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    Joined: Mar 2008
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    I am not really sure where I am going with this inquiry...

    Since my son was born he has always been different. He is now 2 � years old and is still seems very different when compared to his peers. We are having suspicions now that he may be showing some signs of giftedness. The past couple of weeks he has done things at home and at daycare that have just blown us away and made us look again at the things he does.

    I rarely talk about this with others, because most of the time people will say, "oh we all think our children are smart." I will not disagree with that, I do think we all hold our children up, as well we should! I also feel like I am bragging when I tell people this stuff, please do not take it as such. But the time has come that I feel like I need to speak up and get some further resources for my son. I frequent another "mommy board" and inquired the mothers there, but was not able to get any response from anyone!!

    So here goes...

    My son has hit every milestone (except for sleeping) well ahead of the "normal rage." He was very alert to the world from the moment he was born. In the hospital he kept breaking his little arms out of his swaddle. He hated to be swaddled because he liked to hold things and feel things. He held his head up at a very young age. There were several occasions where I went to pick him up and someone would freak out because I wasn't holding his head. He always wanted to know what was going on, therefore he developed his neck muscles very quickly. He could roll in both directions by the time he was 2.5 months. He had mastered crawling by 4.5 months and was walking confidently by 8 months. He started saying several words at about 8 months and was pairing 2-3 words together by his first birthday.

    Today, at 2 � years old, he is a very inquisitive little boy. He asks lots of questions and just gets things when you tell him. When we went to his 2 year well check the pediatrician (she was a new one as we had recently moved) asked if he was making sentences yet. We just laughed and told her that he speaks in paragraphs. He knows his alphabet and recognizes most of the letters, he knows his numbers, he does puzzles labeled for 3 and 4 year olds, he is VERY mechanical, he knows his colors and shapes (including semicircle and oblong wink ), I could go on and on. The daycare lady often comments that in her 23 years of daycare she has never met a kid quite like my son. He is the first kid in all her years that figured out there is a small place where you can escape the backyard. He figured this out last summer, and then proceeded to show the 3 and 4 year old kids how to get out.

    The two episodes that really stand out and have made us question things are this.

    The first one happened last Saturday. As we sat at the table and ate breakfast, my son went into a whole monologue about the lunar eclipse. We had watched the event on the 20th and talked about it a little that night and a week and a half later he tells me a whole story about the lunar eclipse. He said "The moon had a lunar eclipse. The moon was not coming apart, it was getting covered. We can not see the moon when it is getting eclipsed. It is getting covered like this (makes a motion) and then it is not bright anymore." All of this was without prompting. We then talked for probably 5-7 more minutes about the lunar eclipse. When we were done eating breakfast he spent the next half hour "eclipsing" everything. He told his daycare lady a similar story on Monday and she was also very taken aback.

    The second episode happened last night when we were reading bedtime stories. He is currently very into all things trains, so we were reading a Thomas book. The book has a page that says, "The sun is yellow, the sun is round. The sun makes shadows on the ground." He asked, "what is round?" I took his finger and outlined the sun picture to show him what round was. He then said, "oh the sun is round, and the moon is round?"
    I said, "yes."
    "and Thomas's eyes are round?"
    yes again!
    "and a ball is round?"
    I said, "yes a ball is round, and do you know the sun is round like a ball?"
    He answers, "oh the sun is round like and ball. and the moon is round like a ball too?"
    I said, "yes the moon is round like a ball too!"
    Without skipping a beat, he finishes by saying, "The moon is round like a ball and Thomas's wheels are round like a circle."
    This was the point at which my jaw drops and I am astounded.

    I have know for a long time that he is a special little boy, but lately he has done so many things that have made me realize he is not a normal 2 � year old. I guess what I am wondering is if anyone has any good resources or can give me advice about how to work with this. I was considered "gifted" in school and remember being bored a lot of the time. I don't want to push my son, I just want to keep him learning and enjoying the world. On the other hand I want to make sure that he is not bored. I also am looking for resources on what to look for and how to work with the talents he has. He currently goes to a home daycare as both my husband and I work full time. Should I be finding enriching activities outside of daycare at this age? I don't even know where to began, all I know is he is not normal and I need help!! Thanks for reading this long post. I could go on for pages about all the different things my son does, but I will stop now.

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    Welcome. You'll soon see you've come to the right place. Yes, many of us have had similar experiences. I'm late to the party with plenty of questions myself, so I'll leave others to answer your questions.

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    Yes, WELCOME! Mamabird!

    Trust your instincts at this point. As far as enrichment--my personal opinion is read, read, read to him. One suggestion is to read him stories a little above his chronological age. I used to visit the library every week and check out 50 story books--you shoulda seen the fines if I was a couple days late!(fables, myths, culturally diverse folk tales). I didn't have the patience for stories that were not interesting to me. If he has very specific interests, nurture them. For instance, if he loves dinosaurs, take out a lot of books on them and learn all about them together and go see a natural history museum. If he likes fighter jets, research them and see if you can go to an air show. That's another suggestion--expose him to whatever's available nearby, museums, music, children's theater. Since you work, use your car-time to recite nursery rhymes, sing songs, play games like naming things that start with "T" or the "ttt" sound, then "S", etc. I personally don't think classes are as valuable at this age as one-on-one interaction. Bingo, shape matching, etc.

    Is your home daycare provider doing any activities with the kids? I used to bring art supplies to ours or educational games/videos. If he's already interested in letters, numbers, shapes, you might get a couple pre-K workbooks from the grocery store or teacher's store to help him learn. I don't consider it "pushing" or "hothousing" (see that thread on this board) as much as following his lead. If he's not interested or able to do that, wait.

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    Hi - I'm new to this too, but I can try to give you a couple of resources that might be useful. Since you've already found this site, you're ahead of the game already. My dear son (DS) just turned 4, and he displayed many of the same behaviors as your son. We have decided to get him formally tested to see if early K is a good option, and to learn more about how best to educate the wee-un. It's interesting about the neck muscles as a newborn - my DS4 was the same way (his neck muscles were strong at birth).

    I would say since your son is just 2 1/2 you don't really need to to anything special except follow his lead in terms of what he's interested in. Going to different places is fun - zoos, childrens museums, science museums. It sounds like you are doing a great job by just listening and answering all the questions your son has. Buy your son toys you think he'd be interested in and don't worry so much about the age requirements (unless your son likes to put stuff in his mouth). Gifted kids can enjoy toys meant for older kids.

    I read Deborah Ruf's book "Losing our Minds: Gifted Children Left Behind" and found it very helpful in identifying our son as gifted. There are excellent descriptions about what how gifted kids act when they were infants/toddlers and as they get older. This book also describes the different levels of giftedness (moderately to profoundly). I definitely could see my kid in many of the stories from this book. Since your son has hit many of these early milestones, this book may be useful to you. Not all gifted kids will fit into the categories listed by Ruf.

    I also liked "A Parent's Guide to Gifted Children" by James T. Webb, a good comprehensive overview.

    Hoagiesgifted.org is a good resource for all things gifted. Look under Parents to find articles and more.

    There are many others on this website with lots more experience who will be able to give you more info. Your son sounds delightful. Good luck!

