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    #151578 03/21/13 06:37 AM
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    Highly-intelligent DS9 has been diagnosed with anxiety. I’ve posted previously on him in general, so I’ll try not to repeat too much here.

    Unfortunately, he lets his anxieties rule his life, and actively (and aggressively) avoids any situation that he even thinks might cause him stress. He is completely irrational about his fears and will not listen to reason or take suggestions.

    For instance, he is currently refusing to go on vacation with us because it requires a 3-hour car ride. He thinks that he will get sick in the car. He is also nervous about going to a new place, being able to find food there that he likes, etc. We have shown him pictures of all the fun things to do at our destination, such as an indoor waterpark, a zoo and a really cool-looking children’s museum. He seemed very interested in all of them. But he broke down and cried at the thought of going, and told us there was no way we could make him go, and that he would never leave the house.

    This problem has been going on in one form or another for over a year.

    I’ve read numerous books on how to manage children’s anxieties. However, all of these books so far seem to implicitly assume that the kid wants to discuss and overcome his fears. Not so with DS9. He is an avoider and will either shut down or melt down at any suggestion of talking about or doing something about these anxieties.

    Any advice on how to get through to a kid like this?

    My wife and I have already booked the trip and we firmly believe that letting him force us not to go would be a bad choice. On the other hand, we don’t think that physically tossing him in the car would be a productive solution either smile

    Thoughts?

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    We have been there.

    Our process most looks like "deliberate sabotage," where we have systematically put little, then big challenges into the mix so that DS learns that he can manage them. This can be as small as buying a different brand of bread, or "running out" of his favorite snack. Even if some of these challenges result in meltdowns, afterward we have debriefed and he is able to agree that yes, he's still alive even though he didn't get X, not getting X did not result in serious harm, and he lived to tell the tale. In the short term this is extremely exhausting, but over time it does yield more resilience.

    You can also have HIM address his list of concerns. Look at restaurants nearby and make a food plan; or plan what he feels he would like to have with him. If he is prone to car-sickness, let him make a plan for dealing with that. Having a plan for the things you're afraid of can make a big thing feel less like an emergency, and more like a situation to be managed. If he won't talk it through, you may have to demo this process by making that list yourself within his earshot the first few times, but then gradually work up to having him do his own troubleshooting. Having an action plan can be very calming.

    Our DS also found it helpful to study statistics and learn to distinguish between likely and unlikely scenarios. Your DS's concerns sound more focused on personal safety than on weather/natural disasters, so the action plan is probably the first line to take.

    I definitely wouldn't cave to anxiety by cancelling the trip.

    I hope it all goes well,
    DeeDee

    p.s. Do you have professional help for treating the anxiety more generally? An SSRI can make a world of difference, allowing a child to access behavioral treatments for anxiety...

    Last edited by DeeDee; 03/21/13 06:50 AM.
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    DeeDee,

    Thanks.

    We have been taking the approach you suggest with gradual de-sensitization. The problem is for this instance, we do not take long trips that often (2-3 times per year). So regular driving around town, in his mind, is different from a "trip".

    Nonetheless, I plan to get him in the car for a 45-minute or so drive this weekend. Hopefully without having to deal with tears.

    As for his list of concerns, I think we know what they are, but like I said, he's an avoider. He'll just curl up and refuse to talk when we ask him to explain why he's getting upset.

    And, he is a math whiz - loves it. I tried the statistics approach with him last night and managed to get him to admit that the probability of getting sick on a trip is less than 100%, but he settled around 50% rather than the 2% I suggested.

    These are all great ideas and are in line with the approach we're planning to take. Thanks so much for the concrete suggestions!

    And yes, we have a therapist. Currently we told DS that the therapist is a specialist who helps smart kids like him get what they need out of school, but we are going to back-door this into anxiety and self-esteem therapy as well.

    Last edited by BSM; 03/21/13 07:00 AM.
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    I am probably terribly wrong in my approach, but I treat DS's anxieties as if they were possible/realistic/etc and ask, well, what do we do about that? Car sickness - okay, let's pack some sick bags, and some anti-nausea gum and is there anything else you want? A change of clothes? Let's be prepared!

    I try and treat his anxieties as simply obstacles to overcome. Honestly, most of the stuff he's anxious about IS possible, though not always likely, so we discuss what would happen if his fears came true. What if that rope broke and I fell when I was climbing? Well, there's a padded mat, and if I fell funny, they'd call the awesome paramedics and they'd take me to the ER and fix me right up! You know your friend so-and-so who broke an arm, right? He wasn't rolling around crying at school was he? Nope, he was fine because doctors are awesome!

    That sort of thing. It's worked pretty well so far. I do tend to have to "shiny" things up (ie, paramedics came come super fast and doctors can always fix things, etc) and we'll probably have to alter this later, but for now I focus on getting through each day!


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    Originally Posted by epoh
    I do tend to have to "shiny" things up (ie, paramedics came come super fast and doctors can always fix things, etc) and we'll probably have to alter this later, but for now I focus on getting through each day!

