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    Joined: Mar 2008
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    Here's one for kids who can write with fingers but have difficulty with tools:

    http://www.visionobjects.com/en/myscript/math-application/myscript-mathpad/description/

    They are free apps for android and ipad that will translate finger writing for note taking and for math. The math app claims to be able to convert to LaTex which would be handy for anyone that needs that function for an AOPS class.

    Last edited by master of none; 01/20/14 06:11 AM.
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    Just got the email that lots of you are probably getting too, but just in case:
    Efofex equation is now out for Mac.

    http://efofex.com/

    It is free for those with disabilities who can provide the supporting documentation (see website for details). Otherwise, looks like it would be 55.00 for the full math pack (equation, draw, stat, and graph).


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    I'm scoping out the Panther apps: Panther Math Paper (which lets you drag and drop numbers into their proper places, lining up the digits appropriately) and Panther Writer (which has several adaptive keyboards, including swiping.)

    Any experience with those?

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    Dee Dee, had a brief look. It's expensive for an App so didn't buy it, but had a question about Panther-- looked like it GIVES you the math problems and it was unclear if you are able to put in your own math problems- like would happen if you are doing your classwork or homework assigned by teacher. If you find out you can do your own problems, I'd be very interested to know!

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    This is slightly off topic, but I'm not sure where to find out my answer...you all look like you might have some ideas for me. smile My DD (8) is recently diagnosed 2E with ADD and mild dyslexia. Frankly, I think it's more of a dysgraphia as she has all the symptoms and is "reading" without too much difficulty 2 grades above where she's at. So, my question is this: If dysgraphia doesn't really improve long term with more practice writing, at what age should we start accommodations? I asked her reading specialist (DD is seeing her for lessons in Orton-Gillingham) and she seemed to think I should wait. I'm torn--I don't want her NOT to practice her hand-writing, but it's such a battle every time and she's really going hard-core with her avoidance behaviors (tantrums, constant chattering and topic changing, absolute refusal to write more for the reading specialist, etc). I doubt she's getting much from the practicing at this point, and I keep thinking that if I provide some sort of accommodation it might reduce the overall stress of writing for her. Do you think this might provide too much of a "crutch"?

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    Originally Posted by master of none
    Dee Dee, had a brief look. It's expensive for an App so didn't buy it, but had a question about Panther-- looked like it GIVES you the math problems and it was unclear if you are able to put in your own math problems- like would happen if you are doing your classwork or homework assigned by teacher. If you find out you can do your own problems, I'd be very interested to know!

    OK, MON, I'll let you know. I think it's more flexible than just "set problems."

    I expect we're going to pony up for the math paper ($20!); less sure about the writing app ($30!).



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    Originally Posted by 1mom
    If dysgraphia doesn't really improve long term with more practice writing, at what age should we start accommodations?

    We started teaching DS7 touch typing in 1st grade and are trying to make accommodations available across the day in 2nd.

    DeeDee

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    Who diagnosed your dd? Was it school, a neuropsych, other? Did she have any indication of dysgraphia in the testing, and if so, were there any follow-up tests to determine the cause of the potential dysgraphia symptoms? Did the person who did the evaluation look at any handwriting samples from school or during testing? <= I asked these questions because I think the first thing you need to do in order to answer your question below is to determine if your dd is or isn't dysgraphic.

    Quote
    So, my question is this: If dysgraphia doesn't really improve long term with more practice writing, at what age should we start accommodations?

    Our ds was diagnosed at 8 (end of 2nd grade). His neuropsych recommended that we put accommodations in place immediately (scribing first, teach him to type, then move all his work to typing, then add in word substitution etc, then later on start voice-to-text, and assume from the start that as an adult he would never be able to rely on handwriting). We were also told to right away have him work on a program to learn how to print "to the best of his ability" and then *stop*, and he was referred for approximately 1 year of handwriting OT (which helped him quite a bit - it didn't make his dysgraphia disappear, but it gave him correct posture, correct grip, alleviated wrist pain, and helped him develop legible handwriting).

