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    I find that my son doesn't achieve high on tests above level because he has been taught in so much as he takes what he knows and applies the next logical step. He of course couldn't do a calculus problem but given his limited algebra teaching he could get through some of the more basic problems (he is eight) and even a bunch of geometry just based on what he has been taught about angles he could use that knowledge for harder problems. He wasn't taught half of this nine week's science material because it was pre skip and we didn't think to tell him to go back and read those chapters and the teacher gave a 9 week cumulative test and he stil got a 90% second highest in the class. Not from anything we have after schooled or enriched. He just knows stuff. Or figures it out. And he doesn't read non fiction.

    So I understand that kids aren't going to know stuff they have not been exposed to in general...I think that each thing should be a piece of the puzzle...ind iq testing, achievement, that stupid group test (luckily our county doesn't use that), classroom observations (by someone who knows what they are looking at).


    ...reading is pleasure, not just something teachers make you do in school.~B. Cleary
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    In our school, they use a matrix that includes the following: achievement test score 95th percentile and above in one subject, teacher recommendation, behavioral checklist, that's it.

    My PG son didn't qualify for it in K. He thought the achievement test was boring and stopped taking it halfway through.


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    Right but my son if having been taught long division might get the digit answer and then look at it and figure out he needs to move the decimal because his answer couldn't possibly be right without ever being taught to move your decimal because he just gets math like that. Some people have to be taught to check long division with multiplication and he can just look at it and mentally check it in his head. Like if he had been taught to long divide 1000 by 5. And then got a problem to divide 1000 by .5. He would know 200 wasn't right just by his number sense and then use logic to add a zero. And then mentally check it by multiplying.

    Last edited by Sweetie; 11/16/13 08:27 AM. Reason: Typing on phone is hard

    ...reading is pleasure, not just something teachers make you do in school.~B. Cleary
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    Originally Posted by blackcat
    Just wondering about the entrance criteria for gifted programs in other districts/schools. Here they pretty much demand achievement math/reading test scores that are both above the 98th percentile AS WELL AS CogAT scores above 132.
    Assessing both aptitude and achievement for placement into a gifted program is common. The scores you share are often considered the minimum requirements. In general if a pupil is not this advanced, they are believed to not have demonstrated a need for other than the grade-level curriculum.

    Originally Posted by blackcat
    ... be taught above grade-level... extensively after-schooled... come from teachers who differentiate...?
    Unfortunately some may say this expresses a view of a child more as a passive recipient of knowledge presented to them, rather than the child as a passionate, driven, intensely interested, internally motivated, perpetual knowledge seeker... these are common characteristics of gifted children who may often feel a need to constantly learn something new, just as they feel a need to breathe... children who may feel suffocated in the gen-ed classroom. These children will tend to be challenge-seeking, achieving, asking, persisting, some may even say pestering, until they learn more in depth and breadth about whatever has their interest at the moment... then may often move on to a new intellectual pursuit, reading, experimenting, questioning, and learning along the way.

    The frustration which some parents have reported is that their child's self-directed learning may be outside the parameters which some achievement tests may tend to measure. In these instances, some families have had success with presentation of a portfolio of the child's leisure-time age-untypical academic-or-intellectual work-products and/or accomplishments reflective of the child's interests and passions (given any financial constraints which may tend to limit opportunities of a grander scale)*. It may often be helpful if the child has a hand in selecting what s/he is most pleased with and comfortable in sharing, and if the child also presents the portfolio while the parent assists only if the child specifically asks for a particular type of assistance.

    ETA: * (given any financial constraints which may tend to limit opportunities of a grander scale) Example: A child's construction of something from a household material, traditionally used for another purpose -as compared with- a child's construction of something from a commercially available toy building block. The second may have instant appeal and brand name recognition but it may be costly. The first may have more appeal when considered for a length of time, as the child first thought to re-purpose a common household item to utilize for building. Parents may wish to take photos of these spontaneous projects! smile

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    Ohio has very clear criteria for gifted identification:
    Chart of Approved Gifted Identification/Screening Instruments
    Identification of Students Who Are Gifted in Superior Cognitive Ability
    Identification of Gifted Students Using Above-Grade Level Testing
    Identification of Students Who Are Gifted in Creative Thinking Ability
    Identifying Students Who Are Gifted in the Visual and Performing Arts

    Districts choose which tests from these approved lists they will use for screening and identification, and they choose which students to screen. Parents can have their children participate in talent searches or have outside testing done for identification if the school didn't select their child for testing.

    This doesn't mean that the district will offer any kind of services or programming for gifted students. It also doesn't tell districts how to determine which gifted students receive services if gifted services are provided and there are more students identified than there are spots in the program.

    Having these criteria are helpful for parents to advocate for gifted identification and acceleration. I used my DD's EXPLORE results to begin the process that resulted in her subject-acceleration in math this year.

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    Our schools require MAP test scores above --% as part of the criteria for screening, and then ITBS scores above --% as part of the criteria for selection.

    Having higher scores does not appear to help at all at any point in the process. All of the children still need to take and meet the minimum criteria for all of the testing (and there is quite the list of tests in this process, including CogAT and a Wechsler-variety IQ test).

    Our schools differentiate in reading starting in 1st grade, and in math, starting in -- grade. How this is done is rather cloak and dagger - you usually will NOT find out from the teachers which group your child is in, but from other parents who know which teacher teaches which group of students.

    Afterschooling is also pretty common here.



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    I think what some people are saying is that gifted kids can make a little bit of knowledge go a long way, and they can show it on achievement tests.

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