    Probably depends on the kid; we go the other way and look hard at the worst-case scenario and how likely that is and how we'd respond. DS is not a pessimist, but his anxiety tends to go toward worst-case, and he WILL NOT BELIEVE us if we give him a rosier picture. If we go there with him, though, and say, OK, if the house was engulfed in fire, you'd go out that way and meet us at the neighbor's, he actually feels better. Weird, but works for us.

    DeeDee

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    We tend to go that route, too. As bizarre as that sounds.





    Schrödinger's cat walks into a bar. And doesn't.
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    We don't have the diagnosis, but DD9 has has missed five days of school lately due to anxiety. She also is refusing to eat a lot of food, imagining it has e coli on it, etc.

    Since 2nd grade she has taken things she overhears from adults and turned them into huge worry monsters. She has some gift of eavesdropping. The problem is she won't always tell us what she's thinking, so we rarely know what's bothering her.

    Apparently in 2nd grade she heard that pitch/sap on some trees can catch fire, so she'd spend entire recesses alone waiting for the trees to catch fire.

    This e-coli thing got so out of hand that she refused to eat a potroast she cooked for Girl Scouts, despite it being well-done and despite my most rigorous assurances.

    We've long shielded her from ugly facts because of her tendency to explode them into fear monsters and then not tell us. I wonder if maybe the opposite approach might be better, like finding a good website that fully discusses e coli, or even having her ask her pediatrician about it. Or would that backfire with her mind picking up on more ways things could hurt her?

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    Hmmm-- well I might try it with something that truly IS very farfetched and also includes a significant locus of control in terms of avoidance of poor outcomes.

    Like the tree/pitch thing-- assuming that you don't live in a coniferous treehouse. wink

    I wouldn't do this with a food pathogen worry. That one only gets scarier the deeper you look. Scares ME plenty to think about that one.

    Maybe something where the consequences are less ominous? Head lice? LOL. (Another personal phobia of mine.)





    Schrödinger's cat walks into a bar. And doesn't.
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    Okay so disclaimer: I am pretty mainstream but I am also open-minded. I pretty much will try supplements or whatever - but I am not against science and medicine at all or anything like that. I realize that supplements, etc can be 'snake oil' but I guess I think some may be helpful and I am willing to try.

    My kid is anxious and has an anxiety diagnosis... In February I started giving him this herbal supplement http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhodiola_rosea because he seemd irritable and I was researching around about herbs and such to help. I saw an immediate difference. I didn't tell my mom or DS's teachers or my husband that I was giving it to him and, I kid you not, they ALL commented on how much better DS seemed - less irritable and angry within a day of his starting the herb. One day he was annoyed and stressed and anxious and I thought of maybe those herbs really aren't doing anything after all it was just a placebo effect. Then I found the pill on the table next to his water. He put it aside and hadn't taken it (Btw, he thinks its just a kid vitamin). If you try it you have to get the kind that comes from Russia (the kind from China does nothing) I get "New Chapter Rhodiolaforce" - it's harvested (supposedly) in Russia and is also allegedly organic. I give him 100mgs in the morning a half an hour before breakfast and 100 mgs when I pick him up from school at 3pm. My DS gets fatigued due to his hypotonia issues and such, so maybe it's just that it is helping with rather than his anxiety - I don't know. I just know whatever it si doing it is working. Just a thought for you. I have tried other things (herbs and supplements) and wasted money (one made him hyper for two days - it was carintine supplement that I gave him for fatigue and low muscle tone). This is the only suppkement I have tried thus far and REALLY saw positive significant improvement and the first one where others who were unaware I was giving him something were like "what is up with DS I=he seems so much less upset and anxious and miserable." It works so well I am taking it now...

    Last edited by marytheres; 03/21/13 10:19 AM.
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    Originally Posted by epoh
    I am probably terribly wrong in my approach, but I treat DS's anxieties as if they were possible/realistic/etc and ask, well, what do we do about that? Car sickness - okay, let's pack some sick bags, and some anti-nausea gum and is there anything else you want? A change of clothes? Let's be prepared!

    This is pretty much what I would have recommended. I think it's very useful to begin instructing a kid like this on risk management. Okay, here's a risk... how likely is this? What can we do to prepare? What can we do to respond?

    For example, if the kid is worried about being carsick... has he ever been carsick before? That'll tell you how likely it is. Then you can start on your preparations, like what epoh says here. And then your response... what kind of signal should we have that you're about to be sick so we can pull over? After it happens, stop at a truck stop for a shower? Where are those along the way?

    And then, of course, after it's over and nothing happened (assuming he's never been carsick before), say, "I told you so."

    For the kid with the E-coli anxiety, I'd give them a blacklight, and explain how ultraviolet rays kill microbes like E-coli. Just shine the light on your food before you eat it, and you should be good to go. I'd also take the time to explain how the cooking process eliminates this as a problem. Then, a couple hours after eating the same food with no UV, I'd say, "Look, I'm fine. Told ya."

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