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Hello, I've lurked for years and have learned so much in these forums. Backstory: Our school district is very small (one HS, one middle, 2 elementary school), but it is an extremely well funded basic aid district in a CA coastal area for those of you familiar with CA school financing. And whatever the school budget doesn't cover, it seems parents do. On paper the MS looks great: high state test scores, rated as a 'school to watch' by the state, etc. But, it's academically a joke, and the only ones who seem to see it clearly are those who have moved to the town from out of state! My basis for comparison is PS in a strong district in VA for 2nd - 5th gr. We moved back to CA before DD started 6th gr. In VA, DD was in a math/science academy in a PS. We had great MS options with gifted magnet MS and a IB-MYP program. Bottom line, better schools in VA, far more options for GT. DD says 7th grade here is easier than 5th grade on the east coast. The majority (yes majority) of students in her school have a straight A average. Advanced academics are limited to: GT clustering for Lang Arts, where my daughter says there are no differences in learning opportunities that she can see and, she takes algebra as do about 10% of 7th graders. Over the past year, I have met with guidance counselor (who told me 'maybe you should look at private school) and the principal, to advocate for advanced academic classes/grouping those kids together to learn from one another, with the same feedback: 'This is already a high functioning school due to parent education base and socioeconomics, so our 'standard' academics are well above the standard elsewhere, and we don't need advanced academic classes for anything else. We want all our kids to succeeed and they'll sink or swim in HS'. It's ridiculous...I can't believe how they have no idea what the real world holds. Basically, the kids don't get challenged and the parents don't complain because their kids all get straight A's. DD is not PG; she is HG, which means there are plenty of kids like her in the school! She has a 100+ average or above in every class, takes a 0 period extra class, does volunteer work at school, but there's not anything else available. To start over in 8th grade at a private school adds a whole level of stress as there are no private schools in our town, so it would be a whole new world and commute. I have asked the principal to consider independent study (where she could do out offor some classes. However, the principal flat out said she would not consider it. She does not believe there is a problem with the school's level of challenge. She feels like over time the common core rigor will further elevate the school's academics (maybe, but they've implemented nada for 7th gr so far). It is so frustrating. DD feels like most the kids just don't care very much, but that there are many other kids that are more 'like her' who get frustrated with boredom too. It kills me that this school district spends 40% more per student than our old district and wastes it, and refuses to acknowledge that there is benefit for GT students to have challenge in their curriculum. I hear from many parents with kids in our local HS that it gets pretty tough by soph/jr year and they wish the MS prepared them better. Duh! How do you get a principal to understand that the same kids who want to take AP/honors in HS are sitting in her MS bored out of their minds, and that they too are deserving of an appropriate education!! Do you have advanced academic classes in your MS? I can supplement outside of school. But my DD plays an instrument and two sports. Why in wealthy school district should I have to fill her remaining hours with catch up academics? Does anyone have empirical sources/data to support for the advantages of providing advanced academics in MS for the HG? Has anyone successfullly advocated for independent study in a CA school district? I have lots of articles on ability grouping, but many are dated. I have spoken to other parents about this issue and amazed at how many agree with me, but because the elementary schools and HS are good, they endure the MS due to limited options for private schools nearby. Sorry for the long post.

Welcome!

You may wish to explore the private school option. Possibly if enough other parents also choose to do this, it may provide an opportunity to carpool. It may also signal to the public middle school that additional challenge is needed to keep students learning and prevent planting the seeds of underachievement.

The extra length of commute may reduce the amount of time available for your daughter's extracurricular activities.

As a family you may wish to discuss the options you are most comfortable with (those which help you feel most resilient versus stressed to the max and unable to handle the next curve ball life may toss at you). Determine which options will stay on the table for further discussion and consideration.

It is great to be prepared with lists of questions to compare each potential school. The questions to ask when seeking information that will help predict a good educational fit may be different for each family. In general, when selecting a school parents may want to ask about:
1) anything that you have been trying to put in place in your children's current learning environment,
2) details for anything described on the potential new school's website,
3) anything mentioned or observed during the school tour.

