Gifted Bulletin Board

Welcome to the Gifted Issues Discussion Forum.

We invite you to share your experiences and to post information about advocacy, research and other gifted education issues on this free public discussion forum.
CLICK HERE to Log In. Click here for the Board Rules.

Links


Learn about the Davidson Academy’s online campus for profoundly gifted students living anywhere in the U.S.

The Davidson Institute is a national nonprofit dedicated to supporting profoundly gifted students through the following programs:

  • Fellows Scholarship
  • Young Scholars
  • Davidson Academy
  • THINK Summer Institute
  • DITD FaceBook   DITD Twitter   DITD YouTube
    The Davidson Institute is on Facebook, Twitter and YouTube!

    How gifted-friendly is
    your state?

    Subscribe to the Davidson Institute's eNews-Update

    Who's Online
    0 registered (), 0 Guests and 60 Spiders online.
    Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
    Newest Members
    JulissaWare, endcityradical, pensionlutz, logo digitizing, Kevin J Dalton
    11234 Registered Users
    November
    Su M Tu W Th F Sa
    1 2 3 4 5
    6 7 8 9 10 11 12
    13 14 15 16 17 18 19
    20 21 22 23 24 25 26
    27 28 29 30
    Page 4 of 6 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 >
    Topic Options
    #185003 - 03/15/14 08:46 PM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: binip]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4954
    Originally Posted By: binip
    ... accept the truth about school, which is that she may not get what she needs from it... expectations of education are across the board, and we have a LOT of people who are not incentivized to learn anything at all because of structural inequality. So you have to think... what can I expect from the school?
    Because the school may be teaching to the bottom 10% as you mentioned, we have lot of people who are not incentivized to learn anything and that is structural inequality. This is why we advocate: to help gain access to higher academic curriculum so children will be incentivized to learn. The challenge and stimulation of new ideas presented by advanced academics will continue to strengthen neural development, enhancing their brain's development. This is an intriguing area of research.

    Taxpayers funding the public school system have a voice in helping shape and define that public school system.

    Quote:
    School is about demonstrating existing knowledge for a lot of kids. That's the success. Not everyone likes demonstrating knowledge, but that's what it's about.
    Yes, some classrooms offer differentiation which consists of differentiated work products, but no instruction. Children may be required to teach themselves and produce at a higher level (sometimes both quality and quantity), demonstrating existing knowledge without being taught. This is why we advocate to change our children's lived experiences with the schools.

    Top
    #185005 - 03/15/14 09:35 PM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: polarbear]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4954
    Originally Posted By: polarbear
    ... the catty/possessive thing with other girls became full-on and hasn't really let up... teachers still tend to see it as a girl issue (particularly so as the girls reach puberty and hormones are all over the place!) and not as an overtly bullying issue.
    Just as abuse can be physical or mental, bullying can occur in different forms. While physical aggression has long been recognized as bullying, relational aggression is only recently becoming better understood as bullying. In addition to the catty/possessive aspects, relational aggression may include cyber bullying.

    A web search on relational aggression yields an extensive list of results to explore.

    The book Queen Bees and Wannabes (2002) and the movies Freaky Friday (2003) and Mean Girls (2004) may have helped raise awareness of relational aggression.

    Top
    #185010 - 03/15/14 10:01 PM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: indigo]
    binip Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/10/14
    Posts: 96
    Originally Posted By: indigo
    Originally Posted By: binip
    ... accept the truth about school, which is that she may not get what she needs from it... expectations of education are across the board, and we have a LOT of people who are not incentivized to learn anything at all because of structural inequality. So you have to think... what can I expect from the school?
    Because the school may be teaching to the bottom 10% as you mentioned, we have lot of people who are not incentivized to learn anything and that is structural inequality. This is why we advocate: to help gain access to higher academic curriculum so children will be incentivized to learn. The challenge and stimulation of new ideas presented by advanced academics will continue to strengthen neural development, enhancing their brain's development. This is an intriguing area of research.

    Taxpayers funding the public school system have a voice in helping shape and define that public school system.

