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    #101474 - 05/05/11 01:08 PM MAP growth
    Percy Offline
    Member

    Registered: 12/11/10
    Posts: 170


    My DS7 just finished his spring MAP testing. His Reading MAP is 225 and his Math MAP is 223.

    Over the last two years of school his Reading MAP has increased 53 points – 50 points were from fall to spring of each year (31 points growth for 09-10 and 22 point for 10-11 and 3 points were for summer growth (growth from spring 2010-fall 2010). Kids at his school are ability grouped for reading.

    Over those same two years, his Math MAP has increased only 34 points – 13 points during the school year (7 points for 09-10 and 6 points for 10-11 and 21 points during the summer.) Although DS did mid year grade skip this year (1st-2nd), there has been no other acceleration or ability grouping for math. On the WJ III Achievement given in 11/10, his Broad Math was 147. While my DS has always been verbal and loves to read, we believe he is more gifted in Math.

    So, I am wondering what is going on with the Math growth. Here is my explanation and I hope others can give their thoughts – just so I can have a check on my thinking.

    For reading, he has had significant school year growth because he is taught fairly close to his readiness level and with peers with the same ability. Although we read a lot in the summer, no one really talks with him about parts of speech, grammar, etc. so his summer growth was what might be expected for a K-1st grader who received no additional instruction in reading over the summer.

    My DS spends much of the summer with my DH who teaches high school Algebra to students who struggle in Math. Many of my husband’s students, unfortunately, have MAP scores near our DS. My husband LOVES Math and although he provides no structured curriculum, they spend a lot of time talking about Math and many of the teaching techniques my husband has developed to help his struggling students he shares with our son who, being the sponge that he is, soaks it all up in minutes. Conversely, during the school year, I do not believe he has learned one thing that he did not already know about Math even with a grade skip. All of this explains the summer growth and the lack of growth during two school years.

    Any thoughts regarding what I think is going on?

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    #101487 - 05/05/11 04:28 PM Re: MAP growth [Re: Percy]
    st pauli girl Offline
    Member

    Registered: 01/29/08
    Posts: 1917
    I think that's a fairly reasonable guess for why the math isn't going up so quickly. But I'm also thinking that the huge growth in reading isn't average - those seem like big jumps to me (though I'm no MAP expert - inky hopefully will jump in!) But I can also see how the reading would jump up higher at your DS's age, because the reading materials at his level are probably getting more interesting and he has probably been exposed to more rules of grammar to increase his scores there. I'm guessing that there was not a whole lot of that in kindy.

    My DS had a bigger jump in math after we switched to a school that taught math the next grade up, so he was exposed to more things he wouldn't have been before. Since the MAP really is just testing what you know, if you are not exposed to it, you cannot improve much.

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    #101488 - 05/05/11 05:09 PM Re: MAP growth [Re: Percy]
    Percy Offline
    Member

    Registered: 12/11/10
    Posts: 170
    Thank you SPG – I guess that is my point. If he was exposed to Math at his level, he would grow at a similar level as Reading especially because we believe he is naturally stronger in Math.

    Of course, I realize that the reading growth is unusual and I really don’t expect to see as significant jumps as time goes by, but I would expect that his Math and Reading scores would increase more than the typical growth for each year if he was taught at his readiness level. And I think we should be allowed to expect that the school can give him at least as much growth in Math for two years of school as my DH can in the limited time they spend in the summer.

    We are planning for next year and we really want to be on solid ground for advocating for Math. He will be in the GT cluster next year and we are working on coming up with a few ideas on how the school/we can provide a better curriculum match for him next year in Math.

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    #101492 - 05/05/11 05:50 PM Re: MAP growth [Re: Percy]
    st pauli girl Offline
    Member

    Registered: 01/29/08
    Posts: 1917
    Originally Posted By: Deonne
    And I think we should be allowed to expect that the school can give him at least as much growth in Math for two years of school as my DH can in the limited time they spend in the summer.


    Well, that would be a nice thing to expect, but I don't think realistically that happens very often. When your DS is with your DH, that is one-on-one tutoring, compared with being in a classroom full of other kids at various levels.

    I think you are doing absolutely the right thing trying to come up with ideas for the school for next year. The GT cluster may provide more appropriate instruction, but if not, your DS would be able to move along at his own pace using some online curriculum, such as Aleks or EPGY. Since your school does use MAP, hopefully your DS will be placed with others who have similar scores and hopefully they plan what they will teach based on what those MAP scores are.

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    #101503 - 05/05/11 08:15 PM Re: MAP growth [Re: Percy]
    inky Offline
    Member

    Registered: 10/10/08
    Posts: 1299
    Can DH do afterschooling with him in math to keep him challenged? The summer math sounds like what the authors of "Developing Math Talent" recommended. That makes sense for why the greatest growth in math is during the summer.

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    #101505 - 05/05/11 08:35 PM Re: MAP growth [Re: Percy]
    Cricket2 Offline
    Member

    Registered: 05/11/09
    Posts: 2172
    Loc: Colorado
    I do also think that reading is easier to progress in even in the presence of inadequate instruction if the child reads a lot. I've always said that dd12 picks up language arts (reading and writing) by osmosis. She's almost never been taught anything in LA that she doesn't already know yet she's always made great strides in that area b/c she loves to read.

    Math isn't something that most kids are exposed to informally throughout the course of just living. Of course it does play a part in a lot of things, but most kids aren't using it just to function. They're not the ones who buy the groceries, figure out how big the box surrounding the swing set needs to be if the slide is 12 feet long and attached to a playhouse that is 10 feet off the ground, etc.

    Even with great natural ability, in the absence of some instruction, most kids likely won't make as much progress as they could in math. Unfortunately, some schools will use the lack of amazing math achievement scores as proof that the child doesn't need more accelerated instruction rather than proof that they haven't been instructing the child to his level of ability.
    _________________________
    Study Strategies for Accelerated Learners

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    #101546 - 05/06/11 08:56 AM Re: MAP growth [Re: Percy]
    Percy Offline
    Member

    Registered: 12/11/10
    Posts: 170
    Inky - my DH does do some afterschooling much like the summer schooling but our DS also does several extras i.e sports, acting, enrichment classes that our PTA sponsors, etc. My husband runs an after school program several days a week for his own students which is why we are trying to find a way to be more efficient with the actual instruction time.

    Cricket - I don't think the school will use the scores as proof that our DS does not need accelerated instruction in Math - I think at least the principal recognizes what is going on. I also think it is hard to argue that because in reading where he is at his instructional match, he does really well and he did have significant summer growth in math. We regret now that we were not a little more on top of this as even without the numbers we knew that he was not being exposed to much instruction at his readiness level. But we did have the grade skip and other things going on and it is hard to keep pushing and pushing the system. I am hopeful for next year as I think the school is going to be open to some more creative ideas for our DS.

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    #101571 - 05/06/11 01:41 PM Re: MAP growth [Re: Percy]
    inky Offline
    Member

    Registered: 10/10/08
    Posts: 1299
    Originally Posted By: Deonne
    But we did have the grade skip and other things going on and it is hard to keep pushing and pushing the system. I am hopeful for next year as I think the school is going to be open to some more creative ideas for our DS.

    It may be worth asking for additional subject acceleration in math. The 225 in reading is at the 98% for end of 3rd grade and the 223 math is at the 95% for end of 3rd grade. Add in the broad math score and I think you can make a strong case for him.
    Here's the link for the norm data:
    http://pickens.it.schoolfusion.us/module...8ebc39c6e6bc9c3

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