A parent may wish to consider their children's current learning experience and ask questions that would help them compare/contrast how the students' learning experience in the new school would be the same/different from what they have now. For example: How are children grouped for instruction? Would it be easier to advocate for having the child's needs met at the new school?

There are more ideas in the book "A Parent's Guide to Gifted Children", which has Chapter 14 dedicated to "Finding a Good Educational Fit".

There are lists of considerations and questions for choosing a school found online at Davidson database, greatschools website, and other websearch results.

Information at the following links on the Davidson Database may be of interest...
1- Advocacy - Working with your child's school http://www.davidsongifted.org/db/Articles_id_10558.aspx
2- Choosing the right school for your gifted child http://www.davidsongifted.org/db/Articles_id_10511.aspx
3- Basic educational options for gifted children http://www.davidsongifted.org/db/Articles_id_10270.aspx
4- Guidebook - Advocating for Exceptionally Gifted Young People, plus lists of other resources http://www.davidsongifted.org/db/browse_resources_165.aspx

If it does not seem like a good fit, you may wish to visit/tour other schools, have your daughter shadow, and work toward choosing the learning environment with the best (or least-worst) "fit".

I am also in a wealthy CA school district who's schools are supposedly one of the best in the area. I understand where you are coming from. My DS15 is a freshman in H.S. and has just gone through junior high. Junior High is CA is mostly a waste of time. In my CA district this seems to be a common complaint from parents. The elementary schools are know to be good and the H.S. is top ranked with top numbers of students taking AP and getting national merit. But the kids just float through junior high. It seems like "someone" had decided that 12/13 year old students need to be kept in a holding pattern because of their emotions. The academics are weak and the only real acceleration offered is in math, Algebra in 7th or 8th.

I found this particularly bad for science. The science was been there done that all year long for both years. And last year due to common core was even more text/language based. In humanities we have a "honors" class that at least grouped all the gifted kids together.

I know of no one who managed independent study in Middle School, but I do know of a few who decided to home school during those grade. The problem with doing that in my district it is THE ONLY way to be in the top math track in H.S., is to already be in the district top math track in junior high. It's one of these if we make an exception for one kid, we will have to make it for everyone arguments. And OUR honors math is much more difficult than any other class. Unless you can show that you just moved into the area, and have coursework from another brick and mortar AND take a test you will not get into their honors maths classes.

Thank you all for your thoughtful responses. I truly appreciate them.

Indigo, I read the first 3 articles you referenced over the past year, actually, so thank you for the feedback...it does make me feel better that I was on the right track. Also, DD is not exceptionally gifted. I only know this because school was so lame last year that I got her tested to better assess if school became so easy because of her aptitude, or because it did not present enough challenge to the above average smart kid (she had been tested in VA and was ID gifted based on group OLSAT but never had indiv test there).

Neither myself or my husband ever attended public school (catholic school all the way through for him; catholic elem and private HS for me). We made a conscious decision to give the VA public schools a try, mostly to try to assimilate into the community, when we moved there when DD started 2nd gr (she was private school here before then). Turns out, the VA schools really did devise programs to meet the needs of different types of students. Bottom line, it made be a believer that public schools can do great things. If a big school district can do it, surely a small well funded one with a much higher-educated parent base can. Or should!

What frustrates me is the MS principal's absolute belief that the school cannot possibly do anything because 'it already offers such a rigorous academic environment'. Her support for that opinon is the school's strong standardized test scores (gee, demographics have nothing to do with that! Don't get me started...), and 'how successful the students are'. I'm sorry, 20% of the school having straight A's and 60%+ having a 3.5 GPA or above is not an indication of rigor...it's the opposite!

My DD has shadowed at a few private schools. In fact, my younger kids both go to different private schools that meet their needs best (one quirky smarty pants DS whose school only goes to 3rd grade, and another DD at Catholic school which just works for her personality, but which older DD did not consider due to its extremely small 7th grade).

DD liked the private schools she checked out, but didn't love them. The biggest difference she noticed was 'less kids who were tuned out because the classes were smaller' and more back and forth interaction (hmm, teaching?) between the students and teachers. Because there is no private school in town, it's upheaval for the fam, and missing out on forming relationships with locals, if she goes private, not to mention the financial sacrifice. DD really wanted the MS to work out here..and,

I didn't want to go down now without a fight.

