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    #188745 - 04/18/14 04:32 AM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: doubtfulguest]
    madeinuk Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/18/13
    Posts: 1453
    Loc: NJ
    Originally Posted By: doubtfulguest
    ha - well, as an update, the vegetarianism is totally sticking - we really eat very little meat to begin with, but... DD5 totally rejected Butter Chicken last night, which is probably the biggest temptation she'd ever have. Aloo Gobi is officially the new favourite, it

    If it weren't for the cholesterol content of the ghee I could probably live very happily as an almost vegetarian on delights like sag aloo, dal Bukhara , bhindi masala, potato shaak and Chana masala.
    _________________________
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    #188748 - 04/18/14 05:18 AM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: doubtfulguest]
    Bostonian Offline
    Member

    Registered: 02/14/10
    Posts: 2634
    Loc: MA
    Vegetarians in Austria are less healthy according to a recent study

    http://www.plosone.org/article/fetchObject.action?uri=info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0088278&representation=PDF
    Nutrition and Health – The Association between Eating
    Behavior and Various Health Parameters: A Matched
    Sample Study
    by Nathalie T. Burkert et al.

    discussed at

    http://atlanta.cbslocal.com/2014/04/01/s...an-meat-eaters/
    Study: Vegetarians Less Healthy, Lower Quality Of Life Than Meat-Eaters
    CBS
    April 1, 2014 3:23 PM

    Quote:
    ATLANTA (CBS ATLANTA) – Vegetarians may have a lower BMI and drink alcohol sparingly, but vegetarian diets are tied to generally poorer health, poorer quality of life and a higher need for health care than their meat-eating counterparts.

    A new study from the Medical University of Graz in Austria finds that vegetarians are more physically active, drink less alcohol and smoke less tobacco than those who consume meat in their diets. Vegetarians also have a higher socioeconomic status and a lower body mass index. But the vegetarian diet — characterized by a low consumption of saturated fats and cholesterol that includes increased intake of fruits, vegetables and whole-grain products — carries elevated risks of cancer, allergies and mental health disorders.

    Vegetarians were twice as likely to have allergies, a 50 percent increase in heart attacks and a 50 percent increase in incidences of cancer.


    Consistent with this,

    http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/03/17/study-questions-fat-and-heart-disease-link/
    Study Questions Fat and Heart Disease Link
    By ANAHAD O'CONNOR
    New York Times
    MARCH 17, 2014, 5:00 PM

    Quote:
    Many of us have long been told that saturated fat, the type found in meat, butter and cheese, causes heart disease. But a large and exhaustive new analysis by a team of international scientists found no evidence that eating saturated fat increased heart attacks and other cardiac events.

    The new findings are part of a growing body of research that has challenged the accepted wisdom that saturated fat is inherently bad for you and will continue the debate about what foods are best to eat.

    For decades, health officials have urged the public to avoid saturated fat as much as possible, saying it should be replaced with the unsaturated fats in foods like nuts, fish, seeds and vegetable oils.

    But the new research, published on Monday in the journal Annals of Internal Medicine, did not find that people who ate higher levels of saturated fat had more heart disease than those who ate less. Nor did it find less disease in those eating higher amounts of unsaturated fat, including monounsaturated fat like olive oil or polyunsaturated fat like corn oil.


    Also consistent with the first paper, so-called overweight people according to the Body Mass Index do not have lower life expectancy:

    http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/04/14/a-number-that-may-not-add-up/
    A Number That May Not Add Up
    By JANE E. BRODY
    New York Times
    APRIL 14, 2014, 12:01 AM

    Quote:
    In July 1998, the National Institutes of Health changed what it means to be overweight, defining it as a body mass index of 25 or greater for adults. The cutoff had been 28 for men and 27 for women, so suddenly about 29 million Americans who had been considered normal became overweight even though they hadn’t gained an ounce.

    The change, based on a review of hundreds of studies that matched B.M.I. levels with health risks in large groups of people, brought the country in line with definitions used by the World Health Organization and other health agencies. But it also prompted many to question the real meaning of B.M.I. and to note its potential drawbacks: labeling some healthy people as overweight or obese who are not overly fat, and failing to distinguish between dangerous and innocuous distributions of body fat.

    More recent studies have indicated that many people with B.M.I. levels at the low end of normal are less healthy than those now considered overweight. And some people who are overly fat according to their B.M.I. are just as healthy as those considered to be of normal weight, as discussed in a new book, “The Obesity Paradox,” by Dr. Carl J. Lavie, a cardiologist in New Orleans, and Kristin Loberg.


