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    Joined: Dec 2013
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    My DS6 was also very difficult from 2-5. We joke that he uses his intelligence for evil. Not really, but he's a boundary tester. He still does it, except I've learned to laugh a little about the extremes he will go to to find where the boundaries are. A great example of this was when he was 4 and I was visiting a friend. There was a large fountain nearby and my son managed to dunk his hair in the fountain. I told him to stay off the fountain. He obliged, but then proceeded to keep one foot on the ground and straddled the ledge so he could stick his other foot in the fountain. Technically he was "off the fountain". I can laugh about it now, but so very irritating in the moment. It's hard to discipline a kid like that.

    He did used to throw epic tantrums too that would last hours. We saw a family therapist when it got so disruptive that we couldn't enjoy life with him. We couldn't go anywhere and his little sister was getting ignored because he was so out of control. He would explode into hours long screaming its over simple things like asking him to get his shoes on. It was a very scary time. In hindsight, this was likely due to a major change be because his sister went to preschool, so our nanny who'd watched him since he was a baby had left.

    I do remember feeling relief at dropping him off at school during this time. You may want to seek some family therapy. I read a ton of books trying to figure out what to do and we had a huge "toolbox" to deal with behavior. The therapist was actually amazed at how well we were able to switch from technique to technique. It wasn't like we weren't doing a good job. The parent-child bond had just gotten broken down and we were in a terrible cycle that needed to be broken.

    There were 2 things that worked for us that may or may not work for you. First, the child-led play was a critical one. Just 10 minutes to let him lead you and tell you what to do and you indulge him in tons of positive feedback. It felt very odd to do that, but lots of compliments and letting him be in control for a small amount of time helped. He also received undivided attention in a fun, totally loving way. This helped strengthen the parent/child bond again.

    The second was that he was dealing with a lot of anxiety. We knew he was able to think ahead through time in a way that far beyond his age. He would constantly worry about things that were happening months ahead of time. We stopped telling him about big changes because he would get so anxious about it. There are some things that can't be avoided though, like summer break. To combat this, the therapist suggested listening to guided meditation to help him relax. We incorporated it into his bedtime routine and he still listens to it.

    I just wanted to share that therapy might be something to consider because a pG kid can be very intense and they can understand things that they aren't emotionally able to handle. Just like school, they sometimes require special handling with behavior too. It doesn't mean you are a bad parent. We learned we are actually really great at it, but we still needed help.

    Good luck!



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    You are not alone. My DD started 'testing' behaviors at about 18 months and at first we thought that it was just the 'Terrible Twos' it wasn't it got worse. With others she was a docile little lambkin but with us, my Lord!

    DW and I even had a private name for her which combined Karakatoa with her name it was so bad. At about 3.5 it calmed down. Hang in there.


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    Originally Posted by Dude
    "Third, I would advise you to start talking with your DH over every seemingly-insignificant interaction with your son, so you can establish a uniformity in your boundaries and responses between the two of you. "

    We already do. More than any couple I know, we spend all night talking about how to deal with every moment we are with him in the day. We come up with responses and contingency responses and edge cases. We have to adapt them frequently because he outsmarts us, out-negotiates us and outlasts us. We marvel at his brain and we despair at his inability to yield. The only time he sort of relaxes his aggressive need to control is when he's sick.

    Originally Posted by Dude
    "First, I would advise you to abandon the notion that exercising authority is associated with crushing spirit. The arbitrary and capricious exercise of authority can do that. "
    I have already had moments where I've crushed his spirit. I've seen it. He cried and told his grandparents "I'm sad because I'm a naughty boy and I want to be good" and he was really subdued. He also says, "Don't scold me, Mama." and I have had to apologize to him for my harshness. But it doesn't change his willingness to listen. It does change my willingness to keep correcting his behavior. Because after all, he's only 2.

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    Just remember everything changes. You may not like the next stage much but it will be different and he will be older.

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    Thank you for those those of your who are able to commiserate... it really does help.