    The first thing I'd do (if I was you) is ask my dd if her wrist or hand hurts when she has to write. This is a classic symptom of dysgraphia, and I think it happens because of odd posture, grip, squeezing on the pencil while writing etc. If this is happening it might or might not mean dysgraphia, but it most likely *does* mean she needs some help with pencil grip, posture etc - so an OT fine motor eval might be useful.

    If you want to post some more details about her testing etc we might be able to tell you whether or not what is seen there is similar to what our dysgraphic children have as indications of dysgraphia on testing. You can also look at her handwriting samples - is her handwriting uneven (letter size, spacing, running into the edges of the paper etc), is her pencil pressure on paper uneven, does she have challenges with punctuation, does she mix capitals and lowercase, is she still reversing letters when she writes - those are all indications of potential dysgraphia.

    Whether or not I'd rely on the reading specialist's advice depends a *lot* on the reading specialist's background - has she worked with children with dysgraphia before and does she understand what it is? Or has she solely focused on reading?

    Re dyslexia and reading ahead of grade level - I have a dyslexic dd - reading challenges can be really diverse and complicated. It is possible to be reading ahead of grade level yet be struggling with one of the many skills required to be a good efficient reader with good comprehension. My dd had a really wide variety of tests when she was evaluated by a reading specialist, and some of them she scores really really high on, but there is one specific skill set hidden in among all the others that she is challenged with - and working with a reading specialist targeting that specific skill has really helped her improve her reading ability and self-confidence.


    I am not an expert, so take this with a grain of salt, but I believe that dysgraphia and dyslexia are somewhat related. My dh's family has a smattering of cousins (and most likely adult relatives) who have one or the other or both co-occurring with each other. The flip side of that though is... it's possible that what looks like dysgraphia in a young child *might* be dyslexia or some other reading challenge. My dyslexic dd did not like to write when she was in early elementary and her handwriting looked somewhat dysgraphic with a lot of reversals and huge challenges with spelling. She's not dysgraphic though - she doesn't have the same types of indications in neuropsych testing that would indicate dysgraphia that my ds has, and her letter reversals decreased and eventually disappeared as moved from 1st-3rd grade. She is still challenged with spelling but that's related to her reading challenge, not dysgraphia. And yes, she's a kid who would scream and shout and refuse to write when she was younger. So did my dysgraphic ds. I think just starting with that question "does it hurt your hand (wrist) when you write?" might help you flesh out whether or not it's related to a reading challenge or dysgraphia. Just a thought!

    Best wishes,

    polarbear

    ps - 1mom, you might want to post your question again as a separate thread just in case folks are looking here only if they are interested in apps.

    Last edited by polarbear; 01/22/14 12:42 PM.
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    Originally Posted by DeeDee
    OK, MON, I'll let you know. I think it's more flexible than just "set problems."

    I expect we're going to pony up for the math paper ($20!); less sure about the writing app ($30!).

    My ds has the Panther Math Paper app (and yes, it cost $20). It allows you to select numbers and math notation to write your own equations, and you can save them as pdf files, as well as (I think) copy formulas directly using the iPad double-tap copy option. I haven't looked into it further than that - my ds is in a bit of a holding pattern where he's ok using handwriting for math at the moment (previously he'd used Efofex on his laptop but he switched to handwriting when he first had to start using an iPad for word processing etc at school). I'm sitting in the background at the moment just trying to keep his options open for writing math on his iPad when/if he gets to the point where he realizes it would decrease his homework time and increase his legibility significantly smile

    We don't have Panther Writing Paper, and I'm very interested in looking into it smile

    polarbear

    ps - DeeDee, do you have anything specific you want to look at re the math paper? I can try it out on my iPad if you'd like.

    Last edited by polarbear; 01/22/14 12:54 PM.
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    TY polarbear...I put it in its own thread. I will definitely ask her about any writing pains in her hand or arm.

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