    Last edited by st pauli girl; 03/06/08 09:12 AM.
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    Welcome Mamabird,
    I am pretty new here also but this forum is so great at getting information. My DD is almost 3.5. And I could have written many things you wrote.

    I am lucky since I live in NYC and there are gifted educational options. In fact, there is a gifted preschool, for which we had DD tested last year but she missed the age cut off by one month and they wouldn't consider her. But the testing then identified her as highly gifted. We did the test again this past January to see if it was an abberation and/or how she was developing. The tester remembered her and her results were even better.

    Because sometimes you think you are mistaken. If you are questioning it, chances are your child is really gifted.

    Although a lot of people here favor Ruf's book, I think she just wrote the book so upper middle class white people would buy her services. Yes, there is some very good material in her book but it is unscientific, a very small sample size and totally subjective in its findings. AFter reading it, I know my child is at least a level 3. How does that help me. Saying my child is at least a level 3, probably a level 4 gets me no where with the school or what she needs for education. Ruf claims that she could finish the elementary curriculum in one year.

    Sorry, I am going off now.

    I agree that you try and take your child to many interesting outings. Zoos, museums, read, read, read. And there are a lot of interesting shows. Curious George, Between the Lions, that feeds their curiousity. Library is a great place to explore different topics and see what he is interested in.

    I put my child in a playschool last year (totally non academic) and it worked for socialization at 2. She doesn't like to play alone much. This year she is in a really good Montessori with 3-5 year olds and she is doing math there, spelling and reading. She needs the socialization and they are also very active. Usually going out to Central Park every day. They also go on field trips to Carnegie Hall and the fire station and the zoo. They listen to different composers and things like Peter and the Wolf and have it explained. Preschools can be amazing places.

    Good luck and remember you don't have to do it all at once.

    Ren

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    Quick blurb on Ruf - for me, her book helped me to know that my child probably would not do well in an ordinary school setting, and we would have to seek out more information about how to best educate him. (Basically, helped me along the road to recovery from gifted denial.) Also, I think it's important to recognize that there are different levels of giftedness, and that kids may learn differently depending on the range. It was the first book I read on giftedness, and I don't hold it up as the holy grail. It's certainly not for everybody.

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    I'd like to echo Cym and St Pauli Girl (i.e. nurture his interests). We have a family membership to the children's museum of nature and science. DS2 goes every Saturday morning. Last Sunday we took him to a model train expo.

    You're in good company on this site. The camaraderie is palpable. smile

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    Hi, Mamabird! laugh

    I wish I'd figured out as early as you that my child was unusual. I had a serious case of GT denial, and he was 6 before I realized he was more than "just a little gifted."

    As others have noted, following your child's interests is really the best thing you can do.

    We've also found that using big ideas and big words and explaining/defining them for our child has been really good for him. He learns so much more when we talk to him as we would talk to a much older child (or perhaps even an adult, depending upon the topic). If we go too in-depth for him, he makes it clear that his interest has waned and we stop. But I've often been amazed by his interest in and grasp of highly complex ideas and his proper use of a varied and complex vocabulary. (I know you're seeing some of that with your DS already...) Anything else seems like talking down to our DS, and it bores him.

    Other than that, just give him the opportunities that come your way. Keep your eyes open for games and experiences that would interest your son. Keep being a loving parent. smile

    Oh, and I recommend praising effort rather than result even now. I really believe that keeps perfectionism at bay, at least a little bit. It matters more as time goes on, but I think it's never too early to start.

    Keep coming back! This is a great place for help and info!


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    Note to Wren:

    Originally Posted by Wren
    Although a lot of people here favor Ruf's book, I think she just wrote the book so upper middle class white people would buy her services.


    Youch.

    Maybe you could say that you don't like her methods or her sample size--both valid criticisms--without being quite so insulting about it? Insulting both to those of us who found her book helpful and to Ruf herself, since she is one of those leading the fight for GT education.

    Sincerely,

    A less-than-upper-middle-class white person who has never used Ruf's services and who doesn't plan to, but who found the LOGs discussed in Ruf's book to be pivotal to her understanding of her son.


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    WOW!! Thanks so much for all of the good information. It makes me more confident that we are already doing a lot of the things we "should be." We are very happy with the at home daycare he attends. The daycare lady runs a curriculum based program, so he is getting a lot of good exposure already. Socially, he actually does very well. Last week his daycare lady was on vacation so he was at a different home daycare for the week. Everyday he would tell me he missed his best friend Jacob. Jacob is almost 5. I mentioned this to his regular daycare lady this week when he returned and she told me that him and Jacob have been playing a lot together lately. I am guessing he is more on par with Jacob than the two other boys that are close to his age. I am so glad I asked questions and put this out there. I really doubted myself, but it sounds like my mother intuition was right again!!

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    Oh, yes! Generally speaking, the average 2.5yo doesn't actually play, 1-on-1-style, with a 5yo. They're still in the parallel play stage, with little interaction. From what you described, I don't think any of us doubt that you have a GT child--and probably an HG+ child--on your hands.

    Second-guessing yourself is normal. But it's good to get past it quickly and start seeing what you're really dealing with. Parenting these kids is wonderful...and hard...and scary..and even heartbreaking sometimes. But the sooner you realize what you have on your hands, the sooner you can start dealing with reality.

    You're about 3.5 years ahead of where I was when I figured it out! smile Good on ya'!

    Now the journey begins!


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    Originally Posted by Kriston
    You're about 3.5 years ahead of where I was when I figured it out! smile Good on ya'!

    Ha! I really envy the people who are so ahead of the game on this issue.

    It sounds like you're doing everything right to me! A day care situation where he can interact with bigger kids sounds ideal.

    Even thought I didn't know my son was GT until 6, I was home with him as a preschooler and just followed his lead. I just assumed every other preschooler out there pursued science experiments and was obsessed in great detail with bacteria, germs, plumbing, electrical work, furnaces, etc. I don't think my son is too scarred by me not knowing just by following his lead and listening to my intuition. He attended a very part time play based preschool that was totally open ended and had a science component to it. It worked out quite well.

    You'll want to continually reasses the day care/preschool situation but the status quo sounds really great!

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    Good morning,

    OK Kriston, as an upper white family, I think I can call it as I see it. My DH was even more critical of Ruf's book. He thought it was a total ego stroker. She never said what she used to define her levels except some subjettive standard she had of measuring motivation. She did not even say how she observed these differences in motivation, how long, over what period of time. It was purely her judgement.

    And her projections of penetration of these giftedness. Half the class in an upper class neighborhood of highly educated people.

    If someone is new, as I was, and reads references to Ruf like it is the forum's bible, I think it fair to say what others think.

    Clearly Mamabird has an amazing child. And there is a lot of great advice here. I think it is important to provide reviews of recommendations. Because when I read Ruf's book I posted a question, saying why is this so great because I had not seen a contrary opinion.

    Ruf's book is interesting, but not scientific.