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    Originally Posted by mlam
    I have already had moments where I've crushed his spirit. I've seen it. He cried and told his grandparents "I'm sad because I'm a naughty boy and I want to be good" and he was really subdued. He also says, "Don't scold me, Mama." and I have had to apologize to him for my harshness. But it doesn't change his willingness to listen. It does change my willingness to keep correcting his behavior. Because after all, he's only 2.

    The thing about spirits is that they are remarkably resilient, so it's okay for him to get down once in a while. This is also where it's important to intervene so he understands the message is about the behaviors and choices, which is something he can control, rather than a permanent judgement on him, which he can't. "You're not a naughty boy, you just made a bad choice. Next time, you can choose differently."

    It also looks like you're effectively handing him the tools to manipulate you. If he commands you to stop scolding, and you respond by apologizing, you've allowed him to take control of the conversation and steer it to his own ends. If he's making you reevaluate your commitment to correcting him, then you're allowing him to sabotage your best weapon, which is consistency.

    For commitment, it helps to keep in mind that any behaviors you're trying to correct are for his benefit, because they'll either keep him safe, or help him in future social settings where you're not there to guide him. In either case, he's far better off for you to correct him than if you don't. Two is the best time to be teaching these things, rather than years down the line when they've become ingrained habits.

    My DD9 still says, "Stop yelling at me," when we're disciplining her in a normal tone, because that's an uncomfortable conversation for her, so she responds with a normal avoidance technique.

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    "You're not a naughty boy, you just made a bad choice. Next time, you can choose differently."

    I agree with your diagnosis but I wouldn't even go that far with a very stubborn child, though this might work with some children. Telling my child she wasn't naughty opened up a conversation about how she WAS naughty and how I hated her. "I don't hate you but..." "Yes you do!!!" Escalating bizarre statements intended to make me feel bad. Etc.

    Instead I'd just repeat the previous statement. Don't even acknowledge the self-pity.

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    This is all you need. Really:

    http://www.amazon.com/Setting-Strong-Willed-Revised-Expanded-Edition/dp/0770436595

    DS7 is pretty strong willed. We refer to DD3 as having a "titanium" strength will. She sounds like your DC a bit. Except we have titanium strength boundaries at home, so things are pretty smooth here. In a nutshell, the book outlines that you MUST be consistent with your boundaries because there are some children in the world who simply LOVE and need to always test the boundaries in their worlds. The trick is for you to maintain and enforce boundaries consistently without getting crazy. (I know, not easy at first.) One of the examples from the book (I think): when you get pulled over for a traffic violation, the cop doesn't (or shouldn't!) get upset and start whining at you asking why you had to break the law in the first place. The cop tells you why you've been pulled over, gives you a consequence and sends you on your way. No need to get tied in knots.

    Your concern about your child's spirit being squashed: having worked with lots of kids over the years and with my own kids, a child is MUCH freer in a world with clear boundaries and consequences. With a child who is not used to boundaries and consequences, when rules are put in place, at first, the child will have a hard time. But once things stabilize, the child is so much happier and freer because he can just relax and do something other than testing boundaries 24/7. (Though a strong willed child will need to test boundaries every now and then - just because that's the kind of "research" they need to do.)

    Get the book. Read it. Do it. :-)

    BTDT

    Last edited by somewhereonearth; 03/21/14 05:08 PM.
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    I find with DS-almost-2.5, dubbed "the tornado", we have to explain in great detail before an incident happens why something isn't a good idea. Prophylactic discipline.

    Now, I try to hold/hug DS when he's oppositional or being disciplined. I find the gentle physical contact conveys a very strong "I care about you" message and contextualizes disciplinary wording. We keep the emphasis on the behaviour, not the person, and praise randomly when DS is behaving well.

    I agree with Dude that consistency is the best gift you can give your child. Set only essential, hard boundaries and be laser focused about enforcing them. I pick one or two behaviours to work on and aim for 90%+ consistency in making corrections. It usually takes a week or two to remediate a behaviour this way and, because DS hears the same message constantly, he is able to quickly assimilate the expectations for him.


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