Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy Is This A Red-Flag?

The other day our first grader son came home from school with a math worksheet to be completed and returned later. When I saw what was on it, I just felt my heart sink. An example of the content: Counting by twos (fill in the missing number). DS said it was preschool math.

Since he recently scored >99% on MAP testing in math for first grade, I assumed the teacher would not bother to send such sheets home for him any longer.

So, my husband and I had a meeting with her about his math level and the work he's to expect this year. We asked for him to be moved up into 2nd grade, to which she said he already was! (This is a non-graded, blended class charter school.) We didn't realize he had been bumped up, and certainly the worksheet didn't seem to reflect that. She said that it was 2nd grade math, though. So, I asked if DS could take an end-of-the-year math test for 2nd grade to see if he knows the material. I emphasized I didn't know what, if anything, he would show gaps in. She said they didn't have a single test that covered all the math that would be taught. I thought this was strange since another teacher there told DH and me during orientation that if an advanced child can pass a test at the end of their book, then they don't have to do that book and can move on. This teacher and DS' have both been working at the school long enough to know the procedure, so I'm frankly confused by the seeming discrepancy.

But here is why I asked about the "red-flag"...She proceeded to talk about how DS isn't able to keep himself from yelling out answers he knows, so he's not mature enough to work with the 3rd grade class. Oh-oh. Didn't I read someplace that teachers throw up the social aspect to quell a parent's enthusiasm for acceleration? I don't doubt that he's been speaking out-of-turn sometimes, so perhaps she's correct in keeping him in 2nd?

Then Teacher went on to say that she can give him work from the 2nd grade "challenge book". When I asked if that would be in place of what he's being given now or in addition to, she said in addition to. I told her that I didn't want DS to feel penalized with more work than the other kids. To which she didn't offer any solution.

I really want to know what to say from here. We have a formal PTC coming the end of this month.

If she doesn't want him to answer the questions, she should ask harder questions.

And yes that's a classic red-flag.

I should probably add that I brought in a stack of completed third grade worksheets from DS' private school Kindergarten. That teacher gave him those instead of the Kindergarten work because he was being disruptive (bored) during math time.

I let Teacher keep them to look them over since they showed six digit addition with regrouping, as the last thing he was doing in June. I know the second grade class isn't doing this yet. For that matter, is the third? They came back with DS later that day with a note saying thanks for sharing.

Going through the same thing. My 6 year old in first grade knows how to do double digit multiplication, division, fractions, etc. and is bringing home 5+2 math (at least it improved from the beginning of the year where it was 2+2--wow, they're moving right along!). At my request, the teacher gave him the second grade test and he passed it, so if he was to be subject accelerated, it should be 2 years. I would be happy with 1.

Subject acceleration won't work because of the "schedule" although I think it would if they really tried to figure it out. DS is supposedly doing an "enrichment packet"--but DS claims the math in the packet is the exact same math that everyone else is doing. Nothing is ever brought home so I have no idea what he's doing in school. Who knows what is really going on. I finally gave up and bought him a Singapore Math workbook at the third grade level, and he is doing a page or two every day after school. I tear it out and send it back in his folder, telling DS that his teacher assigned it to him (I told the teacher I was doing this--didn't ask, really--just informed her). My hope is that when he starts 2nd grade next year he can do a double skip for math. I plan to have him in a different school, maybe even in a different district. When I school-search, I will ask about this specifically.

DS informs everyone he doesn't learn anything in school, but he doesn't appear unhappy. If he was, I would probably be more pushy about accelerating him. Sorry I don't really have any advice. I think being as pushy I was, DS got a "packet" (maybe?)to do during independent work time, but that's as much as the teacher is going to do.

Can you ask to see the book/curriculum for the remainder of the year in 2nd grade math? Honestly, I think that counting by 2 in 2nd grade math is a huge red flag of a low-level curriculum for any children, not just high ability kids! But never mind that for now... I think that knowing what the remainder of the 2nd grade curriculum is would be helpful in knowing for sure whether or not your ds belongs in 3rd grade math, or whether or not this is just a temporary blip leading into a deeper concept (stretching here lol!) with the count-by-2 worksheet.

I also think that if your ds is blurting out of turn, then that's an issue you need to address with him, no matter what class level he's in. Is the yelling out answers something that is only happening during math (I think he has the same teacher - or is it a different teacher?)? I think I'd want to dig a bit deeper here, try to figure out what's behind the yelling out answers behavior and see if you can help your ds try to learn how to raise his hand and wait his turn. See if his teacher has any suggestions you can help with.