    Ren

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    Ren,

    For what it's worth, Ruf's work in LOG was pretty much spot on describing my two girls. From the apgar score and alertness at birth, to the early sight reading, santa clause, so on and so on.
    I don't consider it "the bible" on gifted and I think most intelligent adults would realize that to do so wouldn't make much sense.
    Obviously if it doesn't apply to a child, that doesn't mean the child is not gifted.
    I never read the book, probably should. I got my info on her descriptions of LOG she posts online for free.
    I'm not convinced she would post the meat of her results for free online if her motivation was purely the pursuit of money.
    Besides, I haven't seen her on TV at 3:00a.m.!! smile
    But to disregard all of her(Ruf) work because it may not apply to your child, is pretty unscientific as well, I'd think.

    Peace,
    Incog

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    Originally Posted by Wren
    OK Kriston, as an upper white family, I think I can call it as I see it.


    It's not your opinion I have trouble with, it's the nasty, insulting tone you're taking. As I said, it's perfectly possible to state your valid problems with Ruf's method and sample size without insulting others.

    It's not the first time you've been disrespectful to those of us on the forum, though it is the most glaring example. So I'm calling it as I see it.

    While there are plenty of contrary opinions on the forum about Ruf--we had a lively and interesting debate about her work not long ago--everyone managed to discuss the book without turning the conversation into a personal attack, as you have done.

    You don't have to like Ruf. You are welcome to tell us that you don't like Ruf. But if Ruf is an ego-stroker, pure and simple, then those of us who found help in her books must be too stupid to see that she's a snake-oil salesman. That's unfair and it's mean. What's more, you can make your point without resorting to such treatment of others. Civil disagreement is possible.

    Her work has helped a lot of us. We are educated, intelligent people who read a lot, and her work helped us. Insulting us helps no one, and it might very well chase away someone who found help through Ruf's book because she's going to think this forum is unfriendly to her and her child. I won't put up with that. That's not the forum I joined.

    I'm asking you to please be polite. That's all I'm asking for.


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    I know what you mean too! After I typed my response in, I thought that I kind of feel bad about following my DD3 around with my GT radar now on. I felt like DS's preschool years were so fun and carefree and exploratory. Our area sounds very similar. Most of our friend's kids would definitely qualify for a general GT program.

    I think this is part of the reason that homeschooling is looking better all the time since we have the ability to do it right now. Creating our own cluster!

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    Originally Posted by Dottie
    Now Kriston, I was trying to change the subject, LOL!


    Sorry, Dottie! We crossposted. It took me some time to compose that message and myself...

    Yes, please, change the subject!

    One of the reasons we didn't realize just how bright DS6 is, I think, is because at least 3 of the kids in our playgroup were at least vanilla GT, and one of those I'm sure is MG or maybe even HG. It made me think that they were average and DS was MG.

    Those natural clusters can be good in some ways and distracting in others...

    They're great for HSing though! smile


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    I've written a couple times, Ruf's levels really don't work for my kid. At least as he was as a preschooler. It's a fairly narrow listing of traits and abilities. There's nothing about complex lego sets, preschool multiplication, obsession with the world's religions, or analysis of plumbing systems which was where DS was at as a prescholer. The reading piece really was what made us think we just had maybe a MG kid. I take it for what it's worth - a loose guideline.

    I still have great respect for Ruf and her work. I've also seen her speak. I think she's done amazing and important things in this field. I'd love to take DS to her.

    We can (and should )have lively discussion on issues while still being polite.

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    Originally Posted by kimck
    There's nothing about complex lego sets, preschool multiplication, obsession with the world's religions, or analysis of plumbing systems which was where DS was at as a prescholer.


    LOL! This list makes me really want to meet your DS. What a fun and interesting kid!


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    Originally Posted by Kriston
    LOL! This list makes me really want to meet your DS. What a fun and interesting kid!

    It'd be great to get a lot of these kids together! I bet they would have a blast and solve a few of the world's problems. smile

    Seeing that list makes me miss the preschool DS! I'm really looking forward to homeschooling and getting some of his fire back.

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    I would like to start by saying I really do appreciate all of you taking the time to read my post and respond with resources and advice. As a highly intellectual, middle class, working woman, I believe I will be able to form my own conclusions about the work people have done on this topic. Hopefully, without offending anyone I will say that I really do appreciate all the feedback and advice, but I don't particularly enjoy weeding through the bickering to find it.

    Moving on...

    I thought it was a very interesting comment made about children this age not normally engaging in play with other children, but rather, they engage in parallel play. (Sometimes I forget this is true) I commented about this to the daycare lady this morning and she said she finds it very interesting how he is so involved in actual play with the older children. When he is there, it sounds like he is somewhat of a ring-leader. One of the favorite things they play, once again, is trains. DS and his little buddy will line up and crawl around the room gathering "passengers" or "freight." One of them will be the engine and the other will be the coach car or the freight car. They will "hook up" by the second "car" holding on to the first "car's" feet. We often engage in this game at home as well (it is starting to take a toll on my knees!)

    I also thought Kimck's comments about the furnace, plumbing, electrical work, etc was somewhat comical. My husband and I recently purchased a fixer-upper house and we are doing most of the repair ourselves. Our son is beside himself learning about all of the fixing we are doing. We purchased some little plastic tools for him last summer at a garage sale and it was the best $2 I think I ever spent! He followed DH around for a good hour last weekend "helping him" install new switches and outlets. Also, every time we go down into the basement, he has to check to see if the furnace is on. It is hilarious!

    I like all of your thoughts on going to museums, zoos, etc. I live in the suburbs of Minneapolis, MN, so I have lots of great resources very nearby. Sometimes I get stuck in a rut in the winter, because of how darn cold it gets here!! It is often times easier just to stay home! I think I will check into what exhibits they have running in the near future at our children's museum and science museum! Great thought everybody, THANKS!

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    Mamabird,

    Museums etc can be great, but don't worry if they aren't a "hit" at this age.

    We live quite a ways out of town and I remember being very excited about taking DS to the zoo for the first time when he was just 4. We looked at several exhibits, showing him our favorite animals (sloth bear and ocelot), but it was hard to keep him engaged. We took a lunch break and he started chasing squirrels. Then after lunch we checked out the reptiles and apes. When we got home we asked him what his favorite animals and he said enthusiastically "The Squirrels!!!" We have 3 families of sqirrels living in our yard, so I swore that I would save my admission money for when DS was older.

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    Mamabird-

    I was in St. Paul with my kids last summer. The science museum was wonderful and my little girls loved the children's museum too! Are these the museums you are referring to, or are there others located in Minneapolis itself?

    Just curious-


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    Lorel

    Those are the museums I am referring to. I have not taken my son to the museums yet, because I thought maybe he was too young. We have, however, gone to the zoos here several times. It is nice, we have one zoo that has lots of animals that are really more in a "wildlife habitat." That one is a little spendier to get in, and the animals are sometimes more difficult to see. We also have a small zoo and conservatory that is FREE to get in to. We frequent that one in the summer!

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    Oooh! Free zoo! laugh


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    Ooh, zing, mamabird! Good on you. smile

    Welcome to the board. Your ds sounds very bright indeed -- you're certainly in the right place. As others have said, at his age you'll want to follow his interests and allow him to develop them as far as he wants. If he seems interested in 3D shapes, expose him to cubes, spheres and pyramids -- there's no reason a 2.5yo shouldn't learn these things! Show him parallelograms, rhombi, and trapezoids, if he seems intrigued by shapes.

