Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy Making Games In Math? Is this learning?

ummm...not getting how to do it.....maybe she will get it better. lol but this is just her kinda thing...thanx so much!

Well, first of all I think the lack of a pullout is a big problem. Basically, then, the GT enrichment is being given by teachers who are NOT trained in teaching GT kids. It sounds to me like that is one of the biggest problems in your situation. Perhaps the teacher was given these projects and told to give them as enrichment but she really doesn't understand the purpose and goal of them the way a trained GT teacher ought to.

And I would have been insulted by the VP's comments as well. Being "balanced" isn't about being told you can't do activities you are interested in. It is about exposing someone to lots of things and nurturing diverse interests in them. It should make you happy, not miserable. (And that sidesteps the whole issue of whether everyone needs to be "balanced" anyways!)

If it were me, I would probably go to battle over letting her work on the projects at home if she wants to. I don't understand what the big problem with that is? Maybe compliment them on giving her projects that she is so enthusiastic about and that offer such opportunities for creativity, etc. Then state that you want to support and encourage her enthusiasm and creativity at home and you see no reason why this should be a problem. At the very least this should force them to articulate better their reasons against it, which doesn't make sense to me.

BTW, one of my fondest memories of my own elementary GT class was designing a board game based on a book we were reading.

I also really like the idea of getting them to let her do independent study in the library. That would be a great option if you think you could get them to go for it!

My daughter did this with her age peers and the only thing that helped it, for us, was her grade acceleration. Honestly, she did know more things than her age peers a lot of the time, but obviously not always. But usually being in the position of knowing more made her assume she always knew more. She was never thought of as a know-it-all by her age peers, but I didn't like what I was seeing and I didn't want it to continue. I really saw it as a symptom of her being in the wrong group. With older kids she is definitely on a more even plane, both academically and socially. Not really helpful, I know, but I just wanted to say that your DD isn't the only one who does this.

As far as reading goes, a librarian at school or at the city libary should be able to help you. Perhaps classics are the way to go? The series The Mother-Daughter Book Club is written at a middle-school level but is based on classic books and talks about classic books within a modern setting of middle-school girls and is a good jumping-off point into the classics. Another option would be to use the Teacher Book Wizard website (http://www.scholastic.com/bookwizard/). You could look up a book like Love and Hate in Jamestown which has a lexile of 1230 and then look for books at a similar lexile level.

About the math projects, it sounds like your DD likes them and is really taking ownership of her work, so I think that's great! I think it's ridiculous that the school is so insecure with their teaching that they are actually saying kids shouldn't do learning activities at home because it affects their ability to grade accurately. Talk about losing sight of the point of teaching! I'm not sure why schools think everyone should be going wider and deeper and not higher. I think you're lucky in theory that they are trying to do something for kids who already know the math, but I don't think it's enough. We're struggling with a situation where our DD isn't even being offered enrichment, and she wants desperately to learn new math, but she wants to learn it in school and not come home and add on more math (exciting new stuff though it may be) when she's just had to do an hour worth of inappriate-level math at school.

What does your DD think of the idea of homeschooling? Have you discussed the options and pros and cons with her? Where do her priorities lie as far as social versus academic growth?

I would be beyond frustrated with the "enrichment" projects. Enrichment is supposed to be taking thinking skills to a deeper level - this just sounds like busy work, plus busy work inside an insane set of arbitrary rules (don't do homework at school, don't do schoolwork at home). The first project with mean, median etc sounds like an attempt to make math applicable and interesting... but, just fwiw, that's a math project my kids did as regular classroom work in 3rd grade in a non-GT school, so I'm guessing your dd is ready for something much more challenging.

It sounds like you're in a nothing-you-can-do-about it situation - we had that same situation in our ds' elementary school. We did what others mentioned, after-schooled in math at his level, and had him work on the regular class math at school. DS didn't mind working on math after school - and I can't imagine a reason for a teacher to tell a parent not to let their child work on academics that they are interested in and want to work on after school - with intellectually gifted kids, that can be the way they explore their passions, every bit as much as a child who loves soccer gets to play soccer a lot after school. If your dd were practicing soccer 5 nights a week would a teacher tell her she should only do it during her one gym class per week at school?

Anyway, fwiw, our ds became very frustrated with his school by the time he was in 5th grade both due to the low level of classroom discussion relative to his intellect, and also due to his advocating for himself to be math-accelerated and being denied over and over again. He switched schools for 6th grade, and we were able to show the work he'd done after-schooling in math and he was instantly given a 2-grade math skip - so - if that's the only option open to you and your dd wants to do it, it might be worth it since she's halfway or more through elementary school already. OTOH programming or other directions that she wants to go in at home may be more fun for her, and equally rewarding, and in that case I would continue to advocate for truly challenging math at school. If advocating is taking up too much energy, I'd let go of it for this one remaining half year.

Best wishes,

polarbear

I meant to comment on the reading issue too. www.lexile.com has a tool where you input your lexile level and it spits out a list of books at that level. You can also choose by subject.

