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    PanzerAzelSaturn
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    You guys have all been so helpful smile I honestly feel much better and this is the closest I'm going to get to "real" answers until he is ready for grade school I would assume.

    I'm just going to list some of the things I have recorded from his development. I know no one here can really tell me what any of it means, but maybe you could let me know if it sounds like what your kids were like or if it seems just regular smart vs possibly gifted range vs autistic specialty skills?

    I did not go out of my way to teach him or anything, but like most normal parents I did talk to him and read to him a lot. The more he seemed to understand and remember, the more complex stuff I told him. I never did flash cards or made him sit and learn anything (even though no one believed me, lol) and he didn't and still does not watch any TV, at all. Also, I'm not going to do any physical milestones, he was mostly ahead to on time, but I don't really think that they matter all that much.

    At 5 months he said mama and also said something I never figured out (airblue?) and I swear he said I love you (Iyayoo), but it could have just been a favorite sound.

    By 8 months he said a few more words, basics like cat and dada and up. He loved to read books and was good at paging through his board books.

    By 10 months he really started talking adding words like penguin, dragon, and a bunch of normal baby words as well.

    By 12 months he had over 50 words and even used phrases such as "right there" when asked where something was. His vocab included lots of nouns, verbs, and adjectives. He knew 5 colors and 5 shapes and was pretty handy with his shape sorter. He knew his books by title and asked for them frequently. He was able to follow simple instructions such as bang on it, shake it, push it, get it, etc. He also spent an awful lot of time spinning wheels on his toy cars, something our pediatrician said was normal in 12 months olds, even those who screamed yeyyow tektengu!!!!! and boo quare!!!! at the top of their lungs whenever presented with the appropriate objects. Yeah, I was very worried.

    At 13 months he had over 150 words.

    At 16 months he had over 300 words.

    I stopped counting words when I got to 400 on the list a month later.

    At 18 months he had mostly replaced spinning wheels with lining things up, but he still loved to watch things spin and gear toys were a big favorite. He started drawing pictures (scribbles with dots and blobs on them) and calling the the ocean with fish or grass with trucks. He knew most of his letters and within 2 months he knew them all, upper and lowercase. He recognized numbers 1-10 and could count to 10 as well. He was very interested in opposites and loved to memorize and talk about them. He pretty much used an adjective of some sort before every noun, it was so cute. He was starting to memorize his books.

    At 20 months he was 1 to 1 counting up to 10. He started making simple things out of Playdoh, like poop and honeydew, lol. His favorite toy was Automoblox and he would sit and assemble and disassemble the things for over an hour at a time if undisturbed. He started doing 12 piece jigsaw puzzles. He knew big, medium, little, and above and below (something random I had written down). He used his bristle blocks to make a traffic light with red yellow and green squares on a rectangle block.

    At 21 months he could count well up to 20 and continue up to 100 with the 1-9 pattern. Used complex sentences with perfect grammer such as "I want to take a walk in the forest just like Harold and the Purple Crayon". He knew how to spell his name. His favorite books were the Sneetches and see how they go books and his favorte author was and still is Leo Lionni. He started to do simple math like 2 plus 2. He remembered everything, he had vocab including water intake valve and oxygen cylinders.

    At 22 months he knew his letter sounds and by 2 was sounding out words. By 2 he also did 24 piece puzzles and was working on 48 piece ones (at 3 he's actually only up to 60 though), knew all of the states and could do the wooden states puzzle, learned the states of matter and talked all about how you can't see a gas, knew tons of colors like khaki, navy, olive, tan, etc., learned to read 2 digit numbers, and sang the abc song quite well.

    At 2 I stopped keeping records of this stuff because we became more concerned about his social deficits and less excited about his learning. We put all of his puzzles and educational toys away for many months as part of his "therapy" and stopped teaching him things that 2 year olds "should not know". We are just now deciding to ignore all of that and appreciate him for who he is and nurture his natural talents. I wish I had never listened to them. In his workbooks I got him he flew through everything in pre-k and k level and I just got him a grade 1 book, so we will see how he does at that. He loves to do patterns and is great at anything visual and at things like spacial rotation. He reads as well upside down as right side up for instance. His biggest weakness I can see is math, I really don't think he is ahead in it, he is great at counting, but at adding and subtracting he is still stuck on small numbers and generally has little interest in it.

    OK, hopefully that is enough info to get an idea whether he might be gifted or not. If anyone actually got through all of that... what do you think? Sorry about the huge post, but I have no other resources for this and no one involved in his treatment seems to have any interest in anything other than his autism. Whenever he says or does something impressive to them like naming a color they praise him for it and it really makes me realize how far off they are in their opinions of him.

    Anyway, thanks again everyone, you have been a great help. I really am happy I found this forum smile

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    I'm new to this forum and have held my tongue on this topic. But I have to say that it sounds like you've been caught up in the Autism Dragnet.

    Your child sounds intelligent, and not autistic at all. Don't believe any such diagnosis and don't follow their advice, and don't go anywhere near their "therapies".



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    Hi Pantzer smile

    I like your plan for now!!

    My DS6 has very high functioning Autism. Met all his milestones early, then regressed. Continues to be advanced, especially academically, but has some Pragmatic Speech issues. They aren't severe enough to draw attention, mostly in "self advocacy" are where he shows the most deficit- from dealing with a bully, to speaking up for himself with a teacher etc...