    My ds was about your ds's age when I started to realize that he was a bit different. It's so much fun to watch them develop and grow through those preschool years! My ds was in full-time daycare as well, though we switched him to Montessori when he was 4 (and now he's in public K), and he doesn't seem scarred.

    Really, as long as your ds is enjoying himself at home and at school, you don't necessarily need to do anything "special" at this point, other than allow him the freedom to explore areas that interest him -- even if those aren't the typical interests of a 2yo.

    Again, welcome!


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    First of all Kriston, I apologize if you took offense. None intended. I did say I started back to work and if you spend hours talking to traders everyday, you get to the point and you don't time for the niceties. Time is money.

    So please, did not mean to insult. I think you all extrapolated from my opinion and did not care to read what I wrote. And incog, my DD3 did fit into a level 4/5 according to her milestones. So please don't assume, I am insulted and are you going to apologize to me?

    The point is/was/ Mamabird has this amazing child and is experiencing what many of us experienced with our DC at 2. It was very confusing to me and although all these people were coming up to me saying, "you know your child is really smart/amazing etc." there are those inner voices that say yes, she/he is smart but are they really "that smart" like over the top smart.

    We talk about testing here and DYS/IEP, homeschooling acceleration, gifted education. How does Ruf's book help in deciding what choices you should make. How do you know if your child scores 200 on the SB if they are level 3 or level 5. Because even though they scored 200, they might have low motivation and only be a level 3. Though according to Ruf, that could change. How you define the change is not clear.

    I came to this forum as a newbie, read Ruf's book and after wondered why? I am glad it helps so many, but Mamabird may be like me. It is nice to know that there are others.

    One of the things that us with young children want to understand is the non-linear calculations and understandings that come out of their mouths at 2 and 3. When I talked with Hunter, that was what she was interested in.

    I have tried to start topics on the non-linear and linear on this forum and did not really get responses. I thought I would find something in Ruf's book. Did not. I have researched to understand it better myself and how that plays out in her cognitive developement, particularly as her linear capacity grows. To me, this is most helpful with a very young child.

    Incog, perhaps I am the stupid one and just needs to take a different path.

    Ren

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    Originally Posted by Wren
    So please, did not mean to insult. I think you all extrapolated from my opinion and did not care to read what I wrote. And incog, my DD3 did fit into a level 4/5 according to her milestones. So please don't assume, I am insulted and are you going to apologize to me?

    Oh, my. shocked I have to admit that I'm rather perplexed. This seems so far out in left field that I don't know what to say or where to begin... which is why I won't.

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    What does your DS like to do, Mamabird? Is he the sort who is curious about everything or is he more the obsessive type, learning all there is to learn about one subject before moving on, with only minor curiosity about other topics?

    Or is it too soon to tell?


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    He is definitely not obsessive. His four big areas of interest are books, trains, tools and his kitchen/cooking stuff. He tends to focus on one for a while and then revert back to one of the others. I would not say these are the only things he enjoys though. He also really likes cars, trucks, and other things that go; he loves to climb and swing at the park; he enjoys doing puzzles; taking care of his babies; etc. He seems to be a pretty well rounded kid thus far. He has also displayed good social skills. He is fairly sensitive when it comes to his emotions and coping, but I tend to think that has more to do with him being two than anything else.

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    Awww... you make me long for a play date. It's too bad you live in a different state mamabird.

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    This is my own totally unscientific observation, but I think there are those two types of HG+ kids: the Obsessive (my DS6) and the Omnivore.

    It sounds like you have an Omnivore on your hands. It's a lot less boring to a non-obsessed parent, so you've got that going for you.

    Our most boringly Obsessive phase was either his "memorize every make and model in the Consumer Reports car edition" phase when he was potty training, or the NASCAR phase that followed hot on its heels. Ugh. Both were brutal for a non-car mom.

    But I can't really complain. After I had kids, I realized that I'm a serial Obsessive myself, so DS6 comes by it honestly...


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    I could use a good play date myself Ann. I joined a early childhood family education course that the school district puts on when DS was around 4 months old and no one could really relate as my son was crawling all over the room and babbling constantly and all the other 4 month olds were just kind of sitting (or laying) around. We never really fit in with that group and then I kind of just gave up on it.

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    Interesting observations Kriston...

    I do have to say that I am really starting to get sick of the train craze!!

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    Actually, the St. Paul children's museum seemed perfect for my two year old last summer, and a bit young for my dd 7. It's definitely geared toward *young* children. You should check it out with your little one.

    Of course at age two even a walk in the park is exciting- everything is so amazing when the world is new!

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    Originally Posted by mamabird
    I do have to say that I am really starting to get sick of the train craze!!

    >>teehee<< My DS2 is also a train lover. The last train-related play date we had was with 4yo twins (boy/girl). The boy referred to an engine by the incorrect name. My son tried to correct him and the other boy got mad at my son. DS's feelings were hurt b/c his observation was soundly dismissed.

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    Welcome mamabird! I had one obsessed with trains too and I also got a wee bit tired of it. grin My oldest also played this imaginary game about two of his friends at pre-school and we played that almost daily for about 3 years. He could bring it up and my eyes would begin to flutter with sleepiness. I definitely got very tired of that one.

    Science museums, art parks, touring a nearby dairy, concerts in the park, even children's theater plays can all be appropriate for a 2 year old if they have any sort of interest or attention span for that kind of thing. Sporting events, air shows, etc. All of these we did with my DS10 when he was 2 or there abouts. He had an amazing attention span (longer than mine usually!) and would want to stay until the very end. Just go with your DS's interests and attention level and you can't go wrong. smile

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    Ooh, we didn't have trains, but we did have construction trucks ... ds was hardly talking at 2.5, but was peeping up from the back seat as we drove:

    "Giant excavator truck!"
    "Double drum compactor truck!"
    "Skid steer!"
    "Articulated dump truck!"

    We've got an omnivore, by and large, though. smile


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    We had the constructon vehicles obsession, too, when DS6 was about 18 months. That was one of my favorites, actually, in part because of funnies like this:

    DS pointed to the shirt of a much older boy--he was probably a 5yo--which had pictures of construction equipment on it. DS said "That's a bobcat." The older boy looked mad and said, "No, that's a digger!" He started lecturing DS about it, and DS didn't know any better but to politely disagree. Naturally I stepped in.

    All this happened in line for a visit with Santa at a playgroup meeting. Santa, played by the dad of one of the kids, overheard and laughed to me, "Your son is right. That's a bobcat, plain as day."

    smile


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    My DS10 was also obsessed with construction vehicles. When he was about 2 he and my dad got into an argument about what type of loader something was - a skid steer or a front end - and I told my dad I would have to go with DS as I was sure he was right! My dad just laughed but my husband confirmed it was a skid steer just as DS said. We had these great little videos, I Love Big Machines, that he loved to watch over and over. They played the William Tell Overture in one part and he'd stand there and run in place to the music while watching the machines. Aaaaahhhh......memories smile

    Funny how several of them liked the construction vehicles!

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    I have two goals for the weekend:

    One is to go to the library to check out a book about train parts. My son keeps asking what all the little parts of each train are and I have NO idea! He will comprehend and remember the real thing, so I figure I am better off teaching him the right things to begin with.