In a school district with far more $ (average student expenditures= $14K per student, average teacher salary = $97K, and a school-supporting nonprofit pours in additional $500K a year for whatever is needed), 3% ESL, and about 10% 'socioceconomically disadvantaged...does it get any easier to step it up a notch?

The rest of this post is a rant.

I met with the MS principal today to discuss what could be done to offer more meaningful engagement given she will not consider independent study. After the principal saying 'your daughter is the 1% and there is absolutely no way I can make classes more challenging while still meeting the needs of everyone else' and me suggesting that the stats suggest there is opportunity for challenge for a group much larger than just my daughter (the other 20% straight A-ers, for example), I suggested the very basic idea of offering advanced academics core classes. The absolute answer was no, not gonna happen. Clearer than that, 'there is nothing, absolutely nothing, we can do in the classroom, but you can consider more extracurricular activities.' Left me speechless.

I'd found copies of current research articles, position statements from the NAGC/NMSA regarding meeting the needs of high ability and high potential learners, and a dissertation on 'Designing a Middle School Education Program of Excellence' that speak to the value of challenge, authentic learning, and working with appropriate peer groups. But advocating is difficult when you are dealing with a principal who will not move off the premise of 'there's nothing we can do'. Her level of ignorance is astounding.

Master of none, it seems there are lots of involved parents in elem years in public school here. But I think it takes parents all of 6th grade to figure out that their kid adjusted fine to MS, and another 1/2 year to figure out the MS is an academic joke, then, who wants to move their kid at the end of 7th grade, when the high school is decent? Ha, maybe we are in the same school district !

I actually could care less about grades. I care about my child's passion for learning...fueling that while getting her comfortable that the pursuit of knowledge can and should take effort is what I want, so that she ultimately relies on her own skills and sensibilities to pursue whatever opportunities she chooses to in life.

Blue Magic, I too would love to know who this 'someone' is who decided hanging out in MS until any passion you ever had for learning just for the sake of learning is a faint glimmer. If it were up to me, we'd go back to the K - 8 model.

DD is taking algebra currently, in 7th grade. She likes it because she's learning. I'm not necessarily a huge fan of cramming everything down but in the absence of anything else challenging, I encouraged her try it because who cares if she decided to retake it in 8th grade. She's sort of mathy so it's been fine.

BTW, as far as DD getting all 100's, there's so much extra credit available that basically if you are an A student and do even some EC, you'll end up with a 100 average. DD will do some EC because she cares, and wala, straight A+'s. I'm not a huge HW fan but because she's rarely got more than 45 minutes, never any on the weekend, etc. it's not hard to do a little EC.

Thank you again for your responses. I'll go back to lurking now:)

Master of None, I will look into the art of problem solving (I reviewed awhile ago for my younger son but have to revisit).

So we're like moving to private school for 8th grade, just so my daughter gets some confidence that she will be prepared for HS. But I'm not leaving without providing feedback to the school board. I've paid my property taxes for 20 years in this town so I feel I'm entitled to it!

For your own DC, yes. Sending a message to the district won't work, though. Basic Aid districts in CA get their funding through means other than daily attendance counts; they actually lose money per student enrolled. Ours openly invites parents who don't like the options to leave for private, since it results in more money per kid left in the district.

I sympathize, this is ridiculous.

Yes, you are addressing the monetary motivation... might there also be a motivation for high standardized test scores? High test scores are often provided by top performers, and several top performers leaving may cause a school to take notice.

K-8 model doesn't fix this problem. The standards for what the kids learn is set mostly by the state & district. What I find makes the most difference is individual teachers. My older DD went to a public K-8 for all nine years. My son only his first 4 years, we moved him when my daughter went to H.S. and he got into the districts gifted program. While there were good things about the K-8 school and I was overall happy with the school for my daughter. The middle school at the K-8 is a lot smaller and it had fewer resources for the gifted kids than the large junior high my son attended.