So I'm not sure why they can't find an appropriate book for her. It seems easy enough. Perhaps you can go on the website, print the list and give it to them. You totally shouldn't have to do this, but it would help make sure she is being given appropriate reading material.

I agree that this sounds like busy work. Some suggestions advanced at a recent TAT team meeting for DS6 were that he could make up problems for the rest of the class, do projects where he would learn about the use throughout history of skills being learned by his second grade class (at the time covering two-digit addition with carrying ), etc.

These are time-wasting exercises, designed in the hopes of keeping the child occupied and happy enough not to complain, while keeping the child from advancement. One person at the last two TAT meetings has stated that our son is "ahead of where he's supposed to be" and argued that he needs to be kept from distancing himself from his "peers" even further. I feel for you.

I'm guessing that the reason your DD is not allowed to work on the projects at home any more is that the teacher suspects parental involvement in the work. That's a shame-- your DD should be encouraged to develop her computer skills, especially as that's a large part of what she's getting out of the exercises. In addition her attempts to improve the quality of her work should really be encouraged!

Iucounu...I said that to the VP...I said exactly that.
The VP asked me...so, the meeting we are going to have is about letting your DD work on enrichment projects at home? I said No! It's about the discouragment my DD is getting from teachers to go ahead or above and beyond and quite frankly, I feel as though they think I am helping her or making her do these projects at home. I am not.
She was offended. Ugghh!
It will be interesting to see if we get anywhere with the meeting.

PolarBear. 5th Grade? I can see that. It slowly goes downhill and I can see how by 5th grade the kid can just give up. Exactly what I am trying to prevent here!

Thank you so much for the book suggestions. I know I'm dropping the ball here, but I am being pig heading and strong-willed and she is not going to get behind in reading if she reads nothing for 4 years...So, I'm playing the game..the one where I sit back and wait for someone to step up. But, I will check out those Mother-Daughter books! You are the second person to suggest them this week!

Here is a link to a video of my DD teaching her lil sis about Science..This is a subject she has no real experience with. So, she is soaking everything she learns in school up and teaching it to sis! It's just kind of cute, but I wonder if the VP would aprove of this after school, school stuff....especially for the 6 year old! I dunno..:) Thank you so much for all you comments and support and advice and stories of your own kids. I do think I need to appeciate the little that IS being offered. It is the first time they are trying ANYTHING with DD and I guess I was hoping for so much more!
Here is the link

I suspect, like Iucounu, that reason for no work at home is that the teacher thinks you are doing it with/for her. But...

I would also +1 LNEsMom on the busy work issue. There is real (well, as real as it gets) math enrichment behind what she is asked to do, although maybe (probably) not at high enough a level for her.

The biggest issue I see with her work, and what I think is bothering the teacher, is that while she is pouring a lot effort in making her work as polished as she can, creating the perfect grid in PS and wanting to have the perfect laminated game pieces has nothing to do with the math. She is creating her own busywork around the assignment!

The teacher's reaction seems to have been trying to cut on the external distractions (Photoshop, laminating...). What she should do instead (in my own totally uneducated opinion) is to make the assignments more challenging not on the art and craft front but on the math front.

What about a grade skip?

I hate to say it but it sounds like your 9 yo dd scares the hell out of her teacher. The teacher probably instinctively understands that your dd has the ability to make her look stupid. The easiest way to combat this is to squash her like a bug and keep her there. Everything she learns at home gives her another opportunity to make her teacher look bad. It sounds far fetched but consider having a 9 yo walk in one day talking about something, anything that you have no knowledge of. GT kids can come up with some pretty obscure subjects.

I have a couple of things for you to think about. First you need to educate yourself regarding federal, state and local GT mandates. Most admins and teachers don't know them chapter and verse. If you walk into the meeting armed with knowledge, admins tend to take you much more seriously. Find out what the chain of command is in your district. If you don't get a response from the principal, move up the chain. Try very hard not to be emotional, just pummel them into submission with the facts. In their face. Make sure that you reiterate every meeting or phone call in writing. You need to have a document of what has transpired. Advocating is truly the business of "the squeky wheel". They all start out hoping that if they ignore you, you'll give up and go away. Unfortunately, this works all too often.

As far as your daughter goes.... There are a huge number of subjects that are not taught in elementary school. Start her on a new language, teach her how to build a Rube-Goldberg project and the physics behind it. Have her learn Origami, Chess and 3-D tanagrams. All of these activities will enhance her math skills without directly conflicting with curriculum. Pick a science subject and have at it! My son spent several months giving himself a anatomy course. Rather than the sketchy two week unit that most schools give, he came out the other end with an enormous amount of respect for the machine that is his body. Let your daughter help choose the subject, she'll be excited by the challenge.

NOBODY knows your child better than you. If your mommy gut says that things need to change, listen to it. Do not let people convince you that what your instincts are telling you is wrong. Being a parent is about being responsible for the person you will ultimately shape. Not about stuffing her in a box based on the perception of others.