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    #13336 - 04/08/08 04:45 PM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: Dottie]
    Kriston Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/19/07
    Posts: 6145
    Loc: Midwest
    And BTW, if you expose your average ND (normal devlopment) pre-K to 2nd grade child to physics and math, they will not pick up on most of it. So if you expose a child to it and they get it, it's GTness.

    GTness is not about *what* a child knows, its about *how* they learn: and in general terms that's quickly, with a greater depth of understanding, with less repetition of concepts, and with greater joy than an ND child. If your child is a learning machine and you can't keep up with his drive to learn, or if he's obsessed with a topic to the point that he probably knows more than some (adult) experts in the field, it's GTness.

    Denial ain't just a river in Egypt, Dazed! wink
    _________________________
    Kriston

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    #13346 - 04/08/08 05:26 PM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: Kriston]
    incogneato Offline
    Member

    Registered: 10/25/07
    Posts: 2231
    Loc: up in my head.......
    Yeah, Dazed, I would never think that a child isn't HG unless they had a certain across the board FSIQ. I just don't think that's realistic.
    It's funny, cause I stink at math calculation, but I'm exceptionally competent in a few other areas. I have an engineer friend and I think she's the smart one. She looks at some other things that I can do more easily and suddenly, no I'm the smart one in her view.
    It's so easy to look at what we aren't exceptional at and think, we'll I'm not so great. But I think we really outta change the lens with which we view some of those things.
    The simple fact is VCI or 148 is remarkable and exceptional. You have permission to be assertive to have your son's learning needs met at his strengths, not shortchanged on the whole kit and caboodle because a person might like to point out a lower score on one test.

    Not too harsh I hope?

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    #13349 - 04/08/08 05:38 PM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: incogneato]
    Kriston Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/19/07
    Posts: 6145
    Loc: Midwest
    I don't think that's harsh, 'Neato. Sounds like tough love! :p
    _________________________
    Kriston

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    #13351 - 04/08/08 05:43 PM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: Kriston]
    Kriston Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/19/07
    Posts: 6145
    Loc: Midwest
    Oh, one clarification, I wrote:

    Originally Posted By: Kriston
    So if you expose a child to it and they get it, it's GTness.


    I should add the caveat that if you hothouse children, you can teach them things they wouldn't otherwise learn. But I assume that's not what you mean, and it's certainly not what I mean, by the word "expose." I assume we both mean that you talk about stuff that interests you as it comes up, and follow up when your child loves it. Child driven learning, not pushy parenting.

    Just wanted to be clear! smile
    _________________________
    Kriston

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    #13352 - 04/08/08 05:47 PM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: Kriston]
    Dazed&Confuzed Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/05/08
    Posts: 1815
    Originally Posted By: Kriston

    Denial ain't just a river in Egypt, Dazed! wink
    laugh I love it!!!!

    Yes, Dottie has been trying to convince me of all this. smile

    I checked out the book for gifted kids to read about being gifted...he did the checklist and checked 8/10 items. I had such a hard time giving him that book. I'm not sure why b/c I have several friends with gifted kids. Perhaps it's the realization that he's not your average kid and school is just not working out for him. Our only other option is HSing as the private schools are very expensive and i'm not sure they are any better and would involve 2hrs in the car each day. But I have a 15mth old and a rising Ker and a DH who works very long hours .... but it's definitely on the front burner at this point.

    Thank you everyone for your support! It means a great deal. You've made me feel welcome in a very short period of time.


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    #13357 - 04/08/08 06:07 PM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: Dazed&Confuzed]
    Kriston Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/19/07
    Posts: 6145
    Loc: Midwest
    Welcome to the second stage of GT denial: grieving for the education that you dreamed of that was not to be.

    You thought your child was bright and curious, but still within normal parameters, so you figured he'd be a great success within the system, right?

    Finding out that's not the way things are and that you've got a tough row to hoe to get an education for this child, an education that will teach him the values that matter to you--things like feelings of self-worth without excessive pride, the importance of persistance and teamwork, and loads of things that have nothing to do with academics--plus the academics, is a real shock.

    Grieve for it. It's the loss of the reality you were expecting, and that's going to be at least a little hard. But get over it as fast as you can. Until you get over the grief, it's hard to start taking action to make the situation better, and that's the only way to help your child. Ultimately, you have to get out of your own head and into making changes.

    And congrats! You got to step 2 WAY faster than I did. smile Nice work!
    _________________________
    Kriston

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    #13369 - 04/08/08 06:57 PM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: Kriston]
    Dazed&Confuzed Offline
    Member

    Registered: 04/05/08
    Posts: 1815
    Incogneato: nope not too harsh! smile

    Kriston - total child-led learning. I can't force anything on my stubborn kid if I wanted to. If he's not interested, it ain't happening.

    To give an example. DH thought I was setting the TIVO to record WWII documentaries. I thought he was doing it. DS, then 6yrs old, was waking up early, scanning the TIVO guide and setting up shows on History channel and military channel and setting them to record. He decided he wanted to learn about history. ONe day he sat down and read the Usborne History Encyclopedia from the end all the way to Roman times. He came up with this joke. "when does a tortoise have more than 4 legs? WHen it's a Roman tortoise."