    Quote:
    School is about demonstrating existing knowledge for a lot of kids. That's the success. Not everyone likes demonstrating knowledge, but that's what it's about.
    Yes, some classrooms offer differentiation which consists of differentiated work products, but no instruction. Children may be required to teach themselves and produce at a higher level (sometimes both quality and quantity), demonstrating existing knowledge without being taught. This is why we advocate to change our children's lived experiences with the schools.


    I completely agree with needing to change the system, get involved, advocate, etc. It is no accident that I personally live in a district where I can't buy, but we rent, and in which I work hard to get my kids into the best schools.

    My advice here is for the OP and her daughter, because there is a good reason to believe that making school fun and enjoyable for this kid (vs. tolerable) is going to be a very long battle.

    And helping her daughter understand that there's nothing wrong with her for not enjoying it, I think, is one thing to do to alleviate stress.

    Guilt and fear are a huge part of stress and unhappiness. When you feel like you are understood and supported--even if you still have to suffer through something--you can often tolerate it much better. "School is boring for me. That's okay. It doesn't mean I can't ever learn anything again. Sure, I don't really fit in here. But I do fit in at my girl's Lego club, and I have friends, and I know I'm a worthy person. My family knows what I'm going through and they support me in getting through the day."

    Of course you want to change the child's surroundings, not to mention the entire school system. But in the short term, the child is suffering and probably feeling bad about suffering. That is what I'm trying to address.

    I completely agree that we need to advocate.

    Top
    #185011 - 03/15/14 10:32 PM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: KnittingMama]
    Ivy Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/08/14
    Posts: 337
    KnittingMama, pinip's very interesting points brought something to mind. You said that DS had similar issues in 1st and you pulled him out to homeschool. You also said that you told DD that 1st would be better. Maybe she's angry with you as well. Could it be that she sees you as having misled her about 1st being better? Is she angry that DS got to escape and she doesn't? Please understand I'm not trying to judge you or say that you really meant any of that, but might that be her perspective?

    Top
    #185026 - 03/16/14 07:16 AM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: binip]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4954
    Originally Posted By: binip
    Guilt and fear are a huge part of stress and unhappiness. When you feel like you are understood and supported--even if you still have to suffer through something--you can often tolerate it much better. "School is boring for me. That's okay. It doesn't mean I can't ever learn anything again. Sure, I don't really fit in here. But I do fit in at my girl's Lego club, and I have friends, and I know I'm a worthy person. My family knows what I'm going through and they support me in getting through the day."
    smile

    Top
    #185029 - 03/16/14 07:55 AM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: binip]
    KnittingMama Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/04/12
    Posts: 267
    Loc: California
    Thanks binip, you've given me a lot to think about.

    First, I wouldn't say homeschool is out of the question for both kids. This was our first year, and DS is still reeling from 2 years of bad public school experience. Could I have homeschooled both of them last fall? No. But I have no doubt that if DD needed to be home, we could make it work. smile

    Reminding DD to make her own work more challenging is a good idea. She has done this in the past, and it's something I should remind her about again if she starts complaining about work being too easy.


    Quote:
    School is about demonstrating existing knowledge for a lot of kids. That's the success. Not everyone likes demonstrating knowledge, but that's what it's about.


    I know that this is true for many kids, but it shouldn't be. In fact, this was a huge problem for DS last year. He had been coasting by for his entire (short) school career. Then all of a sudden he was accelerated 2 years in math, placed in a class where he *didn't* know all of the material, and freaked out. Oops. At some point kids are going to get to a class where it's about learning and not just demonstrating. This may happen in elementary school, or maybe not until college. But it's a disservice to those kids to allow them to think school is not about learning at all.

    But I digress. I'm really not interested in trying to change the system right now; our school system is too big and unwieldy for me to fight effectively. I'm just looking for small fixes and ideas I can use to prevent DD from spiraling into something worse.

    Top
    #185032 - 03/16/14 08:04 AM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: Ivy]
    KnittingMama Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/04/12
    Posts: 267
    Loc: California
    Originally Posted By: Ivy
    KnittingMama, pinip's very interesting points brought something to mind. You said that DS had similar issues in 1st and you pulled him out to homeschool. You also said that you told DD that 1st would be better. Maybe she's angry with you as well. Could it be that she sees you as having misled her about 1st being better? Is she angry that DS got to escape and she doesn't? Please understand I'm not trying to judge you or say that you really meant any of that, but might that be her perspective?


