Gifted Bulletin Board

Welcome to the Gifted Issues Discussion Forum.

We invite you to share your experiences and to post information about advocacy, research and other gifted education issues on this free public discussion forum.
CLICK HERE to Log In. Click here for the Board Rules.

Links


Learn about the Davidson Academy’s online campus for profoundly gifted students living anywhere in the U.S.

The Davidson Institute is a national nonprofit dedicated to supporting profoundly gifted students through the following programs:

  • Fellows Scholarship
  • Young Scholars
  • Davidson Academy
  • THINK Summer Institute
  • DITD FaceBook   DITD Twitter   DITD YouTube
    The Davidson Institute is on Facebook, Twitter and YouTube!

    How gifted-friendly is
    your state?

    Subscribe to the Davidson Institute's eNews-Update

    Who's Online
    0 registered (), 0 Guests and 73 Spiders online.
    Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
    Newest Members
    TEACHERMOM3.14, Drusillain, chinnny, Fast Words, LC001
    11242 Registered Users
    December
    Su M Tu W Th F Sa
    1 2 3
    4 5 6 7 8 9 10
    11 12 13 14 15 16 17
    18 19 20 21 22 23 24
    25 26 27 28 29 30 31
    Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >
    Topic Options
    #201819 - 09/23/14 08:22 PM Re: Learning math computations [Re: blackcat]
    ultramarina Offline
    Member

    Registered: 08/24/10
    Posts: 3428
    She must be pretty fluent for her to have passed the pretest? Or could she have gotten lucky? I wonder if you can assess her yourself? As seen in my thread, I have a DD in 6th grade math and they are hammering upper-level fluency--very LONG long division problems, multi-step word problems that involve doing multi-digit multiplication and long division of decimals, etc. Interestingly, they are also still spending a ton of time on high-level estimation and mental math skills, which DD hates with a passion (she really likes to be exact and just DO the problem!), but which I am starting to see the sense of (it's a number sense thing).

    Top
    #202047 - 09/26/14 11:03 AM Re: Learning math computations/Pre-algebra [Re: master of none]
    greenlotus Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/17/14
    Posts: 582
    Can I hop on with a pre-algebra question? My 9 and 10 year olds are both in 5th grade math doing long division, story problems with multiplication and division, plus taking an after school pre algebra class that uses the "Art of Problem Solving" text book. From what I am reading in this thread, it sounds like it is a good idea to keep plugging away at the multiplication and division work because it needs to become second nature to the kids. My younger one likes the "fun" stuff with Art of Problem Solving and gripes about the boring times tables. It sounds like I have plenty of ammunition to hold her to the fire?

    Top
    #202067 - 09/26/14 02:11 PM Re: Learning math computations/Pre-algebra [Re: blackcat]
    blackcat Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/23/13
    Posts: 2154
    I think the pre-test was multiple choice and I have no idea what was on it or what grade levels it was testing. They also looked at the computerized test scores (above-level) for math from the past year or so and compared all the subscores like "numbers and operations", "algebra", "geometry" etc. and supposedly considered all the data to decide where to place kids. I suspect DD is REALLY good at multiple choice tests for math and is able to eliminate obviously stupid answers. Doesn't mean she knows how to do the computations. I have baiscally no idea what goes on in that class and there is almost no homework but she says she's working at her own pace and passed the first test and is on chapter two now. I think I'm going to log her into a lower level course, though, which most of the kids in her grade are doing, and have her do it as well to make sure there are no gaps and give her extra practice. The videos/quizzes are online.

    Top
    #202072 - 09/26/14 02:40 PM Re: Learning math computations/Pre-algebra [Re: blackcat]
    aeh Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/26/14
    Posts: 3990
    I noticed this same phenomenon with one of mine when we were using the Singapore Math Primary Math test books. During the brief period of time when I was experimenting with using the tests, I switched from the open-response to multiple-choice forms mainly because of handwriting/fine-motor issues, but then found that #2 was a really good guesser on mc problems. Of course, it's not really guessing; it's having good number sense, estimation, and problem-solving skills. All excellent things. Unfortunately, that does not substitute for actually being able to generate precise answers when necessary!

    It did help me see that we would have to work on computation and problem solving somewhat independently, though.
    _________________________
    ...pronounced like the long vowel and first letter of the alphabet...