    Second, we have all sorts of boxes from lights and ceiling fans from our latest project at our house. I think I am going to link them all together with rope and cut out the bottom of the front one so my son can crawl in and pull the train! Perhaps I can even turn it into something of a arts and crafts project and let him decorate the boxes.

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    Originally Posted by mamabird
    I also thought Kimck's comments about the furnace, plumbing, electrical work, etc was somewhat comical. My husband and I recently purchased a fixer-upper house and we are doing most of the repair ourselves. Our son is beside himself learning about all of the fixing we are doing. We purchased some little plastic tools for him last summer at a garage sale and it was the best $2 I think I ever spent! He followed DH around for a good hour last weekend "helping him" install new switches and outlets. Also, every time we go down into the basement, he has to check to see if the furnace is on. It is hilarious!

    I like all of your thoughts on going to museums, zoos, etc. I live in the suburbs of Minneapolis, MN,

    Oh - your DS sounds just like mine at 2! When DS was just 3 we moved from a house with a furnace to a house with a boiler. Whenever anyone asked how he liked his new house he'd say "I miss my furnace". He loved to watch it cycle and would run down to the basement when the vents came on. But on the other hand our "new" old house has this antique toliet that DS would pull the top off of and explain the works to every person he could drag in there. You son sounds very sweet! I miss those days. My DD3 is so not that way. But she cracks us up in other ways.

    Kriston - I like the Omnivore/Obsessive classification. I think I'm a closet Obsessive type and so is DH. DS seems more Omnivore right now though but has Obsessive streaks! DD is TBD. Seems obsessive on all things girl to me.

    And Mamabird - I live in St. Paul MN just a couple miles from the free zoo! I initially was afraid of divulging my location but what the heck. I know there is no teacher or administrator from our school lurking.

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    Feed that current passion (trains). I had trouble with fighter jets because all the specs and artillery didn't interest me. Luckily DH had some interest/knowledge. I saw an amazing train museum out near Amish country in Pennsylvania. It was so cool. I've taken the old-fashioned, coal train from Durango, CO to Silverton (really neat). People come to the middle of absolutely nowhere NM (90 miles from here--practically nowhere) to watch trains, because evidently it's cross roads for ATSF & several others. I met an older gentleman once who was describing his upcoming vacation--taking a train cross-county, then back (no anticipated de-training, just the ride--isn't that strange?). Passions are funny, and safe to say, some come and go. DS13 who knew every single thing about dinosaurs at 2 doesn't remember any of it.

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    Just to clarify, so no one thinks that *I think* these are rigid categories, each type of GT person has some of the other aspect.

    I'm a serial Obsessive, but I'm curious about everything. (So is DS6, BTW.)

    In conversation, I often ask lots of questions, so the person I'm talking to thinks I want to pursue the subject "for real" and begins giving me lists of resources, contacts, etc. Then I have to either pretend to have a lasting interest that I never intended, or I must confess, shamefacedly, that no, I don't want to actually go back to school to become a _______; I'm just a curious person.

    In the field of English--my obsession--I wanted to be a generalist because I couldn't pick one major field of study over the others. Asking me to choose between Romantic lit and Modernism was like asking me to choose my favorite child! Unfair! So there I felt like an Omnivore, though in a very limited arena.

    As I say, totally unscientific...but still potentially useful, I think.

    Oh, and mamabird, if I had a dollar for every library book we checked out to figure out the terminology for some obsession, I could probably buy the library! smile


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    Originally Posted by Kriston
    In conversation, I often ask lots of questions, so the person I'm talking to thinks I want to pursue the subject "for real" and begins giving me lists of resources, contacts, etc. Then I have to either pretend to have a lasting interest that I never intended, or I must confess, shamefacedly, that no, I don't want to actually go back to school to become a _______; I'm just a curious person.

    As I say, totally unscientific...but still potentially useful, I think.
    Oooo Kriston - I totally do that conversationally as well.

    And point taken about being unscientific, but I do think it is useful! I like it a lot.

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    Thanks. smile

    It's at least another way to think about these kids, and it's never bad to have another tool in the old toolbox.


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    Mamabird - I am sort of in the Twin Cities area too. smile The children's museum is perfect for your 2 1/2 year old. Also, check out the jackson street roundhouse. You can see all the old real trains, and even ride on the switch track sometimes. They have Thomas tables there and other stuff for little ones too.

    Kimck - our sons should get together and discuss toilets! We have an old-fashioned one, with the tank overhead and a pull cord for flushing, which has always been of great interest to DS4!

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    Originally Posted by st pauli girl
    Kimck - our sons should get together and discuss toilets!


    LOL! laugh

    I wonder if you ever see a post like this on other forums...


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    I am wondering if someone can help me. I am looking at homeschooling my son due to alot of things going on with him. He is ADHD/ODD/Bipolar and now I found out that he has Aspergers Syndrome. He can't make it in the school system and has been sent to 6 different schools in 5 years. He does have an IEP but no one will talk to me about his problems. His teacher said he has one more time to get out of controll and then the police will pick him up and take him to JDC then once they have him there they will call me not before they take him. PLEASE HELP ME I don't know what to do.

    Thanks,
    Kimberly

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    Kim:
    Welcome, tell us more about your S.
    How old, what are his passions, what is his behavior like, etc..
    Ania

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    This sounds like a very frustrating situation. I'm sorry! frown

    If your son has an IEP, the school is required by law to serve his needs, and part of that should include talking to you.

    What have you done to try to communicate with the school? Have you called the school office to make an appointment to talk to the principal?

    You need to establish good communication with the school, even if you decide that you will eventually HS. In the meantime, while your child is in their care, you need to connect with the school. It's just something that must happen, especially if they're threatening legal action! I mean, it's clear that something isn't working here!

    Talk! Find a way, but get an appointment and talk!


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    As I think more about this I am hoping to start finding out about education opportunities sooner than later. My son will miss the kindergarten cut off by a few weeks and without waivers will not be able to attend until he is almost 6. At that point, I believe he will be so far ahead of where he needs to be if he continues at the pace he is on, that school will not be as fun as it should be. I have lots of time to figure it out, but I still have nervous nelly mommy syndrome!!

    I took a look online at our school districts policy on enrollment ages. They claim to have a strict 9/1 policy, although I haven't actually talked to anyone, I only looked at the website. My son has a 9/22 birthday, so he only misses by 3 weeks. The thing I really struggled with is that had he been born just prior to the 9/1 date, I could choose to hold him back a year, but I can not choose to accelerate him a year.

    The one loophole I did find is that if you enroll them in a Montessori and the Montessori is able to confirm he completed all kindergarten level work, he could start 1st grade the year he should start kindergarten. I feel on one hand that it is way too early to start thinking about these things, but on the other hand, I want what is best for my son! What's a mom to do...

    P.S. the last few days we have been enjoying a fun new game. We will be talking or reading or whatever and DS will ask what makes tree and have me spell it out for him. At this point he seems to just be taking it all in and there is not much response. I am excited to see where this one is going to go!