    He watches NOVA Science Now, any NOVA show, loves anything about Einstein, Big Bang theory, neutrinos, Ancient History ... I don't think you can hot-science a love of those topics in a 5yr+ old.

    For his science fair project this year, I thought he'd do something fairly typical, mainly a demonstration. Nope. He came up with the question "Does hot water cool down at the same rate as cold water heats up." he used our temp sensors with our LEGO MINDSTORMS NXT brick and wrote the program to monitor the temp and did the experiment. Now, he's only 7 so we did help him export the data to Excel and graph but he drew his own conclusions from the graph. DH did alter the graph to include only the temps they had in common which altered the conclusion and showed that his hypothesis was correct. My FIL (also a Ph.D. in chem eng) explained it to DS in engineering terms and I was shocked that the next day, the next week even, DS could explain. He could also extend it by drawing graphs to show what it would look like at different temps and why. I guess it's those types of things I see with him that make me go WOW rather than an IQ test. Sadly though, he doesn't get this level of creative thinking at school nor do we have time to do it at home. tonight he took 2hrs to do homework which should have taken him 20min. SIGH......

    He wants to do a K'nex club which will be run by parents and engineers/scientists in the area. He'll be the youngest I think but it'll be great for him to be around older kids that share his passion for science/engineering. He'll have to do much better on his homework though to continue....

    anyhow I'm having a brain dump....sorry.....

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    #13380 - 04/09/08 06:09 AM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: Dazed&Confuzed]
    squirt Offline
    Member

    Registered: 03/31/08
    Posts: 323
    Loc: Back in Texas, alas!
    [/quote] OK, are we sharing the same kid? Except mine is 7yrs old in 2nd grade. I'm trying to decide the same thing. I don't know why it's so hard to trust my instincts on this one - I guess I fear being one of those parents who thinks her child is so smart etc...what if it's just poor behavior due to poor parenting? Not talking about you Squirt, referring to myself.

    I figure my big test will be this summer....if the spark and love of learning returns, I'll know it was school. At that point I'll decide about HSing. [/quote]

    I also continually worry that is is poor parenting. Maybe we do have the same kids. Nice to know, though, that someone else is going through the same thing. Sometimes I wonder if he's just a spoiled brat, especially since he is an only child. Then, I remember how well behaved he is at other people's houses and get confused. I'm always hearing things like "he's such a little gentleman", "he's so well behaved", "he's so polite and cooperative". Wait, are they getting the same kid I send over to them? I know kids are always better behaved for others than for parents, but still, it makes me wonder.

    Mine loves history and science. He wouldn't enter the science fair, though, because he would have had to write a report and conclusions. His question "do all thicknesses of paper and plastic bags make the same kind of noise when popped". He wanted to build a robot to do the bag-popping for him. But, after I told him he had to write a report, he completely refused to even talk about it. We don't get the history channel but I sometimes wish we did. Not that he has any time to watch it - like you said, there's just no time after school and other activities to get to things. Wish the school would be more flexible about tardies and absences if I documented for them that we were actually learning at home. Then, I could take him out a couple of mornings a week and do stuff that interests him. I know, homeschoolers, I know! I have a friend who homeschools and loves it. My husband is completely opposed to me doing it. I seem always to get on here and ramble.


    Edited by squirt (04/09/08 06:17 AM)
    Edit Reason: added more (always more)

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    #13381 - 04/09/08 06:13 AM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: Dazed&Confuzed]
    Kriston Offline
    Member

    Registered: 09/19/07
    Posts: 6145
    Loc: Midwest
    DS6 spends MUCH longer on "boring" work that's too easy for him than he spends on challenging work. That's not unusual at all for HG+ kids. It's a way of going on strike for work that is suited to them. If I may add my $.02, I'm not sure I'd keep your DS out of something like K'nex club over homework, though I realize that position may be controversial. Maybe make him late for it if homework isn't done, but the club could be the sort of thing that keeps him engaged. It may be something he really needs, and it might even spur an improved attitude toward the homework.

    Just to clarify, I didn't think you were hothousing your child. smile My caveat was philosophical really, in that I made a blanket statement I needed to qualify for clarity, but it certainly wasn't directed at you. If it led to a helpful brain dump for you, though, then I'm glad I added the caveat! laugh

    BTW, we need to get our kids together. Your DS's favorite topics are some of the same ones that my DS enjoys learning about. grin
    _________________________
    Kriston

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    #13408 - 04/09/08 10:41 AM Re: What IS the goal?? [Re: Kriston]
    newtothis Offline
    Junior Member

    Registered: 08/28/07
    Posts: 34
    I am loving all of these stories! What a great group this continues to be!

    alle31...our experiences with Montessori sound IDENTICAL. In fact, "unwind" is also the word I use to describe what ours did when we finally got him out of there.

    It's bad that so many are struggling with the same questions (because I know how incredibly stressful they are to consider!) but it's so refreshing to know we aren't alone - and it's nice not to feel totally alone in the journey!

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