    Top
    #202077 - 09/26/14 03:47 PM Re: Learning math computations/Pre-algebra [Re: blackcat]
    blackcat Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/23/13
    Posts: 2154
    The teacher emailed me and said that he is struggling to get her to "show her work". Big surprise there, with her writing issues. I'm not sure what the solution is. I think she needs to copy problems out of a textbook into a notebook and she is not used to that. Everything up until this point has been workbooks. She is also supposed to be "taking notes" while watching the videos. She is 8 (almost 9)--is this really a realistic expectation? I just don't see that happening considering she couldn't even keep up with spelling tests last year and had the words all out of order (or completely blank) on the paper. I'm brainstorming for what I want put into a 504. She has a disability, but there is also just a huge gap between her age and the age of kids who normally do this sort of work, probably 7th-8th graders. Even the kids in her group are about 2 years older than her on average.

    Top
    #202079 - 09/26/14 04:08 PM Re: Learning math computations/Pre-algebra [Re: blackcat]
    BenjaminL Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/30/12
    Posts: 144
    Loc: Seattle
    Are any of those issues really impacting her? I.e. is someone else noticing she doesn't take notes, does not showing your work mean the problem itself isn't copied or just the intermediary steps and/or is the lack notes harming her comprehension?

    Top
    #202137 - 09/27/14 03:31 PM Re: Learning math computations/Pre-algebra [Re: blackcat]
    Loy58 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/11/13
    Posts: 816
    blackcat, I wouldn't be too crazy about the watching videos and taking notes approach, especially if she is not a quick scribe. So is this how instruction will take place going forward?

    I wonder the same things you do about DD9 and multiple choice tests - she is VERY good at them, but I do sometimes wonder whether she is almost TOO good at them, KWIM? DD cannot get away with not showing her work in math class, though...under our lovely Common Core-aligned EM classes she must. painstakingly, show. and. explain. her. work. (plus do the problems multiple ways). Surely, there is a happy medium? wink

    I'd still take your math over our math at this point. I think that everything DD has done so far this year has been review for her, so I am not yet sure how (if?) she will demonstrate math progress this year.

    Top
    #202138 - 09/27/14 04:13 PM Re: Learning math computations/Pre-algebra [Re: blackcat]
    blackcat Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/23/13
    Posts: 2154
    I'm skeptical of the "flipped math". So basically they watch video lectures on an ipad or something (who knows--I have her use a PC when she does it at home). And they do the actual "work" in class--at their own pace. They do some of the problems in the textbook. Luckily it's not like EM, it's more like what you or I would have done. If the kids don't understand what they are doing in class they are supposed to ask the teacher for help. It doesn't seem ideal but it is way better than what she was doing last year. Listening to long-winded lectures about how you figure out 5X3 and boring workbooks at the wrong level. To "move on" to the next unit, they need to score 90 percent or something on the unit test. But none of the kids would be taking the same test on the same day, necessarily. I'm not really sure what the purpose of the notes are. Because the textbooks are right there in the classroom. If she finishes the entire book and passes the tests, then they will move her onto Algebra I, even if it's the middle of the year. I just need to find out if all the tests are multiple choice. Because if they are, that seems like a really bad idea and I can see why he wants her to show the computations then.

    Top
    #202140 - 09/27/14 04:41 PM Re: Learning math computations/Pre-algebra [Re: blackcat]
    ElizabethN Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/17/12
    Posts: 1390
    Loc: Seattle area
    My daughter loooooooved her flipped math class last year, for what that's worth.

    Top
    #202141 - 09/27/14 04:53 PM Re: Learning math computations/Pre-algebra [Re: blackcat]
    aeh Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/26/14
    Posts: 3990
    Our oldest also had a flipped math class at one point, with a similar structure, which worked out fine. But the notes were graded only for their existence, not their length or quality. Actually, I think the teacher treated the notes more as documentation that the videos were watched.
    _________________________
    ...pronounced like the long vowel and first letter of the alphabet...

    Top
    Page 2 of 3 < 1 2 3 >


    Moderator:  M-Moderator, Mark D. 
    Recent Posts
    Out of level/early SAT
    by Vansh
    12/02/22 11:23 AM
    Aging
    by indigo
    12/01/22 01:33 PM
    WIAT-III outperforming WISC-V: 2e child
    by aeh
    11/30/22 08:17 PM
    The ultimate brag thread
    by Eagle Mum
    11/30/22 01:14 AM
    Q&A webinar for Davidson Young Scholars Program
    by indigo
    11/29/22 06:17 AM
    Davidson Institute Twitter