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    Kimberly,

    I�d be careful with these acronyms that they are sticking on your son. Edison was almost certainly �ADHD�: have you seen the book �The Edison Gene�? And Simon Baron-Cohen, an expert on autism/Asperger�s, declared in his book �The Essential Difference� that all of us theoretical physicists are Asperger�s � he specifically mentioned my own mentor, the Nobel laureate Richard Feynman. (Baron-Cohen was making the case for tolerance; he was not condemning physicists.)

    I don�t know your son, and he may have real problems and need real help. Or he may in fact be a perfectly normal human being who is sick and tired of being forced to fit into a square hole when he is not square. I�d compel the school to sit down with you and explain exactly and in detail what their understanding of the situation and of your son is. I�d also seek out some independent and sympathetic expert who can help evaluate whether your son is someone who really cannot function in normal human society and needs serious help or whether the kid is just not willing to tolerate the nonsense in the typical public school and needs a freer and more sane environment. I have a friend whose son is seriously autistic and who really does need a great deal of professional help. But a lot of this labeling is merely an attempt by bureaucrats to make children easier to intimidate and control.

    Incidentally, I�m a stay-at-home dad who has been homeschooling our girls from the beginning. One of our kids would probably be labeled ADHD. She�s really just an energetic, enthusiastic, bright kid.

    All the best,

    Dave

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    Hi mamabird,

    Welcome! Your kid reminds me so much of my DS4. I remember feeling anxious when I first started suspecting he is gifted, like I should be doing something extraordinary to provide appropriate stimulation and get him on the right educational track. I agree with other posts that at age 2, it is more important to just follow your child's lead and enjoy playing at his level. Children's museums are great. Internet is indispensable for answering unexpected questions ("uh... let's look up together why poop is brown and pee is yellow.")

    A tip from my experience: if you find yourself wondering if your child is slowing down and perhaps even losing some of his old skills, don't worry about it. DS4 always seems to take huge cognitive leaps (usually in the winter when we're indoors) and then slow down for months (usually in the summer when he is focusing on physical development). DH and I often find ourselves saying things like, "Wow, that kid is like Rainman; at this rate, he will be ready for 4th grade next year." And then a few months later, "Well, I wonder if he really is highly gifted after all. Maybe he is just obsessed with [math, reading, or whatever his topic of the month was at the time]. At this rate, other kids his age might catch up with him by the time he enters school." For instance, he took an avid interest in learning to tell time when he was 2.5 and then completely lost interest. Gradually, he seemed to forget the difference between the hour hand and the minute hand. Then, last month, all of a sudden, he demonstrated he can tell time as easily as any 2nd grader. I have no idea what got him interested again and how he figured it all out in his head all of a sudden (I think maybe learning multiplication recently got him interested in the minute hand). Same thing with reading. He could read at age 2 but stopped reading for almost a year and refused to read to me. I thought he had forgotten how to read. Now, he can read just about anything if the topic is interesting enough to him.

    Just to give you a taste of what to expect in the years to come, DS4 has now surpassed his 6 and 7 year old cousins in math and reading. He can tell you the 50 states (and most of their capitals) in alphabetical order and can locate just about any country on the world map (which I cannot do). He loves to tell anybody willing to listen how Germany used to be 2 pieces and now it's one piece again, and how there used to be a big wall in Berlin and it's all torn down now (just imagine the ridiculous interaction he often has with other 4 year olds at the playground). I am trying to enroll my DS4 in kindergarten in September (he just turned 4 so he will not be anywhere near age 5 then). I scheduled an evaluation for him next month, which is required for early entrance. I don't know if he will cooperate. He is very strong willed and, to use Kriston's categorization, definitely the obsessive type who likes to pursue his own narrow interests and not easily get distracted by what others are doing. Unless the examiner frames every question in the context of geography, numbers, natural disasters, or how the human body works, he might just refuse to answer the questions! We will see... smile

    I AM worried about his academic future. He is so unusual and I'm afraid schools usually are more accommodating of children who are mentally retarded than mentally gifted. Maybe that's how it should be in a world where resources are limited... but it certainly doesn't seem fair to my child.

    Toddler years are really fun. Enjoy! And feel free to come on this board and brag when you are bursting to tell somebody about your child's amazing talents. I can't wait to hear more about your son's new accomplishments (and maybe some unusual problems) as he grows! smile

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    Thank Junior!! These are the things I really needed to hear. We just took DS to the Children's Museum today. He absolutely LOVED it!! By the time we left he was so tired out that he fell asleep before we got out of the parking ramp. smile

    A funny thing happened though. We were at one of the displays and there were letter cards (kind of like what you would find for dressing room numbers) on pegs. He had taken a whole bunch down and was lining them up. Eventually we decided it was time to start putting them back up. He would pick one, I would ask him what letter it was, he would tell me and then hang it back up where it belonged in front of the same letter. A lady was kind of watching over our shoulder and asked me how old he was. I told her 2 and she kinded of scoffed, gave me a dirty look and walked away. It was as if I was doing something wrong by having a 2 year old that knows their letters. Sounds like this is pretty normal though from what I have read here....

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    Hey mamabird - I'm so glad your DS liked the Children's Museum. It was always a good place to go if I wanted to make sure my DS would sleep on the ride home. But what a rotten lady you encountered! Seems like she only asked how old he was so she could scoff. I feel so sad for you - we lucked out and got the curious and amazed comments until DS turned 4.

    I think you said you were in the twin cities. Your son might enjoy Monday mornings at the science museum: http://www.smm.org/playdates/

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    Thanks st pauli!! I think he would love that. Overall the day at the children's museum was very fun and I am not going to let one rotten lady ruin my day! Thanks for the link, we will have to try that some day soon.

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    St. Paul has a great electricity museum!


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    My DS LOVED the science museum as a preschooler. And still does of course! Even more than the children's museum. We spent a lot of time in the dinosaur room! My DD3 loves the dinosaur room too. They also have great kid's programs and summer camps, even for preschoolers. My daughter is going to her first one this summer!

    I used to get the eye roll for my DS ALL the time when he was 2 to 3. He was always trying to disassemble stuff. And he was usually running or climbing! He rarely showed his stuff out in public. My daughter loves to show off for the public though. People comment on her all the time and her vocab.

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    Somehow this is reminding me of taking DS11 to the local amusement park as a preschooler. The folks who were in charge of strapping him in would always comment that he was more interested in the mechanism of the seat belts than he was in the ride itself. ((smile))

    That seemed like a 'sweet quirk' at the time. I had no idea what was in store for him!

    Grinity


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    Originally Posted by Grinity
    St. Paul has a great electricity museum!

    I think you're talking about the Bakken Museum, on Lake Calhoun in Mpls. You're right, it is fabulous! ok, i used to volunteer there, so i'm a bit biased. wink I've been trying to find a good day to bring DS4 there.

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    Yes, that's it! DS and I took the bus, and I enjoyed the walk to from the bustop as well.


    Coaching available, at SchoolSuccessSolutions.com
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    You all are awesome!!! I am so thrilled to be able to share my stories and get information and advice from people that actually understand what I am going through. Thanks again!!

    Originally Posted by Grinity
    DS and I took the bus, and I enjoyed the walk to from the bustop as well.

