    Still trying to work with the school. Not sure that anything I have done has really changed anything at this point - I feel constant worry and guilt about my DC, wishing I could do more to meet their needs.

    Top
    #248993 - 07/06/21 08:46 AM Re: Differentiation within Gifted Program? [Re: indigo]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4884
    NOTE: The Davidson Database was updated in 2021. The article quoted upthread, in this post, has moved.

    "Gifted children: Youth mental health update" by Julia Osborn, 1996, published by Division of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry, Schneider Children's Hospital, is backed up on WayBack Machine, Internet archive.
    Links:
    1) article -
    . . https://web.archive.org/web/20200112034938/http://www.davidsongifted.org/search-database/entry/a10170
    2) list of archive dates/times -
    . . https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.davidsongifted.org/search-database/entry/a10170

    The Davidson Institute eNews-Update: June 2021 also contains a link to this article.
    The author of the article is Julia Osborn Ph.D., and she refers to the work of Miraca Gross and others.
    Much of the information presented is still relevant after a quarter of a century.
    Link - https://www.davidsongifted.org/gifted-blog/25-year-review-gifted-children-youth-mental-health/

    Top
    Page 1 of 4 1 2 3 4 >


    Moderator:  M-Moderator 
    Recent Posts
    Elitism
    by Vansh
    Yesterday at 10:05 PM
    Confidence Intervals
    by Emigee
    Yesterday at 02:08 PM
    Resources for impulse control?
    by indigo
    06/25/22 06:49 PM
    Technology may replace 40% of jobs in 15 years
    by indigo
    06/19/22 05:52 AM
    Stop Eliminating Gifted Programs for "Equity"
    by indigo
    06/18/22 09:17 AM
    Davidson Institute Twitter