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    Joined: Jul 2011
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    I found DS Investigations very troublesome to use as a teacher, because there didn't seem to be enough opportunity for pencil and paper practice. I don't really like "drill and kill", but there should be at least a little bit of it. There were pages like this with Investigations that you could use, but it was really left up to the teacher to decide whether or not to print them out.

    A teacher who really knew what she was doing could make Investigations works in a fabulous way. A teacher who didn't know what she was doing, could really bomb with it.

    Singapore would be a really good choice to help augment a program like Investigations at home.

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    Originally Posted by jenbrdsly
    I found DS Investigations very troublesome to use as a teacher, because there didn't seem to be enough opportunity for pencil and paper practice. I don't really like "drill and kill", but there should be at least a little bit of it. There were pages like this with Investigations that you could use, but it was really left up to the teacher to decide whether or not to print them out.

    A teacher who really knew what she was doing could make Investigations works in a fabulous way. A teacher who didn't know what she was doing, could really bomb with it.

    Singapore would be a really good choice to help augment a program like Investigations at home.
    From the posted references it appears that the Investigations material is seriously defective as a math course. Perhaps it could be used to supplement Singapore Math or something else, but not the other way around.

    Having bought Singapore Math, in my opinion it's not perfect but it doesn't have any big weaknesses either. It does plenty to strengthen conceptual understanding, with lots of different types of illustrations to make sure that students have a strong conceptual framework before getting into any pencil-and-paper drill. One can add extra reinforcing practice with the workbook, which has problem solving interspersed with more traditional drill on what's been called "algorithms" in this thread.

    I think Singapore Math is a good example of how a good basis for understanding can be taught without necessarily needing to be discovered by a student first, and the emphasis on problem solving would tend to keep most students from being too passive or bored. The Singapore Math approach in third and fourth grade seems to be to illustrate a concept graphically; when appropriate to have a student do some discovery (e.g. in the 3B materials introducing fluid volume, students are given small explorations with real-world / household materials to get a feel for combining volumes, etc.); and when a conceptual basis has been established, get into working problems. Regarding problems, it starts with simple non-word problems first, then gets into simple word problems, then multi-step word problems. In addition Singapore Math seems to intentionally remove explicit instruction on how to do the problems as the student progresses, so that by the end of a section the student is (hopefully) fully self-sufficient.


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    Originally Posted by lucounu
    From the posted references it appears that the Investigations material is seriously defective as a math course. Perhaps it could be used to supplement Singapore Math or something else, but not the other way around.

    I would definitely agree with this statement. There are certain investigations in the geometry and fractions units that I absolutely love, and I use some of the conceptual number activities as warm up or for independent activities, but after trying to implement it as core curriculum for a couple of years, and watching my children bring home work from the curriculum in the earlier grades, I consider it to be dangerously incomplete.

    The more time I spend with the Singapore Primary Math curriculum, the more impressed I am with it. I will use it as a core curriculum for the first time this year and use Investigations and other sources to supplement and in some cases pre-assess conceptual understandings. That said, I will still post-pone teaching the standard algorithms until I can verify a certain level of mental math ability with groups of students. I will definitely postpone fraction work until I am confident that students actually grasp relative size and meaning of fractions. Those particular area have been critiques of the Primary Math curriculum that I have found valid for students who don't have good number sense. However, those critiques have led to a throwing-the-baby-out-with-the-bathwater response to Primary Math which I find to be both illogical and foolish.

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    I agree about the fractions in Singapore Math, Taminy. My son already had a solid grasp of what they are before we started with Singapore Math, and I could see value in different types of clear models and hands-on exploration to make sure that students got the concept before really digging into the work. In fact that goes for a lot of early topics, including multiplication, division, etc. I really think that good-quality "Investigations"-type modeling and discovery might make a good addition to just about any curriculum, actually. It could always be slotted in during the introductory period on that topic. I just don't think sole reliance on that approach would be good.

    In my local school district here in New Hampshire, they seem to take that approach to some extent, and it's one thing I like here. They begin with multiplication, division, and fractions all at the same time in first grade, long before any emphasis on learning times tables, doing pencil work with long division and the like, etc.


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    Oh arrgh. This talk about a sub par "investigations" program is really making me more anxious about our schools new junior school curriculum - which I was already worried about. It's NOT the curriculum you are talking about it, it's been developed here in Australia. But "investigations" are at the core of the program and it's all about "authentic" learning experiences. My husband and I are already very dubious but trying to reserve judgement...

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    Originally Posted by MumOfThree
    Oh arrgh. This talk about a sub par "investigations" program is really making me more anxious about our schools new junior school curriculum - which I was already worried about. It's NOT the curriculum you are talking about it, it's been developed here in Australia. But "investigations" are at the core of the program and it's all about "authentic" learning experiences. My husband and I are already very dubious but trying to reserve judgement...

    What are they using in Australia? I'm curious.

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    I read as far as the part about constructivism and then I jumped to the end. Sorry if I'm just repeating what others said, but I wanted to say that I ordered all the new elementary Life of Fred books for DS5 and he absolutely loves them. However, I don't know whether I'd use them as a curriculum, but they're a great supplement, and DS loves the quirky stories and humor. Truth be told, some of the subject matter is far below his ability, but because of some of the math concepts and vocabulary to which he's not otherwise exposed and even non-mathy concepts covered in each book I decided to get all of them. The stories make the stuff that is review for him interesting enough that he doesn't seem to mind. I think depending how much work you wanted to do you could create lessons that expand on the material covered in the books, or you could use them as a way to figure out which things your child needs to work on more and skip the things that they don't.

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