    P.S. Right now my DS's dream in life is to ride a bus, so I think that is going to be one of our upcoming adventures!! We could probably just ride the bus and that would be thrilling enough for him. smile

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    LOL! When DS6 was 2 and obsessing about cars, a walk through the parking lot was the best part of any trip, so i know what you mean about the bus ride.

    Ah, memories of simpler times...:)


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    Originally Posted by st pauli girl
    Kimck - our sons should get together and discuss toilets! We have an old-fashioned one, with the tank overhead and a pull cord for flushing, which has always been of great interest to DS4!


    Due to the current potty training, my son has now taken a serious liking to the workings of the toilet. He sat in the bathroom the other day for a good 1/2 hour with the top of the toilet flushing it to figure out how it works. Every time he would figure out something new, he would come running out excitedly to tell us. It was precious...

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    Wonderful! That's funny to call anything related to the toilet "precious!" Only on this site. wink Now, if you can somehow turn this situation into a potty training moment... hmmmm ("every time you use the potty, you may examine how it works!") I remember at potty training time, we talked an awful lot about where everything went down the line. Ah, so glad these are only memories!!

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    Originally Posted by st pauli girl
    Now, if you can somehow turn this situation into a potty training moment... hmmmm ("every time you use the potty, you may examine how it works!") I remember at potty training time, we talked an awful lot about where everything went down the line. Ah, so glad these are only memories!!


    Luckily, our potty training has been going very well. He said he didn't want to wear diapers anymore 3 weeks ago, so I put him in underwear Saturday morning. The daycare lady (who actually suggested we get serious about this when I told her about the diaper comment) was very leery when he showed up in underwear on Monday morning. In the 3 weeks he has had 4 accidents, 2 of which were while he was napping. We are still putting him on the toilet most of the time, but about 1/3 of the time, he is telling us when he has to go potty. I like your way of thinking though, forget sticker charts, just reward him with taking the top off the toilet!! smile

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    Hi Mamabird! I have a 2 year old as well (he'll be 3 at the end of July) and stumbled up on this place a couple of weeks ago in much the same manner that you have.

    I'm still reading more than posting, but I am learning so much from just perusing the posts and looking at all the experiences the vets here have had. It seems like a really great place.

    My son Graham is obsessed with books...words and numbers thrill him. Yesterday, he decided that the phone book was the new cool thing to flip though because of all those glorious numbers!

    Anyway, hello from another newbie!

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    Love the phone book story! laugh


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    Welcome on board Catherine!! I would love to hear more about your son. I love hearing stories about other "more than normal" kids that are the same age as my son. I think it helps to hear that you are not living in some strange universe and that, no, it is not normal for a 3 year to think that the phone book is an awesome thing. smile You will love having a place to tell your crazy stories that most people give you the "questioning eyes" for. Welcome, can't wait to hear stories of your smart little cookie!

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    Thanks for the kind words! As I am sure you can relate to, it's weird being Graham's mom these days.

    I am very active on a "birth club" message board, filled with women who all gave birth in July 2005, so all of our kids are the same age. there are about 150 women who post regularly. My son is the only one who is reading. Not just recognizing letters, but reading whole books. Ten Apples Up on Top is a new favorite. His favorite toy is a calculator with big, over sized buttons that my sister-in-law bought for him.

    It can be very isolating, but also very exciting at the same time. Every day and with every conversation I have with him, I come around more and more to the reality that he is a very different kind of little boy. And he probably always will be very different. As much as I want to unequivocally encourage his intellectual growth in whatever direction it takes him, I also REALLY want him to be happy, socially.

    So I am feeling my way around as an advocate with him...every day presents a new challenge. Last week it was trying, without seeming boastful or delusional, to convince the children's librarian at our local library that I needed help finding early reading books for Graham. She sort of blew me off until she saw him sight reading with her own eyes. Her reaction made me laugh.

    Mamabird, I know our kiddos are young, but have you begun to consider how you are going to handle school? I think about that almost daily and really wonder what the right thing to do is.

    Anyway, I'm rambling. Hello to you and glad to see you here!

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    Originally Posted by CatherineD
    As much as I want to unequivocally encourage his intellectual growth in whatever direction it takes him, I also REALLY want him to be happy, socially.


    Yup. It's just that for GT kids, the intellectual growth is usually required for the social and emotional development to occur. These kids just aren't happy if they're not learning.

    Despite what the rest of the world thinks, the kids who take calculus at 12 or whatever are rarely doing it because their parents are pushy stage-mom types. They're doing it because they HAVE to do it in order to be reasonably happy people who aren't impossible to be around. Most of us parents are being dragged forward kicking and screaming, not trying to make these kids go faster!

    I know my long-term goals for my DS6 are for him to be a happy, healthy (emotionally as well as physically), productive member of society. But to be happy and emotionally healthy now, he must be challenged, and I am pretty sure it will always be that way for him.

    It's good that you can smile at the librarian. I hope you continue to keep that great attitude. smile Some days it's easy and some days it's...not. Attitudes toward GT kids vary so wildly in the real world. Some people are downright weird about them. Even some people who should really know better.

    Anyway, hi! laugh


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    Hi Catherine,

    I really like manipulatives for your son's age. We had these little plastic bears of two different colors.
    There are so many ways you can play with them to develop number sense.
    Your son will probably love to play math games using them.

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    Originally Posted by CatherineD
    Mamabird, I know our kiddos are young, but have you begun to consider how you are going to handle school? I think about that almost daily and really wonder what the right thing to do is.


    Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately), I have. My son was born 3 weeks after the kindergarten cut off in our District. Previously they had been very strict about this date and wouldn't even consider early entrance kindergarten. Now however, they have a system in place where if your child attends preschool and there preschool will give a recommendation they can be considered for early entrance. At that point they would do testing more complex than the normal kindergarten screening to decide if they are indeed ready or not.

    He currently goes to an in-home daycare, as I work full time. I have been looking into preschools/Montessori schools in the area as I think that early entrance is probably going to be the best first option for us. My son is actually very good socially and I am hoping this will help him in the public school system. He loves going to daycare and playing with other kids. At this point I am kind of taking a wait and see approach. It feels like he is learning new things all the time and asks such amazing questions and retains whatever it is that we give him for an answer. I still keep thinking that maybe it will slow down and I am worrying about nothing. (Anyone smelling some serious denial)

    How about you Catherine, have you though about schooling yet?

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    Originally Posted by mamabird
    I still keep thinking that maybe it will slow down and I am worrying about nothing. (Anyone smelling some serious denial)

    <sniff, sniff>

    Yup, that's what it smells like, mamabird! grin

    I feel compelled to give my standard warning about preschools: they can promise you the moon to get you in the door, but that doesn't mean that they have any comprehension of GTness, that they'll recognize it when they see it, or that they'll give your child what s/he needs. They also tend to feel less compelled to actually teach a child anything because it's "just" preschool. The old saw "Just let him/her be a kid" is common in pre-K, unfortunately.

    A non-academic pre-K can work well if the child has the time to explore academic interests outside of preschool. That means that half-day in a non-academing setting is probably better for most HG+ kids than full-day. Pre-K becomes social time, not "school" per se.