    To be fair, 1st grade *is* much better than Kinder was. Her teacher is a million times better, and has been responsive when we asked for some differentiation. And DD loves her teacher this year (she merely "liked" her teacher last year). We've had many talks lately about all the things her teacher has done to improve the classroom, either for DD alone, or for the entire class. She knows it's better, so I don't think she's angry about that.

    OTOH, I am also certain she feels neglected because DS gets to stay home, and I am certain some of her outbursts stem from the frustration of being DS's sister. The squeaky wheel gets the grease, and DS is very, very squeaky. What to do if you're DD? Become squeakier! smile

    Top
    #185034 - 03/16/14 08:19 AM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: KnittingMama]
    KnittingMama Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/04/12
    Posts: 267
    Loc: California
    (Apparently I am incapable of a single post this morning. Ah well.)

    Thank you @indigo and @polarbear and @blackcat and @MSP for bringing up bullying. This was not something I had seriously considered before. Reflecting back earlier in the year, there was some stuff going on with a classmate that maybe would be considered bullying. I don't know enough of the details (nor did the teacher when we discussed it in the fall) to know exactly what was going on, other than to say it was not physical. DD's response was to avoid the girl, and she says that works. But I wonder if that has led either to her avoiding all the other girls, or the other girls in her class avoiding her.

    Top
    #185036 - 03/16/14 08:37 AM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: KnittingMama]
    blackcat Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/23/13
    Posts: 2154
    Even if it's not really "bullying" and just age-typical cattiness, that can have a profound effect on some kids. My experience is that girls that are around 7 are the worst. They are old enough to be manipulative but too young to have a good grasp for how their actions affect others and ruin relationships. They are old enough to realize how much power they have and they run wild with it. In third grade things have been MUCH better, although it could just be the class with a nice group of girls. You may want to talk more with your DD about the other kids and see if you can get a feel for whether they are upsetting her.

    Top
    #185054 - 03/16/14 05:45 PM Re: advice for an unhappy 1st grader [Re: KnittingMama]
    mom2one Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/29/12
    Posts: 128
    Quote:
    I know that this is true for many kids, but it shouldn't be. In fact, this was a huge problem for DS last year. He had been coasting by for his entire (short) school career. Then all of a sudden he was accelerated 2 years in math, placed in a class where he *didn't* know all of the material, and freaked out. Oops. At some point kids are going to get to a class where it's about learning and not just demonstrating. This may happen in elementary school, or maybe not until college. But it's a disservice to those kids to allow them to think school is not about learning at all.


    Yes, I completely agree with this.

    Also, I truly think it depends on the kind of child you have - some kids may be fine with school being boring overall, and learning to stay under the radar -- do whatever they are asked to do, with no complaints. Some kids may still do whatever they are asked to do, but it may manifest in other behaviors (anxiety, nightmares etc). Some other kids may just refuse to do work that is easy for them, or may refuse to do work because of a hidden disability. So, I think it depends.

    Binip, you do make a lot of interesting points. I am all about teaching coping mechanisms - so your posts did help.

    KnittingMama, I hope you get to the bottom of this. From what you have written, I don't think it is bullying, but it could be catty behavior. I also agree with Polarbear, I see it a lot among the girls in my kid's class, but not with the boys.

    Top
    Page 4 of 6 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 >


    Moderator:  M-Moderator 
    Recent Posts
    The ultimate brag thread
    by Eagle Mum
    11/22/22 02:19 AM
    Gifted Adults: Living with Emotional Intensity
    by indigo
    11/19/22 12:23 PM
    Understanding testing!
    by Klangedin
    11/13/22 06:35 AM
    Gift ideas Holiday 2022!
    by indigo
    11/10/22 03:19 AM
    Classroom support for advanced reader
    by indigo
    11/10/22 02:58 AM
    Davidson Institute Twitter