Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy Should we apply?

My ds is 7 and has been recently tested by his school. They were looking for learning disabilies, but only found a fine motor delay. In looking at his scores and the requirements for DYS, I realized he meets the minimum requirements. But he just meets them.
- They say he has to score 145+ on Verbal Comprehension, Perceptual Reasoning or Full Scale, and he does but only on Perceptual Reasoning (145).
- They say he has to score 145+ on Broad Reading, Broad Math, Broad Written Language or Total Achievement, and he does but only on Broad Math (145).

If we applied, are they likely to just let him in or will they ask for more? I'm sure the only way to really know is to apply, but what do you think? Thanks.

You have nothing to lose! Applying is free. We applied with barely there scores and they have asked us for portfolio items (which I haven't gotten around to sending yet.)

I say, "Go for it!"

I would apply and see what they have to say. You may consider including a few samples of his work as well.

I am glad you got the right numbers. I think it must be quite difficult to end up with 144 and wonder if on a better day he might have just made it.

I agree. The worst they can say is, "no," and chances are more likely that they'll either say "yes" or "we need more info."

All you lose by trying is the time it takes to fill out the application. (Not that that's nothing! It's one honking big form!)

A word of advice that helped me as we went through the process: remember as you fill out the form that your stories should demonstrate not only that your child is GT, but that he is HG+ and not "merely" MG. Try to choose those stories which illustrate that your child is operating 3+ years above grade level.

And best wishes to your application!

Give it a try - the part where you ask for letters of reccomendation has made a big difference in people's lives even when they didn't get in.

Is there any particular service YSP offers that you think would be useful?

Grinity

We got the WISC and WJ scores on Monday, so I need to let the dust settle first. I have at least one more battle to fight before I can even think about DYS. I came across the criteria when I was looking for some info about his scores. I'm trying to get ds a 504, and I hope that will be settled this coming week.

I was poking around the Internet some more, and I saw that DYS is for "Profoundly Gifted" children. If my ds meets the criteria, does that make him PG? Based on Ruf's levels, I'd put him around a 4. I don't remember all the details of when he did various things.

I don't even like to use the word "gifted" out loud, but it keeps coming up. I had never used it with ds, but it's hard to keep him in the dark when it's in his school's name.

I think you should definitely apply. You have nothing to lose except the time it takes to fill out the application and the stamp.

Tell us more about your son. It sounds like you were surprised with his scores. Is his school meeting his needs?

ETA: I just read more about your son on the other forum. Hopefully the school meeting with an OT present will help you meet his needs.

I'm not really surprised at his scores, just surprised that they're high enough for DYS. Maybe I'm saying I'm surprised DYS has such low standards? No, that's not right either.

I can see that he's smart, but there's so much that's asynchronous. I guess I just thought the weaknesses canceled out some of the intelligence.

Ahem...Denial, denial, denial!

I'm just sayin'...

That's exactly where I am. I use HG+ easily, I got to EG. I too have no problems with 99.9%, but I just cannot use PG. I am getting to HG for my younger one, that's quite a big step for me.

Hi Keet!
Unfortunatly the lows don't cancel out the highs - and the fact that his fly isn't zipped doesn't meant he's not PG - honest. In fact that's been a huge benifit of getting together with other kids in the YSP program. Our kids are kids, afterall.

There are a few folks who would actually look at the YSP kids, and think, 'what's the big deal' - as there are levels of gifted beyond YSP, such as the SET program. Since there are no official rules to 'what is gifted' and 'what are the levels of gifted' it's really hard to say, and 99.9 is just a test result, so a lot easier to say than an verbal interpretation of the score.

Some families do join YSP and still feel like they can't be open about what their kids are doing because it is so far beyond what the other kids are doing. Some people will come across this forum and remain silent for the same reason. (Hint, Hint, you lurker there!)

Another part of this question is that what many schools want and what HG/PG kids are is sort of at odds, at times. I've heard the 'we have plenty of kids just like yours' many times from our public school. Since I've confirmed that this isn't true in my location, it's sort of like the tree that fell in the forest withone a person to hear it.

As parents, I'm pretty sure that if we got to choose between having the 'happiest' kid, the most 'socially successful' kid, the most 'polite and flexible' kid and the kid who scores highest on IQ tests and wears us out with questions and has to spend large amounts of time in school waiting for something interesting to happen, we'd have chosen a slightly different kid than what we've gotten.

Not that we want to change the ones we have, just that for some of us there is a lack of resource to help us grow our kids into the kindest, calmest, hard-workingest kid that they can be. It's our job as parents to develop character, and in many places the raw materials to help us do that job just don't exist. I know that adversity is supposed to help develop character, but the adversity of sitting in a classroom way below one's readiness level just doesn't seem likely.

Anyway - I've heard Bob Davidson say that they are targeting kids who's IQ scores are 'too high to measure' on Modern IQ tests. I guess I buy the argument that as long as the Modern IQ tests have such low standards, then the YSP program scores make sense. I'm much more worried about 2E kids who can work years above grade level as homeschoolers but can't come up with test scores because of their challenges, than I am about kids who test 'as high' as Modern IQ tests can measure, but perhaps have scores that aren't being artificially held down.

Just some thoughts -
Grinity

I think we all have this idea of the "PG prodigy," and it looks like the kids on Oprah who start their own nonprofit agency to save the lives of starving kids in Africa or go to grad school at 12 or whatever...not like our own bright--but mostly kid-like--kids.

But as Grinity so aptly wrote, "the lows don't cancel out the highs."

I'm the queen of GT denial (well, maybe the lady-in-waiting, behind Dottie! ), but I really do think it pays to accept that 145 on more than one test is pretty doggone high. Is it repeatable? Maybe not, and that means it's not quite as reliable a score, and maybe the child isn't quite as far into the tail of the Bell Curve. It is one score on one day. <shrug> But I really do think that kids who score that high are pretty doggone unusual.

I really hope that the parents of kids who are doing way more advanced things than my DS/our kids feel free to share here, too. If not here, then where? I think at least here they're likely to be met with understanding, if not total identification.

Heaven knows, I like to hear about kids ahead of my son. It reminds me how much harder I could have it!