    I know that some parents choose the special ed preschool programs, and I know kiddo's who've thrived in them, and it was most definitely a good choice for them their parents feel. You have to take into account where your child is at developmentally, what he will get out of it, both positives and negatives, and go from there. What is right for child, isn't (maybe) appropriate at all for another. Such an individual decision.

    Navigating the Schools is a learning process for sure! It took awhile but I realized that I had right to refuse a placement, and I did refuse- the kids were at a much lower level than my child, and it would be more harmful than helpful for DS to attend- the teacher agreed- DS himself asked what was wrong with all the kids- So the district still gave him his needed ST, and even a Social Skills group- funny sidenote--- this group consisted of 4-5 Spanish speaking NeuroTypical (NTs) 5-6yo kids(DS was 3)- who were learning English LOL, Parents req'd to attend and be "taught" how to encourage their kids to speak more. I was not thrilled with it, but did see it as a way for him to also learn some social diversity, and the kids seemed to be his academic peers.

    During this time he was also in an outside ST & OT program.

    He belonged to a playgroup, all neurotypical kids, so he was developing his social skills with NTs! For me, this was of key importantance!!! How can he learn social skills if the kids are nonverbal, hitting, acting out, developmentally delayed? (DS has never had any behavioral issues)

    I believed strongly DS needed NT peers to model after. I believe all kids do. It sounds to me, like what you have planned works all those areas, even down to the playgroup! Love it!

    DS also played teeball 2x/yr. I also took to as many community events etc as possible etc

    ** Moving on, regarding the IQ? I would actually call for an IEP addendum. Have them correct the language of "iq" incl add how they came to that score. Also

    Finally, YES, there is an IQ test your kiddo can do smile
    It was administered to my DS shortly before 3rd bday when he rec'd DX, it is the WPPSI-III. They just do 4subtests. I was advised that DS score would go up significantly after he became more verbal etc though this test is not as dependent on verbal skills, so not sure how accurate that is, but basically, my DS was NOT cooperative at all and still scored well. She encouraged me to retest in 1year. I wasn't ever worried about his intelligience, and only until recently has it become an issue.
    (regular public school kinder didn't work out, he was way too far ahead by 5 1/2yrs.

    Oh- one note re ABA- I do not feel traditional ABA is right for every child. I believe it does have its place and is useful for many, so I am not "against" it- I think again- as parents, we have to be informed and make decisions based on our own individual child- not just b/c they have a certain Dx.
    I am a strong supporter for a child like DS, of "play based therapy" approach model, and turns out that is sort of how I was "working" with DS- w/o even knowing it...

    Sounds to me, that is what you are doing as well smile
    Hugs to you

    Last edited by cc6; 03/26/13 10:08 PM. Reason: typos

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    I have no big advice except to say that Apsie kids can appear very smart because they often have advanced language skills and some have hyperlexia but some are just very very gifted too!

    I think you won't be able to tell until you've done an IQ assessment but it sound like you are well informed and it's quite likely your hunch is right.

    I feel angry to hear of people putting it down to splinter skills.

    We had that too....splinter skills, hyperlexia, autistic savant blah blah blah....

    I have no doubt that my son has Aspergers...just as I has no doubt that he is gifted.

    He tested above 99.9 percentile, gifted evenly across the board (not a splinter in sight;)). So don't let the naysayers put his amazing gifts down.

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    *kids with hyperlexia present with no real comprehension of what they are reading, pretty much at all.
    and I just read something about it- the kids with hyperlexia present with near same s/sx as kids on spectrum! thereby allowing for possible misdiagnosis.

    gifted kids can also present with s/sx of autism- incl language delay, fine motor, social deficits. again setting up for a possibly misdiagnosis.
    (when I mention Autism- I include aspergers in that also, it is all the spectrum...I know there are slt differences between Aut and Asp


    One can never consent to creep when
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    Originally Posted by PanzerAzelSaturn
    At 18 months he had mostly replaced spinning wheels with lining things up, but he still loved to watch things spin and gear toys were a big favorite. ...
    At 2 I stopped keeping records of this stuff because we became more concerned about his social deficits and less excited about his learning. We put all of his puzzles and educational toys away for many months as part of his "therapy" and stopped teaching him things that 2 year olds "should not know". We are just now deciding to ignore all of that and appreciate him for who he is and nurture his natural talents. I wish I had never listened to them.

    The spinning is (as you know) a classic sign of autism. My DS used to love spinning pot lids on the kitchen floor.

    Re: the academic interests: I see no reason to suppress them, but I do see a real reason to actively teach play skills. This is pretty crucial for kindergarten. You might look at "Floortime" (Stanley Greenspan's books)-- they suggest using what the child is interested in to bridge over to new skills. We used to do pretend play about the planets, and then space travel, when DS wasn't interested in pretend play about people. Use the interests to foster real dialogue skills (not monologuing, but two-way conversational exchange). This both helps your DS stay happy and increases his skills.

    I wouldn't spend any time on "math facts" or other skills of that kind at this age-- but spend time building the skills he will need to interact with other kids and with teachers.

    DeeDee

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