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    #188751 - 04/18/14 05:34 AM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: doubtfulguest]
    ultramarina Offline
    Member

    Registered: 08/24/10
    Posts: 3428
    The thng about sat fat is that we are definitely still figuring that out. I see research every day contradicting itself. Also, nutrition self-reports are notoriously unreliable and noisy. Understandably so. (What did you eat for lunch last Tuesday?)

    Re the vegetarains are unhealthy study, you do have to keep in mind that it's sort of a maverick finding going against years of large studies showing the opposite...always a good idea to maintain skepticism about such findings. Also, important to keep in mind that some people become vegetarian BECAUSE they have health issues---and, I'd wager, vegetarians are more prone to thinking they have allergies ( a fuzzy diagnosis) than the general public.


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    #188767 - 04/18/14 07:34 AM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: ultramarina]
    indigo Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/27/13
    Posts: 4852
    Originally Posted By: ultramarina
    ... study...

    Interesting thought... causal or correlational?

    It was mentioned that vegetarians in the study drank less. This stood out as red wine (often paired with red meat) is said to contain the health benefits of anti-oxidants.

    Dr. Oz recently covered recent findings on sat fat http://www.doctoroz.com/slideshow/saturated-fat-guide, which seem to support madeinuk's thoughts about cholesterol.

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    #188773 - 04/18/14 09:08 AM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: doubtfulguest]
    ultramarina Offline
    Member

    Registered: 08/24/10
    Posts: 3428
    Except women who drink alcohol have higher risk of xyz, including stroke and breast cancer....

    You can drive yourself pretty crazy trying to parse nutrition studies.

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    #241152 - 02/03/18 06:34 AM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: doubtfulguest]
    LazyMum Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/09/15
    Posts: 120
    Today! Today DD4 (almost 5) decided she wasn't eating animals anymore. She's cool with eggs and dairy, but meat and fish are off the table (boom-tish). Why are there not more specific guidelines about this stuff? All the advice is very broad.

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    #241155 - 02/03/18 10:07 AM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: doubtfulguest]
    madeinuk Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/18/13
    Posts: 1453
    Loc: NJ
    Let's just say that two friends of mine (a married couple who are both physicians) are vegetarian (almost vegan) but refused to impose their lifestyle choices on their growing children because they strongly believed that a growing child needs meat/fish in their diet in addition to pulses, vegetables, dairy and fruit.

    Also, young kids are fussy eaters in general so it could just be rationalization...


    Edited by madeinuk (02/03/18 10:08 AM)
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    #241159 - 02/03/18 12:57 PM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: doubtfulguest]
    puffin Offline
    Member

    Registered: 12/11/12
    Posts: 2035
    Ds10 doesn't like most meats. I tell him he can stop eating them as soon as he starts eating beans, nuts, cheese and eggs. He is a very fussy eater. He did eat eggs until at 4 I finally got him to eat meat in the form of a sausage - he likes sausages now but not eggs.

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    #241166 - 02/04/18 09:18 AM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: doubtfulguest]
    LazyMum Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/09/15
    Posts: 120
    DD isn't fussy (though getting her to actually sit still, stop talking, and put food in her mouth is a challenge) so I'm not worried about that side of things. But I'll need to do a lot more research about what I'm supposed to feed her now.

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    #241179 - 02/05/18 10:19 AM Re: the age of vegetarianism [Re: doubtfulguest]
    Can2K Offline
    Member

    Registered: 06/25/14
    Posts: 226
    We are a vegetarian family (both parents and kids) - we do include some dairy (cheese, yogurt), mainly for the reason that my kids are very picky eaters. So I don't have the experience of suddenly having to cook different food for a child, but I will list some resources I found helpful when my kids were younger (and we had relatives questioning feeding choices).
    The good news, is that there are so many more meat-free options available now than there were when I became veg (after university). So you can probably find relatively close meat-free analogs to your child's favorite foods. Vegetarian burgers, veg. hot dogs, sliced 'meats', and so on - they get better all the time. And if your DD is not fussy - great! You have even more options! You might try going slowly and replacing meat one meal at a time, see what works, or doesn't...

    I found this book helpful: Raising Vegetarian Children by Joanne Stepaniak
    And if you pack lunches, some good ideas in here:
    https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/2220485.Vegan_Lunch_Box

    Some links:
    https://www.vegetariantimes.com/health-and-nutrition/raising-veg-kids
    https://www.eatrightontario.ca/en/Articl...-Vegetaria.aspx

    HTH!

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