My suggestion re what you need (just in general) for the next PTC is showing that you're working to help your ds work toward not yelling out answers out of turn, and you need to have a good idea of what the 1st, 2nd and 3rd grade math curriculum is and where your ds falls within it.

Best wishes,

polarbear

^ yes, to all of what polarbear has stated above.

Of course

Special emphasis on this point from my perspective-- if the curriculum itself is moving THIS slowly/remedially, that is a red flag all of its own.

Such a school is not likely to be capable of providing (long-term) for the needs of an HG+ child who is years beyond even rigorous/good age-level curriculum.

In other words, if you're trying to bridge a 2 y gap with in-class differentiation, that's one thing... but what if it's 5y? 6y?

I think that you may need to see an overview of the scope and sequence here for the next two or three years in order to come up with even a short-range plan. It's going to take a lot of energy to make this work, I think-- best to know now whether this is a reasonable case of "fixer-upper" or if you're basically dealing with a completely draining, ongoing advocacy situation. That way you can make decisions accordingly.

Good luck.

I will ask to take home the second grade math book to look it over. Possibly the third grade, as well.

That worksheet was so upsetting to me it's taken a week for me to calm down enough to ask this question here. I was stunned by it's simplicity for a so-called second grade level.

Yes, if it's a matter of unchallenging math curriculum in general, then we are seriously in trouble here. The school says it meets each child at their level, but now I'm wondering. Not seeing it much yet.

Perhaps if this PTC doesn't produce an agreeable solution, we should ask for the principal to intervene? During the orientation I asked what happens to the eighth grader who needs high school level work. She said she teaches them. (She's a former high school math teacher.)

I'm not loving the prospect of this not being a viable solution for DS. It would absolutely mean homeschooling. Since he's an only child in a rural setting with limited contact with other kids, this would be brutal. Perhaps an online school's community would make up for that lack, but I'm not sure.

My admittedly very jaded opinion is that the teacher probably knows that your son is capable of doing harder work but she probably isn't going to do much to help him. I've been down this road many times and have heard all kinds of reasons about why [insert request] isn't possible.

She needs practice at x.

We're afraid of gaps in learning.

I was always taught to use my best students, so I get him to tutor the kids who struggle.

Everyone has to do stuff they don't like (fine for cleaning your room but not for a place where learning is supposed to be the entire point).

Our math program is outstanding. (Message: this discussion is over)

I assure you that Miss X is really an amazing teacher and she is doing what's best for your child.

"If" your child is really gifted, as you claim....

Etc.

When people aren't interested, they aren't interested. But (IMO,) they won't usually be honest about why they aren't interested. They'll tell you something that sounds good to them and will want you to play nice and let it go. I've tried many approaches, from excessive politeness and playing it their way to being a PITA. Nothing has changed anything, ever, unless the teacher or the school had an open mind long before I came along. In that scenario, the polite route always worked the first time, whether I was making the request or they were. No conferences, no meetings, no stress, no nothing past a simple polite and reasonable request.

I've accepted that for my kids, I have to teach them at home. End of story.

So my message to you is to hope for the best in your meeting, but prepare to be rejected. If they let your son move up, great. But have a plan for what you'll do if they don't. You may want to consider teaching the Common Core standards. I've linked to an example for fractions.

I'm blinking away tears, now. Perhaps this is still too raw to talk about.

(big breath)

The charter has had two evaluation reports, performed by our state university, over the last two school years. I got a copy a couple of days ago on the one performed for the 2012-2013 school year. It shows the kids in the charter perform 10% higher than the state average in math, and 20% higher than the school district. They receive a rating of: Exceeding for Comparative Student Achievement.

However, how many kids in that are advanced in math and skew the overall percentage? I don't know.

Recommendations by the evaluation team states a policy be developed that outlines a regular curriculum review process to ensure that they are aligned with the Common Core. I suppose this means they are still working on that change-over to Common Core. (That link you sent: DS was working with fractions in the summer before Kindy.)

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When we were sitting with his teacher, we shared a bit on what he was doing mathematically at four. She just put her hands to her cheeks and said that's amazing. Then she looked at DH and me and asked, "So which, or is it both of you...". (Asking which presumably was the math nerd.) We said neither, it must come from down the family tree.