    Montessori can work if the teacher gets the child and allows him/her to advance. Some do a wonderful job with this and are a great start to the school years. But please be aware that some say they start a child where s/he is, but they don't live up to their promises.

    We had terrible luck with this for the first half of DS6's 4yo year of Montessori pre-K. DS was reading books quite proficiently and had been reading books for the better part of a full year, so I asked if they would start him where he was or if he'd have to jump through all the pre-reading hoops. They promised me the moon, but they started him at pre-reading anyway. I advocated gently for MONTHS! But it wasn't until DH joined me at the Jan. parent-teacher conference and insisted that they shape up that the school FINALLY got it and moved him up.

    DS progressed quickly after that, but their midterm report on him is laughable to read now. They thought he was BEHIND in the area of language arts because he never did anything in the LA area. Well, no, not if you're making him do things he could do half his life ago! Duh! DH and I still call any hoop that must be gotten through but is far below a child's developmental readiness a "letter box," after the Montessori teaching tool that the school wouldn't let DS skip. It was a really frustrating year.

    I'm not alone in this sort of negative experience, though some here love the Montessori experience for their kids, so it all depends completely upon the particulars of school and teacher. <shrug> Just be aware that any highly academic preschool could be trouble if they are unprepared for a child who is so far ahead of their curriculum. You need more than promises that they understand. You need them to deliver!

    FWIW, I'd probably pick a non-academic half-day pre-K over a highly academic all-day one unless I was SURE my child's needs were completely understood and would be supported at the academic pre-K. If they don't understand LOGs, I think you'll have trouble.

    Maybe that helps some...I remember how hard it was to choose that first pre-K program, and that was when I was still deep in GT denial. If I had realized that DS was HG+, I think I would have been just about paralyzed!

    If we can help, just ask! smile


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    We are also making the best out of a Montessori school situation. Although it's not a classroom utopia I highly agree with the statement that it's about the teacher and not as much about the school. My son has asked and receiving harder work.

    Our most recent example is with the division board work that they recently brought out. The children get a piece of paper with 5 problem and they must solve them using bunnies and giving each bunny the correct amount of eggs to divide to total number of eggs equally. My son quickly grew tired of the repetitiveness of the activity and started asking the teacher for harder problems with remainders instead of doing the problems with whole number answers. This is one simple way that they are able to use the same materials for all the children but make my son's more challenging.

    *On a side note I am doing a happy dance since finding out that the one teacher who doesn't really get my son is leaving at the end of May. That was one of the hold ups about sending him there for next year. Since it was a small school with only 3 teachers--this one teacher was weighing heavily on my decision.


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    You are crushing all my easy plans Kriston!! smile

    ...although I had a feeling someone would probably pipe up and tell me this.

    We actually have a Montessori school near our neighborhood that sounds very good. My mom works in the school district here (she was a teacher for about 15 years and now she is a "coach" for the teachers). Several coaches and teachers that she works with send their kids to this Montessori and they love it. Granted, I don't think their children are at the level my son is at, but it is somewhat encouraging to me. I really don't know what to think.

    One of my friends at work has a 12yo daughter that they just found out is PG. She knew all along that she was different, but never knew how different she really was. She is strongly encouraging me everyday to start thinking about these things and researching possibilities. It seems like so much to think about when my son is only 2 1/2.

    You all don't know how much you have helped me already, and I will continue to come back for more! As we delve further into this process I am sure I will have lots of questions to ask, so thanks for the offer Kriston. smile

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    Originally Posted by mamabird
    I still keep thinking that maybe it will slow down and I am worrying about nothing. (Anyone smelling some serious denial)

    Yes, yes, yes. *raises hand, waving wildly* Ahem.

    The school thing absolutely scares me to death. To. Death. For all the reasons Kriston went into.

    Right now, I work full-time and Graham goes to a Goddard School...which is an private daycare/school that is NOT entirely play based. They do a bit of academic curriculum with the kids and actually have a certified private Kindergarten. I have met with the directors and we have had very frank discussions about Graham. They seem confident that they and their teachers can do a differentiated curriculum for him beginning this fall (they are about to go into Summer Camp mode which is play and field trips and not much academics at all). The school tells me that they had a GT student go through their Kindergarten class several years ago and have had experience doing differentiated plans for GT kids. My plan is to ask for that student's parents name/number and try and talk with them about their child's experience at this school.

    It's all so overwhelming and school decisions seem so far away, but they are not at all. I need to wrap my brain around the fact that he's not my wee baby anymore and figure out what to do.

    It's overwhelming.

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    Originally Posted by CatherineD
    The school thing absolutely scares me to death. To. Death....

    It's all so overwhelming and school decisions seem so far away, but they are not at all. I need to wrap my brain around the fact that he's not my wee baby anymore and figure out what to do.

    It's overwhelming.


    I am so glad I am not the only "crazy mom" freaking out about school that is still 2 years away. DH and I were actually going to try to conceive another this fall, but have put those plans on hold until we have a better grasp of what we are going to do with schooling for DS. It feels a bit extreme, but we finally came to the conclusion that DS makes our life a bit extreme! smile

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    Oh, I really, REALLY hate to be the one to stomp all over your safe little GT denial! BTDT, and coming out of the comfort of that denial into the cold light of reality is no fun!

    But let me reassure you that you are SO MUCH FURTHER AHEAD than I was! When DS6 was 2.5yo, I was nowhere near realizing what was up with him. I thought he was "just" MG and would be easy to guide through school. But knowing what you're in for is really half the battle. You can be prepared. I wasn't. Honest, you're doing great, mamabird! laugh (And you, too, Catherine!)

    My best advice is to talk to the school a LOT! Ask a lot of questions and listen hard for what they're not saying. Visit the school more than once. Don't accept the pat answers that all schools like to give out.

    Once you've developed a good repoire with the school, bring up the verboten topic of GTness in a vague way. Ask if they have had kids who are well ahead of their curriculum in the past and can you talk to the parents of those kids. Don't start here, and only introduce the word GT to the discussion when you've found out all else that you need to know, since many educators brand you as "one of those parents" and tune you out immediately when you say the word GT. Sad, but true.

    I did really none of these things, and it's why we had the trouble we had with pre-K. DS6 still enjoyed preschool, so it's not like it was a total loss. It was mostly social for him, and that was useful. But I wish I had come out of my GT denial earlier, and I wish that someone had given me the advice I just gave you.

    You two are doing great! Don't let my gentle cautions worry you. laugh


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    I 2nd Kriston's vote. You 2 are WAY ahead of the game! Just take it 1 day at a time. And I know this has been said before on this board, but it really seems to think best in 6 month segments of time. Even schools themselves can change a lot in 2-3 years.

    And siblings make great peer playmates! DS7 and DD3.5 are great together (most of the time anyway). They really "get" each other. When #2 was born, it was definitely time for DS to no longer be the "center of the universe".

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    I was going to post this in the "cool stories" thread, but decided that due to the denial in my previous post it would be appropriate to post it here.

    My son's daycare lady has her late husbands old rusty truck parked on the side of her driveway at her house. Last week DS2.5 goes running into her house and says, "Oh no B, you need to get your truck out of the rain!! Your wheels are oxidizing."

    I have to remind myself of these things when I am having my denial moments!


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